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Old 27 Sep 2021, 14:01 (Ref:4075908)   #2176
Sodemo
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Sodemo should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSodemo should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSodemo should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSodemo should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
The cars are just too heavy now, they look slow and lumbering in slow corners compared to cars from decades ago. Make them 100kg lighter and mandate shorter wheelbases by 400mm.
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Old 27 Sep 2021, 14:44 (Ref:4075919)   #2177
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We have had some absolutely great races this year. Can we not close this thread, as it is no longer relevant.
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Old 27 Sep 2021, 15:21 (Ref:4075927)   #2178
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Originally Posted by steve_r View Post
We have had some absolutely great races this year. Can we not close this thread, as it is no longer relevant.
If we closed every thread where the subject is no longer relevant, the mods would be very busy.......
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Old 27 Sep 2021, 16:07 (Ref:4075943)   #2179
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Taxi645 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridTaxi645 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I think if you look at the reasons why this season is more interesting then the previous ones I would list the following:

1 Two teams at the top now, with a very tight and fierce battle between their first drivers. (I think the latest aero rules helped here, kudos to the FIA, Liberty).
2 The old king vs the new challenger story
3 Top teams are now also more budget limited which has an continuously increasing impact on the competitiveness of the field. (again kudo's to FIA/Liberty).
4 The field always gets closer after a longer period of stable regulations.

On that last topic, of course one could say why change things again? However the new regulation do try to fix the long standing issue of cars needing able to drive close enough around each other. This is a change that was necessary and we just need to get through it.

I think the FIA and Liberty are on the right path with the regulations. They will just take more time to come to full effect, but the first benefits have already become visible this season.
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Old 27 Sep 2021, 16:25 (Ref:4075954)   #2180
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Originally Posted by steve_r View Post
We have had some absolutely great races this year. Can we not close this thread, as it is no longer relevant.


though may be time to start looking at the last couple of years to see what conclusions we can draw about why the racing was better/has been getting better.

- Covid added a bunch of tracks F1 hasent seen for a long time and thus teams were not prepared to the Nth degree for them.

- back to back races at the same venues and altered race weekend formats.

- travel restrictions meant smaller groups of staff traveling at at each event.

- movement towards reduced budgets.

- carry over of an old chassis and a partial freeze on development allowed the field to get closer together. starting to see the mid field catch up to the top teams on occasion now.

the last one for me i feel is the best lesson...why does F1 need a new car every season?

extending the development cycle across a couple of seasons may be the ticket.

rather, every season we hope they will solve the aero/following problem and every year they fail to. maybe the issue is just as simple as saying they fail because these creative engineers are never given enough time with the same set of cars to solve the problem?

nothing is ever that simple of course but an idea worth examining more imo.
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Old 27 Sep 2021, 16:29 (Ref:4075956)   #2181
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Originally Posted by Taxi645 View Post
I think if you look at the reasons why this season is more interesting then the previous ones I would list the following:

1 Two teams at the top now, with a very tight and fierce battle between their first drivers. (I think the latest aero rules helped here, kudos to the FIA, Liberty).
2 The old king vs the new challenger story
3 Top teams are now also more budget limited which has an continuously increasing impact on the competitiveness of the field. (again kudo's to FIA/Liberty).
4 The field always gets closer after a longer period of stable regulations.

On that last topic, of course one could say why change things again? However the new regulation do try to fix the long standing issue of cars needing able to drive close enough around each other. This is a change that was necessary and we just need to get through it.

I think the FIA and Liberty are on the right path with the regulations. They will just take more time to come to full effect, but the first benefits have already become visible this season.
was typing out an idea along similar lines to yours and missed your post.

you beat me to it!

also looking forward to see if the new rules can add to what has turned out to be some unexpected positive outcomes from the covid situation.
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Old 27 Sep 2021, 20:53 (Ref:4075986)   #2182
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I think - 2001 season.

The suggestion was that the lowest driver in the table is not allowed to return the following year. Alonso was the lowest (full-season) driver in 2001 and so would have been excluded in 2002.
As it was, that is effectively what happened (test driver in 2002), and he returned in 2003 - got three podiums including a win and the rest, as they say, is history.

So - the future suggests that Mazpein will be a test driver in 2022 for Alpine, and in 2024 win his first WDC driving for them.
Ah yes that makes more sense, thanks! It also highlights my stupidity lol.

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If we closed every thread where the subject is no longer relevant, the mods would be very busy.......
New thread: "How do we fix tentenths threads?"
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Old 28 Sep 2021, 06:29 (Ref:4076039)   #2183
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Casper should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridCasper should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by steve_r View Post
We have had some absolutely great races this year. Can we not close this thread, as it is no longer relevant.
Only by circumstance and not for anything resembling systemic lasting changes. Ferrari are on record saying their testing has shown the aero wake problems will not be resolved so don't expect too much in cars being able to follow close enough to overtake without DRS.
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Old 28 Sep 2021, 11:22 (Ref:4076071)   #2184
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Ah yes that makes more sense, thanks! It also highlights my stupidity lol.



New thread: "How do we fix tentenths threads?"
With a needle, I guess......
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Old 28 Sep 2021, 12:40 (Ref:4076087)   #2185
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With a needle, I guess......
Are you sure that's not 'with some needle'?
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Old 28 Sep 2021, 13:02 (Ref:4076093)   #2186
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That could be true too....
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Old 2 Oct 2021, 12:35 (Ref:4076649)   #2187
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I guess this only matters if you still watch it, if you have pretty much moved on from f1 as I did when the hybrids came in you dont see an issue.

I think F1 is very much the emperors new clothes and has been for quite some time, I dont understand why people pay so much money to watch it, why people leave brilliant jobs to work there and why there seems to still be an endless fascination with it. But hey I must be wrong obviously.
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Old 3 Oct 2021, 13:47 (Ref:4076826)   #2188
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I don't watch cricket, but I don't feel the need to go on cricket forums and tell people that I think the short forms of the game are the Emperor's New Clothes.

I could say that about an awful lot of sports, actually. Or bands, or authors, or movies, restaurants - the list is almost inexhaustibly long. But I don't.
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Old 4 Oct 2021, 06:34 (Ref:4076893)   #2189
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The cars are just too heavy now, they look slow and lumbering in slow corners compared to cars from decades ago. Make them 100kg lighter and mandate shorter wheelbases by 400mm.
You are right, but I'm not sure where you would remove the weight. Most of the weight is either safety, like the halo which is quite heavy, or hybrid gubbins. Both of which entrants (OEM vehicle manufacturers) consider necessary.

3600mm for 2022 was the shortest wheelbase F1 teams were willing to agree to (this is only around 30-70mm shorter than 2021, in 2021 of course there is no restriction on wheelbase length in the regulations), the FIA & Tombazis wanted 3400mm but the teams rejected this regulation.

Fun fact: until '72 there was no restriction on car width in the regulations (2.15m was then specified as it was the widest car which was the McLaren), and until '76 (the infamous Ligier JS5) there was no restriction on car height in the regulations! Hell, until the Williams FW07D prototype of '81, there wasn't even a maximum of four wheels, nor was four wheel drive (or more) banned. Many of the regulations were quite reactionary.

Last edited by V8 Fireworks; 4 Oct 2021 at 06:48.
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Old 4 Oct 2021, 07:29 (Ref:4076895)   #2190
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Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks View Post

3600mm for 2022 was the shortest wheelbase F1 teams were willing to agree to (this is only around 30-70mm shorter than 2021, in 2021 of course there is no restriction on wheelbase length in the regulations), the FIA & Tombazis wanted 3400mm but the teams rejected this regulation.
A classic case of the inmates running the jail. Personally I think the current cries from fandom to reduce weight is just a populist thing because someone thought it was a good idea. F1 seems prone to populist ideas for some reason, when Kubica returned the furore and comment soon turned to silence after he did not perform as everyone said he would.
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