TCR Australia 2022

[one five five]

Any word on next years calendar. Will TCR, S5000, TA and TCM still be with Shannon’s or will Shannon’s become little more than proddies and old Porsche’s?

[bathurst77]

I hear J Moff wont be back in Trans am.... not 100% onthat

[2 litre Touring Car Star]

Well, here's a start.

https://www.speedcafe.com/2021/12/09...HfW_4h4vN90K_0

[Mixer]

You'd think with a dearth of large commercial backing and the series needing to stand on it's own two feet, that Shannons provides a lower cost than running on the Supercar card.

[Alan52]

Originally Posted by Mixer

You'd think with a dearth of large commercial backing and the series needing to stand on it's own two feet, that Shannons provides a lower cost than running on the Supercar card.

I think with the ownership crossover we are going to see a lot more of Supercar drivers competing in both TCR and GT.That means keeping their calendars separate.

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by Alan52

I think with the ownership crossover we are going to see a lot more of Supercar drivers competing in both TCR and GT.That means keeping their calendars separate.

If we are competing for the same eyes is it not the best approach?

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

[2 litre Touring Car Star]

When I have a crack at some on here saying that they're not really interested in racing, I can see it causes some offence.

But you can see from Mixer's comment above, there is reason to have the opinion.

He talks about TCR like it's another sport. It reminds me of the way I hear AFL identities downplay the NRL.

It's wrong.

[Mixer]

Calendar announced:

1 Symmons Plains Tasmania February 11-13
2 Phillip Island Victoria March 18-20
3 Mount Panorama (Bathurst 6 Hour) NSW April 15-17
4 TBA NSW TBA
5 Queensland Raceway Queensland August 5-7
6 Sandown Victoria September 16-18
7 Mount Panorama (Bathurst International) NSW November 11-13

SA & WA premiers paying for their border games?

Glad to see Symmons, PI & Sandown there - excellent tracks for these cars.

They put on a show at Symmons, but perhaps for the wrong reasons

Thoughts?

[one five five]

Very spaced out calendar, not sure if that’s good or bad. Presumably SMP is the TBA date.

As the final round is listed for Bathurst international, that makes it pretty clear that 2-driver TCR 500 is off the table again.

I don’t like going to Bathurst for two sprint rounds in only a 7 round calendar

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by one five five

Very spaced out calendar, not sure if that’s good or bad. Presumably SMP is the TBA date.

As the final round is listed for Bathurst international, that makes it pretty clear that 2-driver TCR 500 is off the table again.

I don’t like going to Bathurst for two sprint rounds in only a 7 round calendar

Yeah - big gap in the middle isn't there?

Maybe they've focussed on Bathurst not just because it's a special place but also because they feel more secure with lockdowns etc by running there?

Interesting that TCR isn't (so far) going to The Bend either - at this stage no TCR or Supercars there, wonder if there'll be a Shannons round there at all? Possible that it's all under negotiation of course but it does make you wonder what's behind it.

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by one five five

As the final round is listed for Bathurst international, that makes it pretty clear that 2-driver TCR 500 is off the table again.

Is this just purely competitors ruling it out on a cost basis?

Originally Posted by one five five

I don’t like going to Bathurst for two sprint rounds in only a 7 round calendar

I tend to agree.

You wonder why they don't take the opportunity to even do a 3-hour enduro on the Saturday of one of the other events or something. New Showroom Showdown.

Other than running costs, is there resistance to make changes to the cars for endurance running?

Surely even their own class at the 12 hour or something would be worthwhile.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

When I have a crack at some on here saying that they're not really interested in racing, I can see it causes some offence.

I get a bit P'd off when I see some people make stupid comments and they have never sat in a race car and would not have a clue about what happens. That anyone shows an interest in the sport at any level is a plus because the sport is slowly becoming less relevant in todays world.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

When I have a crack at some on here saying that they're not really interested in racing, I can see it causes some offence.

This statement sums up a lot - your posts have a crack at some [people], and not the posts themselves.

Why does a post have to be 'at' someone? You also note that the posts cause some offence - maybe consider the tone if they are offensive?

[Umai Naa]

Originally Posted by Mixer

Is this just purely competitors ruling it out on a cost basis?



I tend to agree.

You wonder why they don't take the opportunity to even do a 3-hour enduro on the Saturday of one of the other events or something. New Showroom Showdown.

Other than running costs, is there resistance to make changes to the cars for endurance running?

Surely even their own class at the 12 hour or something would be worthwhile.

Most teams struggle to afford to keep cars running for 3 hours of tracktime over a whole weekend.

There's a fair bit of difference between a sprint racing TCR car, and an endurance-spec TCR car. Not many constructors offer them. Not outside of the big three (VAG, Honda and Hyundai). However, it really depends on how the endurance race is laid out.

There are endurance-spec engines and gearboxes, electrics packages, and refuelling setups. All seemingly expensive items.

Honestly, outside of teams subsidised by a benefactor or the promotor, no one else is going to bother.

TCR Benelux. before the promotor went bust, had kind of the right idea. A mixture of privateers and hired guns, 4 sprint races, 2 drivers per car, both drivers did two races, and somehow an overall podium was detirmined. 2-driver deal, mixed up fields, and no additional expenses around re-configuring cars for one race a year. They did two full seasons of that, so perhaps over-gimmicky? But for one weekend a year, worthy of consideration.

[cavvy]

Originally Posted by Casper

I get a bit P'd off when I see some people make stupid comments and they have never sat in a race car and would not have a clue about what happens. That anyone shows an interest in the sport at any level is a plus because the sport is slowly becoming less relevant in todays world.

Not so sure about the relevance. Sport seems most relevant at its highest level, be it F1 or Supercars & that is not unique in Aus sport more generally.

TCR is looking for a niche & as a motorsport enthusiast I hope it can make the grade in very difficult times. Based on what I saw at Bathurst it is not a procession, good racing, so the pieces are there IF its management can fund it to build the image of its main players.

What is the significance of the Bathurst International to see out the 2022 program ? Will we see some of the internationals, factory drivers?

[2 litre Touring Car Star]

Originally Posted by Casper

I get a bit P'd off when I see some people make stupid comments and they have never sat in a race car and would not have a clue about what happens.

You guys who've got experience racing have got to be careful. Because depending on the level, you could still be in the same boat as someone who hasn't raced.

I mean, Derek "Honda is not a real manufacturer" Warwick showed last night that you could be a 10 year F1 driver and Le Mans winner, and still have no idea.

Originally Posted by Casper

That anyone shows an interest in the sport at any level is a plus because the sport is slowly becoming less relevant in todays world.

This is incorrect.

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

This statement sums up a lot - your posts have a crack at some [people], and not the posts themselves.

Why does a post have to be 'at' someone? You also note that the posts cause some offence - maybe consider the tone if they are offensive?

Some of Mixer's posts are a reflection of a lightweight motorsport culture he buys into, in that Australian racing is 5 litre V8 Ford and Holden at all costs. It's BS.

Australian motor racing really should be an "Australian flavoured", egalitarian, bite-sized European motorsport culture. It was the case but now is so entrenched in Ford/Holden 5lt due to vested interest, that this country has lost the plot.

If there's any offence, it's clear to me that it's primarily due to those people who have never bothered to think of an alternative view. Other people wouldn't care and/or get the point.

[one five five]

Originally Posted by Tourer

Yeah - big gap in the middle isn't there?

Maybe they've focussed on Bathurst not just because it's a special place but also because they feel more secure with lockdowns etc by running there?

Interesting that TCR isn't (so far) going to The Bend either - at this stage no TCR or Supercars there, wonder if there'll be a Shannons round there at all? Possible that it's all under negotiation of course but it does make you wonder what's behind it.

Originally Posted by Mixer

I tend to agree.

You wonder why they don't take the opportunity to even do a 3-hour enduro on the Saturday of one of the other events or something. New Showroom Showdown.

Other than running costs, is there resistance to make changes to the cars for endurance running?

Surely even their own class at the 12 hour or something would be worthwhile.

Originally Posted by Umai Naa

Most teams struggle to afford to keep cars running for 3 hours of tracktime over a whole weekend.

There's a fair bit of difference between a sprint racing TCR car, and an endurance-spec TCR car. Not many constructors offer them. Not outside of the big three (VAG, Honda and Hyundai). However, it really depends on how the endurance race is laid out.

There are endurance-spec engines and gearboxes, electrics packages, and refuelling setups. All seemingly expensive items.

Honestly, outside of teams subsidised by a benefactor or the promotor, no one else is going to bother.

TCR Benelux. before the promotor went bust, had kind of the right idea. A mixture of privateers and hired guns, 4 sprint races, 2 drivers per car, both drivers did two races, and somehow an overall podium was detirmined. 2-driver deal, mixed up fields, and no additional expenses around re-configuring cars for one race a year. They did two full seasons of that, so perhaps over-gimmicky? But for one weekend a year, worthy of consideration.

Whether the fans, sponsors or competitors buy it or not I don’t know, but i feel like given the last two years, TCR needs to almost adopt a “year one” strategy for 2022, and perhaps they are. S5000 possibly needs to as well.

Focus on the east coast, perhaps spreading the calendar out will allow the grid to build over the year, no enduro’s etc… after two years of lost momentum, they need a season to get their feet again I think. Whether time permits though?

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

This is incorrect.

It isn't.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by one five five

Whether the fans, sponsors or competitors buy it or not I don’t know, but i feel like given the last two years, TCR needs to almost adopt a “year one” strategy for 2022, and perhaps they are. S5000 possibly needs to as well.

Focus on the east coast, perhaps spreading the calendar out will allow the grid to build over the year, no enduro’s etc… after two years of lost momentum, they need a season to get their feet again I think. Whether time permits though?

Both TCR and S5000 definitely need to do that - 2022 is a new start for both, after any momentum from their initial starts has been lost through virus times.

I don't see them throwing around the large amounts of money that they did during their initial starts and I agree - sticking to East Coast, allowing plenty of prep/turnaround time between races is a way to assist competitors and a "walk before they run" approach that is needed this time.

It is almost inevitable that any series throwing large amounts of money around as a means of starting up is going to suffer a dip when the spending eases back - in some ways covid world has spared ARG from that dip due to the enormous hole covid created.

ARG now can aim to get going in a more conventional way and build a good foundation for their future plans.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

You guys who've got experience racing have got to be careful. Because depending on the level, you could still be in the same boat as someone who hasn't raced.

I mean, Derek "Honda is not a real manufacturer" Warwick showed last night that you could be a 10 year F1 driver and Le Mans winner, and still have no idea.


This is incorrect.



Some of Mixer's posts are a reflection of a lightweight motorsport culture he buys into, in that Australian racing is 5 litre V8 Ford and Holden at all costs. It's BS.

Australian motor racing really should be an "Australian flavoured", egalitarian, bite-sized European motorsport culture. It was the case but now is so entrenched in Ford/Holden 5lt due to vested interest, that this country has lost the plot.

If there's any offence, it's clear to me that it's primarily due to those people who have never bothered to think of an alternative view. Other people wouldn't care and/or get the point.

This post is an example of the point you make of not looking at and tolerating a view that differs from yours. Thanks for making the point.

[2 litre Touring Car Star]

What are you getting upset about?

The attachment to the 5litre V8 and/or Ford v Holden myth in Australia is BS.

I cannot support it when it's inherently wrong, but people talk about it as if it's a fact.

The attachment at all costs to 5litre V8s by vested interests in Australia probably contributes to your worry wart posting of motor racing overall.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

What are you getting upset about?

The attachment to the 5litre V8 and/or Ford v Holden myth in Australia is BS.

I cannot support it when it's inherently wrong, but people talk about it as if it's a fact.

The attachment at all costs to 5litre V8s by vested interests in Australia probably contributes to your worry wart posting of motor racing overall.

I am just pointing out that you are the epitome of what you criticise and that is no tolerance for other views that are not the same as yours. Sorry mods, delete this if you see fit, I see a troll amongst us and I won't post on this matter any further.

[Just Do It!]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

The attachment to the 5litre V8 and/or Ford v Holden myth in Australia is BS.

I cannot support it when it's inherently wrong, but people talk about it as if it's a fact.

How does the TV viewership and the at-track attendance compare?

Why not do a true apples for apples comparison and bring the TCR circus to NZ for a stand-alone round at Pukekohe like Supercars do? That will give everyone a true read, surely

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

Some of Mixer's posts are a reflection of a lightweight motorsport culture he buys into, in that Australian racing is 5 litre V8 Ford and Holden at all costs. It's BS.

Thinking it is BS is a valid opinion. But please expand on why it is BS - or justify why the posts reflecting that culture are incorrect rather than aim comments at the person (Mixer).

[2 litre Touring Car Star]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

Thinking it is BS is a valid opinion. But please expand on why it is BS - or justify why the posts reflecting that culture are incorrect rather than aim comments at the person (Mixer).

Just to begin with as I don't want to write an essay and then have you ask me more questions.

- Ford v Holden rivalry is an antiquated rivalry and is perpetuated by an outdated notion.

- 5litre V8s are outdated engines for touring car racing. They now only belong in GT racing, or other speciality classes, and lower level racing.

- Despite some wild and exotic cars in their various histories, Touring car racing fundamentally for white bread cars. What gets lost down here is that Ford Falcons and Holden Commodores are white bread cars that were beefed up for racing.

- What's not recognised, is that when touring car racing gets a spike of popularity, it's when it's comparable to what's on the public roads of the prospective country. Over here, we're still stuck in the 80s, early 90s, over a notion of professionalism and supposed superiority.

- Supercars is a closed shop for vested interests at all costs, where the ATCC should be egalitarian.