Messing with / Fixing the 2011 Calendar

[Chatters]

OK, so...

I'm one of the no doubt majority of posters here who think that the no-testing-during-the-year rule is ridiculous. However, I can see the advantages it has in cutting costs, and the most simple reason I can put this down to is: Can you imagine HRT in 2010 having the available resources to test 9+ times during the year? No, and this causes an unfair undvantage which is the whole thing the FIA is trying to remove.

With that in mind, I thought I'd re-write a 2011 calendar which is fair. Fair to the teams that it gives them a chance to get some actual track running without seeing a large cost blowout; fair to the rookie drivers that it gives them a chance to avoid being dumped into a F1 car without any experience (see: Romain Grosjean), and fair to the fans, as it will give them more chances to see the F1 circus in action and more to discuss.

February
1st - 3rd: Testing, all drivers, Circuit Ricardo Tormo, Valencia, Spain.
10th - 12th: Testing, all drivers, Circuito de Jerez, Jerez, Spain.
13th: Testing, rookie drivers, Circuito de Jerez, Spain.
18th - 20th: Testing, all drivers, Autódromo Internacional do Algarve, Portimao, Portugal.
25th - 28th: Testing, all drivers, Bahrain International Circuit, Sakhir, Bahrain.

March
11th - 13th: Race, Round 1, Bahrain International Circuit, Sakhir, Bahrain.
25th - 27th: Race, Round 2, Albert Park Circuit, Melbourne, Australia.

April
8th - 10th: Race, Round 3, Sepang International Circuit, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia.
15th - 17th: Race, Round 4, Shanghai International Circuit, Jiading, China.

May
6th - 8th: Race, Round 5, Istanbul Park, Istanbul, Turkey.
20th - 22nd: Race, Round 6, Circuit de Catalunya, Barcelona, Spain.
23rd - 25th: Testing, all drivers, Circuit de Catalunya, Barcelona, Spain.

June
3rd - 5th: Race, Round 7, Circuit de Monaco, Monte-Carlo, Monaco.
17th - 19th: Race, Round 8, Circuit Gilles Villeneuve, Montreal, Canada.

July
1st - 3rd: Race, Round 9, Valencia Street Circuit, Valencia, Spain.
8th - 10th: Race, Round 10, Silverstone Circuit, Northamptonshire, England.
11th - 12th: Testing, all drivers, Silverstone Circuit, Northamptonshire, England.
13th: Testing, rookie drivers, Silverstone Circuit, Northamptonshire, England.
22nd - 24th: Race, Round 11, Nurburgring, Nurburg, Germany.
29th - 31st: Race, Round 12, Hungaroring, Budapest, Hungary.

August
4th - 6th: Testing, all drivers, Circuit de Nevers Magny-Cours, France.
7th: Testing, rookie drivers, Circuit de Nevers Magny-Cours, France.

September
2nd - 4th: Race, Round 13, Circuit de Spa-Francorchamps, Spa, Belgium.
9th - 11th: Race, Round 14, Autodromo Nazionale Monza, Monza, Italy.
23rd - 25th: Race, Round 15, Marina Bay Street Circuit, Marina Bay, Singapore.

October
7th - 9th: Race, Round 16, Suzuka Circuit, Suzuka, Japan.
14th - 16th: Race, Round 17, Korean International Circuit, Yeongam, South Korea.
17th - 19th: Testing, all drivers, Korean International Circuit, Yeongam, South Korea.
28th - 30th: Race, Round 18, Jaypee Group Circuit, Greater Noida, India.

November
11th - 13th: Race, Round 19, Yas Marina Circuit, Abu Dhabi.
25th - 27th: Race, Round 20, Autodromo Jose Carlos Pace, Sao Paulo, Brazil.

There it is! Feel free to discuss, criticise, edit etc.

[Tathrim]

Originally Posted by Chatters

OK, so...

I'm one of the no doubt majority of posters here who think that the no-testing-during-the-year rule is ridiculous. However, I can see the advantages it has in cutting costs, and the most simple reason I can put this down to is: Can you imagine HRT in 2010 having the available resources to test 9+ times during the year? No, and this causes an unfair undvantage which is the whole thing the FIA is trying to remove.

With that in mind, I thought I'd re-write a 2011 calendar which is fair. Fair to the teams that it gives them a chance to get some actual track running without seeing a large cost blowout; fair to the rookie drivers that it gives them a chance to avoid being dumped into a F1 car without any experience (see: Romain Grosjean), and fair to the fans, as it will give them more chances to see the F1 circus in action and more to discuss.

February
1st - 3rd: Testing, all drivers, Circuit Ricardo Tormo, Valencia, Spain.
10th - 12th: Testing, all drivers, Circuito de Jerez, Jerez, Spain.
13th: Testing, rookie drivers, Circuito de Jerez, Spain.
18th - 20th: Testing, all drivers, Autódromo Internacional do Algarve, Portimao, Portugal.
25th - 28th: Testing, all drivers, Bahrain International Circuit, Sakhir, Bahrain.

March
11th - 13th: Race, Round 1, Bahrain International Circuit, Sakhir, Bahrain.
25th - 27th: Race, Round 2, Albert Park Circuit, Melbourne, Australia.

April
8th - 10th: Race, Round 3, Sepang International Circuit, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia.
15th - 17th: Race, Round 4, Shanghai International Circuit, Jiading, China.

May
6th - 8th: Race, Round 5, Istanbul Park, Istanbul, Turkey.
20th - 22nd: Race, Round 6, Circuit de Catalunya, Barcelona, Spain.
23rd - 25th: Testing, all drivers, Circuit de Catalunya, Barcelona, Spain.

June
3rd - 5th: Race, Round 7, Circuit de Monaco, Monte-Carlo, Monaco.
17th - 19th: Race, Round 8, Circuit Gilles Villeneuve, Montreal, Canada.

July
1st - 3rd: Race, Round 9, Valencia Street Circuit, Valencia, Spain.
8th - 10th: Race, Round 10, Silverstone Circuit, Northamptonshire, England.
11th - 12th: Testing, all drivers, Silverstone Circuit, Northamptonshire, England.
13th: Testing, rookie drivers, Silverstone Circuit, Northamptonshire, England.
22nd - 24th: Race, Round 11, Nurburgring, Nurburg, Germany.
29th - 31st: Race, Round 12, Hungaroring, Budapest, Hungary.

August
4th - 6th: Testing, all drivers, Circuit de Nevers Magny-Cours, France.
7th: Testing, rookie drivers, Circuit de Nevers Magny-Cours, France.

September
2nd - 4th: Race, Round 13, Circuit de Spa-Francorchamps, Spa, Belgium.
9th - 11th: Race, Round 14, Autodromo Nazionale Monza, Monza, Italy.
23rd - 25th: Race, Round 15, Marina Bay Street Circuit, Marina Bay, Singapore.

October
7th - 9th: Race, Round 16, Suzuka Circuit, Suzuka, Japan.
14th - 16th: Race, Round 17, Korean International Circuit, Yeongam, South Korea.
17th - 19th: Testing, all drivers, Korean International Circuit, Yeongam, South Korea.
28th - 30th: Race, Round 18, Jaypee Group Circuit, Greater Noida, India.

November
11th - 13th: Race, Round 19, Yas Marina Circuit, Abu Dhabi.
25th - 27th: Race, Round 20, Autodromo Jose Carlos Pace, Sao Paulo, Brazil.

There it is! Feel free to discuss, criticise, edit etc.

This'll need some thought on my part, but I've got lectures this afternoon.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by Chatters

I'm one of the no doubt majority of posters here who think that the no-testing-during-the-year rule is ridiculous. However, I can see the advantages it has in cutting costs, and the most simple reason I can put this down to is: Can you imagine HRT in 2010 having the available resources to test 9+ times during the year? No, and this causes an unfair undvantage which is the whole thing the FIA is trying to remove.

Can anyone realistically imagine HRT being competitive in any form whatsoever at any point in the season?

With due respect they are simply a mobile chicane that is of no relevance to F1.

[Lancsbreaker]

Just a quick thought....I'd have thought that testing would be preferred before racing at a circuit, rather than immediately after a GP....

[duke_toaster]

That would make it more FP time though. I'd go for Monday tests if you want them at GP venues, or midweek if otherwise so third drivers can still do GP2/WSR/Sportscars. I'd add two two day tests as a start, with the first day of each just for test/reserve drivers. Possibly would add some mileage for junior drivers as well.

[Bononi]

Originally Posted by Chatters

OK, so...

I think that's perfect !

[cmotd]

Originally Posted by Chatters

OK, so...

I'm one of the no doubt majority of posters here who think that the no-testing-during-the-year rule is ridiculous. However, I can see the advantages it has in cutting costs, and the most simple reason I can put this down to is: Can you imagine HRT in 2010 having the available resources to test 9+ times during the year? No, and this causes an unfair undvantage which is the whole thing the FIA is trying to remove.

With that in mind, I thought I'd re-write a 2011 calendar which is fair.

Would anyone want to test at Silverstone or in Spain or in Korea on circuits they won't be back to for another year, in the next season, in a completely different car? Surely the testing should be before the race not after?

[fourWheelDrift]

Originally Posted by cmotd

Would anyone want to test at Silverstone or in Spain or in Korea on circuits they won't be back to for another year, in the next season, in a completely different car? Surely the testing should be before the race not after?

Testing and practice are different disciplines with different benefits for the team, the sport and the fans.

If you allow more "testing" at the circuit before the race this will simply be more practice time which the teams will use to produce an even more perfect setup for the race and will further close performance differences between cars and drivers leading to a more predictable less interesting race. This would be another nail in the coffin for F1.

Testing time after the race will be no use as practice time as the race will already be over so the teams will use it for trying new parts and developing the car's performance and their understanding of the car in a more general sense, this is what testing is supposed to be about and has the potential to allow the teams to get some testing at the lowest possible cost.

[Lam Pak]

easy fix. cancel bahrain. race 2x china.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by wnut

Can anyone realistically imagine HRT being competitive in any form whatsoever at any point in the season?

I think that with the people that they have currently designing and building the car, they have a very good chance of making a big improvement this season. Their budget appears to be not a problem. Indeed, they may be better off than some other teams.

Originally Posted by wnut

With due respect they are simply a mobile chicane that is of no relevance to F1.

No one knows that to be currently the case. Their "relevance" is that they show how difficult it is to compete in F1, but yet still managed to do it anyway. Are they actually any worse than Honda were in 07 and 08?

IIRC they weren't actually that far off the pace of Virgin and Lotus last season, despite not ever putting a single performance update on their car! Oh, and they beat Virgin in both championships!

P.S. This thread is about fixing the 2011 calendar.

Maybe Bahrain will get squeezed in at the end somewhere? BE will want to get his money somehow.

[Bononi]

Originally Posted by Lam Pak

easy fix. cancel bahrain. race 2x china.

The way things are going, soon we might have 4 or 5 races in China...

[Purist]

They'd have to build 3 or 4 more new tracks first, because Guangdong, Ordos, and Zhuhai are NOT going to cut it for Bernie.

[JABWOA]

Or allows teams unlimited laps without engine/gearbox/tyre restrictions/penalties on Friday mornings with a third car, for which ever driver they want (since all the teams are basically testing with only one car now anyway.)

[Teretonga]

I'm still waiting for Bernie to run half the races at Paul Ricard.
Line it with concrete walls and call it a street race at Valencia. Run another layout at night (Singapore) Put up Hollywood studio type facades, line one of its twisty layouts with Armco and pretend its Monaco.
Pick a fast layout and put up artifical trees around the edge and call it Monza, Pick another layout and cover everything with sand, call it Bahrain, put up fancy white facades around another layout and call it Abu Dhabi.

You could run 6 races in a six week period and keep it secret then play them all out later in the year.... just drop them in at an appropriate time to keep the championship race exciting....

It would also create more time for the teams and their personnel to spread their holidays out, less stress travelling, space the calendar better.

I'm surprised Bernie hasn't tried it already...

[Another Bob]

Apollo Program Moon landing conspiracy theory, love it!!!

Why only half the races, make it all of them, think of the energy miles you you save, it would make F1 the greenest motor sport in the world.

Bernie wouldn't want to do it at Paul Richard though as all the current F1 promoters and circuits go broke paying the fees!!!

[duke_toaster]

Originally Posted by Lam Pak

easy fix. cancel bahrain. race 2x china.

When they can't even sell out one race in Shanghai?

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by Another Bob

Apollo Program Moon landing conspiracy theory, love it!!!

Why only half the races, make it all of them, think of the energy miles you you save, it would make F1 the greenest motor sport in the world.

Bernie wouldn't want to do it at Paul Richard though as all the current F1 promoters and circuits go broke paying the fees!!!

Ah, but they all spend $200 million building circuits that lie abandoned for 10 months of the year.
Why not take the $200 million, pay Bernie $20 mil a year for 10 years for running a GP with your country/city's name on it at Ricard, and save yourself the headache of running a GP in your own country?

If Melbourne is costing the ratepayers $30 million a year wouldn't it be better to run the Australian GP at Ricard, pay Bernie $20 million for the fee and save all the hassle from the nimby's (Not In My Back Yard) and environmentalists etc back home.
A no hassle GP.....

[Yannick]

As Sakhir is off the list by now, the final test before the season opener was scheduled to be at Barcelona. But why that track? Every track that hosts a World Championship round should get an official test no often than once a year if at all. Barcelona is so over-tested that it's boring watching the race every year. And they did test at Portimao once.

And why that test at Yeongam, of all places? Yes, they are already there and do not need to travel for the testing only, but yet, why Yeongam and not, say, Jaypee, for example? If the Tilke circuits weren't so faceless, this question probably would not arise.

[chillibowl]

i think it could be interesting if they could instead of having a test get all the teams together and run a simulation/race with a different format and rules.

for example try out reverse grids and sprint races, experiment and tweak the movable rear wing rules, have a race which moves from dry to artificial wet conditions. do the things that people talk about but can never try out (probably for good reason) but just to get a sense of something different.

also in part inspired by the hockey and basketball skills competitions it would be cool to see drivers compete in various challenges like who can attack this series of corners the best, who drives best in the rain, and even let drivers exchange cars etc.

too late to have it in place of Bahrain (although they already s a global TV audience with no race to watch) but an event like this at the end of the year where they can celebrate the champion and have some fun.

or is this just too silly and would cost too much money? it sounds awesome in my head though.

[fourWheelDrift]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

i think it could be interesting if they could instead of having a test get all the teams together and run a simulation/race with a different format and rules.

for example try out reverse grids and sprint races, experiment and tweak the movable rear wing rules, have a race which moves from dry to artificial wet conditions. do the things that people talk about but can never try out (probably for good reason) but just to get a sense of something different.

also in part inspired by the hockey and basketball skills competitions it would be cool to see drivers compete in various challenges like who can attack this series of corners the best, who drives best in the rain, and even let drivers exchange cars etc.

too late to have it in place of Bahrain (although they already s a global TV audience with no race to watch) but an event like this at the end of the year where they can celebrate the champion and have some fun.

or is this just too silly and would cost too much money? it sounds awesome in my head though.

Surely this is what ROC is for, I enjoy ROC and would love to see it expanded with more challenges and more drivers but would hate to see it replace any more traditional motorsport.

[duke_toaster]

Originally Posted by Yannick

As Sakhir is off the list by now, the final test before the season opener was scheduled to be at Barcelona. But why that track? Every track that hosts a World Championship round should get an official test no often than once a year if at all. Barcelona is so over-tested that it's boring watching the race every year. And they did test at Portimao once.

I'd say that no circuit that hosts a race should be a test venue (apart from the young driver test), like I believe is the rule in NASCAR - test at Vallelunga, Barcelona and Jerez, race elsewhere.

Originally Posted by chillibowl

i think it could be interesting if they could instead of having a test get all the teams together and run a simulation/race with a different format and rules.

for example try out reverse grids and sprint races, experiment and tweak the movable rear wing rules, have a race which moves from dry to artificial wet conditions. do the things that people talk about but can never try out (probably for good reason) but just to get a sense of something different.

Intentionally wet races do sound a bit extra time multiball to me (although a sprinklered test session somewhere, I'd say MIRA if they could rig the place up right for F1, might be a good idea), but there is only one way to see how things like reverse grids would work in F1.

also in part inspired by the hockey and basketball skills competitions it would be cool to see drivers compete in various challenges like who can attack this series of corners the best, who drives best in the rain, and even let drivers exchange cars etc.

Some of those ideas are a little out there, although some form of F1 Pit Stop competition like the IndyCar one would certainly be a good fun thing to have on the Tuesday night before Silverstone somewhere in London.

too late to have it in place of Bahrain (although they already s a global TV audience with no race to watch) but an event like this at the end of the year where they can celebrate the champion and have some fun.

or is this just too silly and would cost too much money? it sounds awesome in my head though.

One idea that sounds equally awesome (for several reasons, including practical ones for the growth of motorsport) is some kind of World Cup event, think EFDA Nations Cup, but on a much higher level, but over a week in mid-December. Each nation to be represented by three cars. Obviously it would be a challenge to work out how to do it commercially (how would you get all the sponsors to agree - cars running in just national colours, drivers with race suits in national colours but normal sponsors?), technical regulations (SCCA Formula 1000 in my view should be the starting point for some New World Formula, and that could be the formula used for this initially), qualification (promotion and relegation like ice hockey), and a lot of other things.

[bella]

i love your ideas, d_t, lots of the time they're just totally unworkable but they definitely make me think sideways! top quality stuff.

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

One idea that sounds equally awesome (for several reasons, including practical ones for the growth of motorsport) is some kind of World Cup event, think EFDA Nations Cup, but on a much higher level, but over a week in mid-December.

in what ways would that make motorsport grow? do you mean in a showing f1 fans stuff outside f1 is great too way?

[duke_toaster]

Originally Posted by bella

i love your ideas, d_t, lots of the time they're just totally unworkable but they definitely make me think sideways! top quality stuff.

in what ways would that make motorsport grow? do you mean in a showing f1 fans stuff outside f1 is great too way?

That, as well as showcasing motorsport in countries where it's not so big. They might have not heard of any drivers since Schumacher, but give them three local boys in three cars in national flags. It would need a paradigm shift in motorsport, particularly my big bonnet bee - the great single seater mess. It's not totally unworkable though, it would just need the will to do it.

[bravo]

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

That, as well as showcasing motorsport in countries where it's not so big. They might have not heard of any drivers since Schumacher, but give them three local boys in three cars in national flags. It would need a paradigm shift in motorsport, particularly my big bonnet bee - the great single seater mess. It's not totally unworkable though, it would just need the will to do it.

Wasn't that A1GP?

[bella]

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

That, as well as showcasing motorsport in countries where it's not so big. They might have not heard of any drivers since Schumacher, but give them three local boys in three cars in national flags.

i just can't see beyond the reaction to a1gp on the idea of marketing a nations cup. ok, it was probably handled all wrong especially in the financial sector but on the face of it, everything was right. and still they struggled to get people to bite. i suppose a major limitation of that was that the cars were fast and single seatery, which does help attract a certain group but it creates practical problems. i suppose the best thing to do would be to put a roof on it!

i guess you have to look at the davis cup in tennis though - that works, but it doesn't at the same time.