Formula Jedi at Cadwell Park

[Johnson]

Hi halecmini. Would be a shame if the championship became Formula Cheque Book as it was put in place as an alternative, if you like, to some championships that can cost you your house. However this is motorsport and whatever cost regulations you make, if people have got the money and enjoy being competitive then they will find somewhere to spend it. I think there should be a balance though.

[ActiveMS]

DaveC, it doesnt have to be that expensive.

Recently we have seen very little performance gain in engine tuning. JC and some others (Im starting to agree) think that all that is needed is a gas flowed cyl. head and a polish etc. High lift cams etc only shorten the life of the engine especially in cars. Add a set of flat slides and bobs your uncle. This is all that lukes running, and look how well he is doing this year. He probably has one of the smallest budgets in FJ this year.

There isnt much you can do to the chassis that makes a large different apart from that mk6 upgrade. But myself and John Lord arent running mk6 and JL is doing very well with his.

Admittedly, Ive spent alot this year (not as much as some, but still a fair amount). However most of these are long term investments like the 3 sets of lightweight wheels and two engines. I wish I had never gone down the tuning route as it has cost me two double headers.....doh!! Serves me right really.

We can chat through it at Oulton if you like and do a like 4 like comparison.

Look forward to seeing you at Oulton.

Finally got my racing starts sorted with the new engine. You'll be amazed how two identical engines differ when it comes to getting them off the line..... really weird.

[louis]

Dave

Unfortunatly the 1000cc jedi, is not a very strong car and a lot of the front runners are seeing their cars falling apart because more laod is going through the car hence the outcome is more vibration.

The other thing is the engineering on the engine Installation is not good. The r1 engine is just getting to hot. Oil temperature is over 130 degrees, their is no point doing any tunning as the engine is just losing power from the heat.

Even jedi dont know what the engine temperatures are. David hodgson blew his engine. The oil coming out the engines is black like diesel, the 600 was never like that! JC is keeping quiet over the relaibility over the cars.

thats my experience from the 1000cc car, i have spent fair amount of money this year and i know alot of the other front runners have this year as well. My dad is less than satisfied with the year so far

[diz]

Originally posted by jediracing
Anglesey outright record - 43.096 i think ive still got it

Anglesey is ideally suited to Jedi at present, but wait for the 2 mile plus version in the near future. The unofficial testing lap record on the current Anglesey layout is held by an F3. Many of the teams use Anglesey for testing and in a recent week long test, they were regularly in the 39s and I believe odd high 38s were achieved.
More classes / drivers should try it. It is a mega venue.

[UMBOP]

David hodgsons engine blow up was caused by the sight glass seperating from the engine! The 1000cc jedi is just as strong as a 600 have i missed something? I havnt seen many of the front runners cars falling apart as you put it!

[ActiveMS]

Louis,
Im not sure if I agree. The 1000's have been running for some time now and they dont exactly fall apart. I havent seen any cars DNF this year for simply too much load being placed on chassis (apart from driver enduced). One of my wheel bearings went this year, but it was over 5 years old. The new driveshafts should reduce the number of driveline failures.

Any bike engine used in a car will be put under more load than it would in a bike, especially the oil flow. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done. Baffling helps, but this is not a problem with the car, but more of engine design.

Honda engines are well known to be bullet proof in comparison with other engines like Yamaha and Suzuki, but most people when given the option will take the power over reliability.

Both you and DavidH are using injected R1's where most others are using carbed R1's. There is a learning curve with any new variation and you have chosen to run with an engine that has not had much time in the car in comparison with others, so you will suffer initially.

Not sure about the oil temp, but Im sure superbike teams will be having the same problems. I thought with the number of stack systems being used, there will be someone on the grid with an idea of oil temp.

Anyway, glad most of your gremlins have been and gone.... just cant stand all this hanging around for Oulton Park.

[Johnson]

With regards to the engine installation I suppose you could get the boys at Jedi to bolt your motor onto the rear wing to get better air flow to it Louis. Or you could try maybe fitting the factory rads, because I don't think that yours are efficient enough. Not a lot of the other 1000 guys seem to be having your problems. Why don't you ring Jedi as they will be happy to help you out instead of just knocking the car. And how can JC keep quiet about the reliability when everyone can see for themselves at the meetings? The poor bugger is there to help not hinder! Well, until he get's his invoice book out! The cars are'nt just falling apart as can clearly be seen at the races, I suppose it just depends on how much time is spent on them in between when race preping

[halecmini]

louis, think there were some comments there which wern't needed and just because you are having bad luck at the moment don't think the cars or jon need slagging off, we all know that Jc does everything he can to help anybody.... surely if your car is running that hot it would be a good idea to turn it off before it blows up?!?...and have a re-think.....just a thought.

[JustinDawkins]

Can't you guys run oil coolers?

[Johnson]

Yeah we run oil coolers. Nobody is running one on an R1 because I think the oil pump in the engine is'nt strong enough to pump it the extra distance. However you could probably do it if you used an external oil pump coupled up with an extra inlet and outlet on the engine. In fact Jedi have ordered some bits in for the job i think. The engines don't seem to be suffering too badly though. Bugger me....... I almost sounded technical!!

[SPBRacing]

We run Suzuki GSXR in our cars although not Jedi's. We found you need to run a Bike motorbike oil cooler as car ones don't work. We use the slabside oil cooler and temp stays around 90 on them all no matter how fast or long the race is. Also Ake has a K3 in his Jedi with a dry sump system all fitted by Jedi. They had some problems at first but know he runs it with out doing much work at all to it and he does use the car alot. As has just been said with every new variant you just have too work on it.

All I can say is get working and stop knocking people that work hard for the sport.

SPB

[louis]

The fact of the matter is that the engines are getting to hot, and their has to be a way of improving that, so engines last. How can the series go farward if we still using old carbed engines and not injection. No manufacture developes carburettor engines no more.

Their a few cars running oil temperature sensors in the series to what the temp really is, even jedi dont use one. Racing bikes are running no way near the heat levels that the jedis are getting.

I know we are looking at ways to improve the cooling on the engine, but we want cars to last and not blow up and end up at a scrap heap, as that is rather expensive.

[ActiveMS]

Louis, Talk to JC, he has a solution that will no doubt work. Sounds like you need to change your rads for the larger size and add an oil cooler like Ake's.

As we have all said, this year is the first time the injected R1's have been run so there will be teething problems.

I agree about having to move away from carbed engines, it is inevitable, but for the time being there are still a large number around. Until there is either a lack of spares or a significant power advantage in using injection then many will remain with what they have.

Next year Im still going to run with the older R1. Then, if I am still in jedi's then I will look to upgrade to which of the R1, ZXR or GSXR's are proving the most popular.

I'll let everyone else do the testing.

[ofarc]

Louis,
definately speak to JC, he called me yesterday to say he had ten new water pumps in that pump 25 litres a minute. Ake has one of these and it has sorted his overheating out.
Cheers Dax

[halecmini]

went to mallory this morning and blew up another engine....woops

[ofarc]

dave c,
what are you doing mate? where did you get the engine from and how old was it.
Dax

[Johnson]

The cooling has been improved on the 1000 engines. louis, your engine runs an intercooler so the water cools the oil. You need the factory radiators to cool the water better and in turn your oil temp will fall. You are running the wrong rads. The other injected engines seem to be ok because they are running the right kit, a couple are even having to blank off the rads to get the temp hot enough!

Now can we all have a minutes silence for Dave's recently blown motor.

[halecmini]

cheers frazer....

...it was the engine that was in dads car when it set on fire, thought it was ok but obviously not.... seemed absolutely fine for about 10 laps then went bang big style into gerrards, blew the started motor off and put a nice big hole in the case.... apparently the rest of it is still in the gravel trap.... just ringing around breakers now trying to find one... your man has still got one dax so i think i'll go get that tomorrow.... deep joy !!!

[louis]

Alright frazer, we know part of the problem, and going to rectify the situation. Jack Anderson does not run a oil or water sensor. But david hodgson does? you know what his temps are?

bit frustrating the overheating is making the engine loose power, so cant get the engine tuned, which is ****.

[Johnson]

Will find out about temps for you. give us a call geezer.

[marblerun]

Louis,
If you are taking your team down the scrap heap - can I recover some of your youth and talent. You proved yourself from the back of the grid at Croft - cool down and start winning.

[halecmini]

anyone got any ruff idea what kinda gearing is needed for rockingham? i spoke to jon he said he has only ever run a fireblade there and used brands gearing?!? but doesn't know about 600's as they've never ben there...!?!? anymore clues anyone? i've got mallory gearing on at the mo was thinking about just running that..???

[ActiveMS]

I gather the inner circuit at rockingham is very tight and twisty. So Brands gearing could be fairly close. I would go for that rather than mallory.

Unfortunately I cant make it this weekend, and Ive just been asked to be best man at a wedding on the 9th October.....bummer, means I may not get to experience rockingham this year at all

[louis]

Alright guys

Would just like to take this opportunity to apologies for my comments I made earlier in this thread. My comments were some what out of line and were very much out of frustration from cadwell park. I have calmed down now realised I was being acting like a fool.

Sorry if i have affended anyone and take this as an Apology.

Least it got people posting its all gone rather quiet.

[halecmini]

do think you were abit out of line... fair enuf... it has been very quiet tho i agree.... where is everyone? anyone going to oulton on the weekend? my lil bro is racing my car fingers crossed!!
Dc