[LM24] The changes to Le Mans

[Geva racing]

If you had to choose between the worst loved things that happened at Le mans which changed it forever. Which would you choose?

[paulzinho]

Well I may not be the most informed person but how about, 'All of the above'?

[Heeltoe6]

the deletion of Maison Blanche section and the adding of the chicanes

[Kpy]

What about the ridiculous chicane before Dunlop - done for 'bikes not cars?
And was White House really infamous, any more than the old pits?

[Aysedasi]

Gotta be the chicanes. I will never, ever forget the first time I experienced the sight and sound of the cars at full chat along the Mulsanne while peering over the fences at the Restaurant des 24 Heures (at night!).

(Agree with Kpy about the Dunlop Chicane though. Maison Blanche was really before my time, so I'm not so qualified to comment, but any change for the sake of it is to be deplored).

[Kpy]

With you all the way Aysedasi, Henri Pescarolo said that putting the chicanes in was sacrilege. You can get a very good idea about White House from the film Le Mans - or just stroll down to the corner (now just the public road again) next time you're there.

Who's up for the Historic 24 hrs on the full circuit 21/22 Sept 2002 ?

[Adam43]

I think the addition of those chicanes. unfortuantly my first year at Le Mans was 1990! So I never got to see it before...

[rdjones]

The introduction of the chicanes at Mulsanne, is the worst thing they have done at Le Mans. It would be nice to see the current cars going flat out down the stright.

[Speedworx]

I would say, none of the above.

The worst thing to happen is the flattening of the hump.

[Kpy]

Originally posted by hakkiman
I would say, none of the above.

The worst thing to happen is the flattening of the hump.

If you say so, but compared with the chicanes on the straight, the chicane at Dunlop (put there only for the bikes) and the loss of White House - well that's your choice. When did you first go to the race?

[paulzinho]

My Dad says the chicanes have ruined the kink.

I remember him telling me that it would take about 4/5 laps before you realised it was flat.

First time through you'd think, **** thats a corner!!
Then you'd shift down,
Then just brake lightly,
After that it was flat and when you'd done it once you'd always do it.

One of the best moments in racing, I only just saw what maison blanche was like from an onboard 1956 footage a moment ago and it looked quite good.

[Speedworx]

Why go to the race?

You see more on tv. Unless the race is on an oval, I'll stay at home.

[Kpy]

Originally posted by paulzinho
My Dad says the chicanes have ruined the kink.

I remember him telling me that it would take about 4/5 laps before you realised it was flat.

Sure it was flat - in almost anything - but Chris Craft told me the problem was working out where and when exactly to turn the wheel at night.

[paulzinho]

i think the trick was to turn in early anyway, but at night i'm not sure, i'll try and find out.

[Kpy]

Originally posted by hakkiman
Why go to the race?

You see more on tv. Unless the race is on an oval, I'll stay at home.

You mad ? - Tell him Aysedasi.

No, dear couch potato it's much better on TV. You stay right there and watch the whole thing from the comfort of your own home.

[Kpy]

Originally posted by paulzinho
i think the trick was to turn in early

I think the trick was to remember where to turn in.

[Kpy]

Originally posted by hakkiman
Why go to the race?

You haven't answered my question yet

[Speedworx]

What question?

[paulzinho]

Isn't there a party atmosphere which adds to the feeling of a spectacle. I'm gonna go one year, mark my words!!

[Aysedasi]

Sorry I'm late back on this, Kpy - just got back from taking nipper to his canoeing lesson - what a parental hero I am!

The simple answer is - if you don't go, you'll never know just what you're missing. If you never saw the full Mulsanne, or the proper Dunlop Curve, or the old Maison Blanche, equally, I guess, you'll never know what you missed. (Although you're right of course, Kpy, there's some great Maison Blanche footage (and footage of Mulsanne and Dunlop as well) in the Le Mans film).

Far be it from me to denigrate oval racing (never seen an oval race, so you're just as entitled to say to me "you'll never know what you're missing...."), but Paulzinho is absolutely right, the atmosphere of the race and the circuit, particularly during the night (as I tend to say, over and over again - boring, boring....), really is something else. You will never appreciate that atmosphere, no matter how much of the race is televised, unless you make "the pilgrimage".

[Aysedasi]

By the way (I don't need any excuse to talk about Le Mans - as most of you will have realised already!), no-one has commented on Geva's other alternative of the switch from Group C to 3.5 litre.

Initially, of course, this was a disaster, resulting in a smaller than usual grid in '91 and a pathetic turn-out in '92. Others may have their views, but there seemed to be only two justifications for the change:-

1. To encourage other manufacturers to make 3.5 litre engines, so these would in turn become available in F1, and
2. To hand the playing field over to Peugeot.

Porsche, of course, had the upper hand with the 956 and 962 in the 80's until first Tom Walkinshaw and Jaguar turned up and then Sauber with Mercedes. (I think the ACO still record the '89 "Mercedes" vistory as a Swiss Sauber success - something which certainly amuses me!). It was a great shame that the big showdown in '88 never happened because of Niedzwicz's accident in practice, but the Mercs (sorry, Saubers) blew Jaguar and the semi-works Joest 962's away in '89.

Funnily enough, I heartily enjoyed the '92 and '93 races, because I thought the Peugeots and, even more so, the Toyota TS010s were fantastic cars. Nevertheless, I still don't think the switch from Group C to 3.5 litre was really justifiable.

Having said all this, the ACO's desperate situation in '92 led to the arrival of real GTs in '93, and look what has happened to GTs since then.

The real answer to the worst thing to happen at Le Mans (in my 16 year's experience) was in 1992, 1995 and 2001. Bloody rain!!

[Kpy]

Originally posted by hakkiman
What question?

When did you first go to the race?

[Kpy]

Originally posted by hakkiman
What question?

When did you first go to Le Mans? (see above)

[Kpy]

Sorry for the double post - computer playing up

[paulzinho]

Triple post...