New Schedule released by Champ Car

[2112]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

The playing field of oval racetracks in the past 10 years has changed. There were many more individual oval track owners we could do business with back then. But now most of these tracks have been gobbled up by a few cartels who are incestously entwined with Nascar. One only has to look at the stinky poo raised over champcars races at las vegas and phoenix by the nascar machine to make one realize these people are not our friends and business partners and we don't need to be racing on their tracks having terms dictated to us. We need to go and do our own thing, which we are, and not be raped by ISC, Nascar, etc.

It`s not like the series went out of their way to reduce ovals....

[luke]

Nope.

I miss the ovals to. I haven't been watching Champ Car racing as long as some of you guys so it’s easier for me to come to terms with things no doubt. I can understand what you're saying Greg. Especially with all of the Michigan races that you went to over the years.
But what Moutainstar was saying was right. I think I've said that a number of times now lol. But KK did say that Champ Car would return to ovals when the fans wanted it. We saw how difficult it was for Champ Car to race at Phoenix alone; imagine what it's like for the rest of the races. I hope in a few years that I'll be able to see Champ Cars racing around ovals again. Speedways, Super Speedways, one mile ovals, heck even tri ovals. We all know what ovals we'd love to see Champ Car race on it goes with out doubt saying;... Indy, Michigan, Pocono, Milwaukee etc...
2007 Champ Car is in the current phase of the momentum and re-creating this series and racing. Sure there are more street races then perhaps most people like but there are no down sides to them. Everything about them is good. I'm sure in the next few years; the CCWS will be back on many of the circuits fans loved.
Why do I believe this? The fact that KK reads many Champ Car forums, sites whatever, and so do other people involved in Champ Car. I remember seeing a tribute in one of those forums to a fan that had died. KK put a little note on the DP 01 at Road America as a sign of Champ Car has a family relationship with its fans compared to say F1 which is if anything an alien world when it comes to fans.
The very fact that they decided to bring back Road America, even though they were still trying to rebuild the series in this stage shows what could happen. 2007 will be the year. Let’s let them know what races we want to see in the future.

[Peter Ford]

It is good to see the series having a lot of races next year,now all we need are more teams coming in and it will be a GREAT SERIES again.

[botsquad]

very sorry they wont be racing on oval tracks.
very very sorry then wont be at seca.
but u cant blame them.
the street (party) races are money makers.

[tunnel45]

I will miss the ovals, but i liked them better when they ran them mid 90's and earlier. Watching Cart and then champcar at michigan was awesome. The iRL puts on a good show but as a racer and racing fan, the way open wheel runs ovals (minus INDY) is hug the bottom and flat out. Remember when an indy cars ran at Michigan and actually had a entry, apex, and exit in the turns? especially qualifying, they needed to let off during the lap. Watching micheal and mario and Nigel running diff lines through the years was awesome. Now the open wheel guys hug the bottom and stay flat at most ovals. Good tv, for sure but lacking in skill (still need a pretty big set of stones though . But the streets throw one heck of a party and even if they are a parade, hitting your brake marks 6-10 times a lap for 100 laps or so do give you something to appreciate and the true road courses are awesome. just need to sit by a big screen . IMO

[Chris - Melb]

I do not enjoy watching cars racing around in circles, so I will not miss the ovals at all.

Ovals do not seem to be particularly safe either and if they do not make economic sense then rightly they should stay off the calendar. Once they are off the calendar and the goodwill has been lost then I cannot see how they will ever return.

I can't see Champ Car subsidizing an oval event for the sake of tradition. Road America is an exceptional case [presuming it is being subsidized ] .

It's a shame for you guys that enjoy ovals, but there is always the IRL. I will have to go and wash my mouth out after saying that!

[Rob29]

Originally Posted by Chris - Melb

I do not enjoy watching cars racing around in circles, so I will not miss the ovals at all.

Ovals do not seem to be particularly safe either and if they do not make economic sense then rightly they should stay off the calendar. Once they are off the calendar and the goodwill has been lost then I cannot see how they will ever return.

I can't see Champ Car subsidizing an oval event for the sake of tradition. Road America is an exceptional case [presuming it is being subsidized ] .

It's a shame for you guys that enjoy ovals, but there is always the IRL. I will have to go and wash my mouth out after saying that!

Road America is certainly a road circuit.I think we have 3 separate sports here. IRL for the ovals,Champcar for the road & street courses and F1 for the 'Tilkedromes' ?

[JohnSSC]

This is a follow-on to macdaddy's post - a history lesson, not a judgement.

Before CART, USAC was the sanctioning body for "Champ Cars." The USAC series, with the Indy 500 as the Big Prize ran on dirt and asphalt ovals. The idea here being that the championship for the series would reflect skills on dirt and paved surfaces.

Please don't hammer me on dates, but I believe that a road race or two came on to the schedule in the '60s to reflect the growing popularity of Formula 5000 - a road-racing series whose driver ranks were populated by a number of top USAC drivers. Dirt and asphalt being two very exacting disciplines.

I recall that in the 70's (and I think this was under USAC), the show came to Brands and Silverstone and put on quite a show with one AJ Foyt getting his car airborne at certain points - really knocked the crowd out!

Anyway, when CART was formed there were mostly ovals with I believe two road races on the schedule. As CART developed it's own vision of a diverse field of drivers running diverse venues, we then had the CART many refer to as the idealized version of CART for a time: small ovals, the triple crown races, road and street courses and The 500. USAC continued on for a time running a primarily oval-based series.

We now have come (at least with the split) in the opposite direction with CC now being all road/street with the IRL reflecting a schedule that looks a bit like the early CART schedule.

[luke]

Your point is?

[mountainstar]

Also keep in mind demands and tastes change and evolve over time, so what was relevant 30 years ago may no longer apply. Certainly judging champcar not racing on ovals at the moment and the irl having terrible attendance at many of it's ovals, says to me there are not many Americans who want to see open wheelers on ovals. Attendance was so bad at some irl oval races it caused the collapse of nazereth and pikes peak.

[luke]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

Also keep in mind demands and tastes change and evolve over time, so what was relevant 30 years ago may no longer apply. Certainly judging champcar not racing on ovals at the moment and the irl having terrible attendance at many of it's ovals, says to me there are not many Americans who want to see open wheelers on ovals. Attendance was so bad at some irl oval races it caused the collapse of nazereth and pikes peak.

The thing is. When you look at what Champ Car gets on road Courses and especially steet races the IRL needs to up the game when attracting fans at their road races. Their attendance at St.Petersburg is very small considering its a street event and Sears Point contained many open grand stands...
My point being both series are going where the fans/people are which is street races. Ovals are expensive and a waste of everything IMO. If it wasn't for Indy there would be no more open wheel oval racing IMO. It's only a matter of time, and something we've known for only to long now.
I wouldn't be surpised if its half and half for the IRL next year. Something we wouldn't have thought we'd say for an all oval series at the time in a few years time and when it was half and half for Champ Car you wouldn't have thought there would be zero now...

[JohnSSC]

Geez, Luke! "My point is" simply that it was a history lesson! macdaddy brought up the old schedule with a question mark of sorts and I was trying to provide some historical background here for those born after 1990 or who may not have followed the formula prior to that time.

As I noted in the post I am not making a judgement that one or the other is better or worse. Just noting what it was - to me, there are interesting historical paralells in the ebb and flow of schedules, series rivalries (USAC vs AAA vs CART vs CC vs IRL) popularity of tracks (dirt over asphalt at one time, for example - then oval vs road and road vs street circuit) and assorted events that changed the outlook of the series such as F5000 coming on the scene and bringing road racing and more international drivers to the scene.

[rustyfan]

Speaking of dirt, imagine how cool it would be to see Champ Car at for example the Illinois State Fairgrounds or the DuQuoin State Fairgrounds

[JohnSSC]

Ahhh! The "good old days" return!

That would be cool to see. The car probably wouldn't last long, but what the heck!

[marcus]

they are getting new cars next year anyway so why not one last "squirt in the dirt" LOL

[mountainstar]

Watch the kiwi movie "smash palace". Steve Millen dirt tracked a formula atlantic car while running from the cops at over 160 mph on a public road out near Wairou. They jacked the ride height up as far as it could go and let er rip.

[JohnSSC]

Wouldn't mind seeing PT in a Sprint Car. Not sure how long he would last before he bumped into something, but I think he would be right quick before he did!

[rustyfan]

I wonder what sort of modifications would be needed, other than the obvious ones such as beefing up the suspension and increasing the ride height, to race a Champ Car on either of the tracks mentioned above. I'm sure it would be possible, even though it would require alot of work.

If the starts align we might get to see some Champ Car drivers on dirt in the future though, as Tony Stewart is trying to convince IROC to stage a race at Eldora Speedway. Obviously it'd require a schedule that works for the Champ Car drivers, but with a bit of luck they'd work something out (especially since Bourdais, IIRC, rather recently has said he'd love to get another shot at IROC).

[JohnSSC]

I know this is off topic, but as rough as a dirt track is, your basic CC car would be vibrated/bounced to death in short order even if you could raise the suspension enough.

An IROC race on dirt would be cool.

[paul-collins]

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

I know this is off topic, but as rough as a dirt track is, your basic CC car would be vibrated/bounced to death in short order even if you could raise the suspension enough.

No doubt you meant "carbon fibre formula car" where you said CC, John.

[marcus]

anyway as fun as that sounds lets get back on track with next years schedule shall we

[JohnSSC]

In retrospect there paul, I am not sure if I was trying to avoid saying "ChampCar car" or what - I like what you said better, so I will say that I was trying to say just that!

[indycool]

Still haven't heard the European Tour is a "go."

[luke]

Originally Posted by indycool

Still haven't heard the European Tour is a "go."

Long time no see?

Still haven't heard 'it's not gonna happen' either.

[Tim Northcutt]

Well...

They're in Mexico preparing to race...

Sounds like a good place to announce it during their season finale to prime the pump for next year with the excitement of two new venues in Europe...

I'm in PR...that would be a decent forum and rationale for doing it that way...

If the deals are done...