Archer Capital Gone

[S griffin]

I thought Tony did a good job and it's a shame he had to sell it off, but as you say, he hung in for as long as possible and one hopes that all his good work he has done is kept up to a similar if not better standard

[cavvy]

From The Australian:
Private equity outfit Archer Capital has taken the bulk of a $200m hit on the Supercars motor racing series, with a new ownership group set to take control in a deal representing less than one-third of its previous sale value.

... Supercars will be sold in a $100.3m deal to The Australian Racing Group consortium and the TGI Sport consortium, which have joined forces to form one proposal after earlier competing against each other. About $57m of the deal will go to Archer, which paid about $180m to take a 60 per cent stake in Supercars in 2011 that valued the series at about $305m.
The remaining $35m will flow to the team owners over the next few years, as part of their racing entitlement contracts (RECs).

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...3297f51f2cac78


Documents seen by The Australian show that Supercars recorded “EBITDA before appearance and grid fees” of $23.8m from $118m revenue in 2019, the last completed year of racing that was not interrupted by Covid-19.

[2 litre Touring Car Star]

Originally Posted by Casper

And yours in any viable business venture. SC along with any professional sport is firstly a business venture and nothing else.

While people/organisations milk money out of motor/sport, racing is a hobby within a supposed professional industry.

It's not a pure professional sport. Money/business skills/acumen are used because that is the means by which anything is done.

Originally Posted by cavvy

Tony Cochrane & SEL hung in, as long as it worked for them.

cavy challenging one five five for the most accurate comment on any motor racing topic on the web.

They only did anything as long as it worked for them. That is their legacy and that attitude still remains and is entrenched in the supercars industry.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

While people/organisations milk money out of motor/sport, racing is a hobby within a supposed professional industry.

It's not a pure professional sport. Money/business skills/acumen are used because that is the means by which anything is done.

What are you talking about? I said PROFESSIONAL MOTOR SPORT which limited my comments to just that. Trying to move the goal posts is a strange reply to a straight forward statement.

[one five five]

Originally Posted by 2 litre Touring Car Star

When you say "supercars" it also means "the fans" (Like the Mixer types?) who'd much rather Aus motorsport be as it is with supercars than have a wider, variable, egalitarian community/industry, which would have to involve other classes of racing, and not allow the "top tier" get so far ahead of everything else as create a clique/"powerbase and an.

Agree about the fans

The majority of Australian Motorsport fans have done nothing but prove how gullible and spineless they are over the last two decades

[Mixer]

Did you have an onion on your belt?

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[2 litre Touring Car Star]

Originally Posted by one five five

Agree about the fans

The majority of Australian Motorsport fans have done nothing but prove how gullible and spineless they are over the last two decades

Just a reflection of a smaller, less knowledgable motor racing community/culture.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by one five five

Agree about the fans

The majority of Australian Motorsport fans have done nothing but prove how gullible and spineless they are over the last two decades

Would you mind expanding on the spineless part? Without context it is a nothing statement.

[S griffin]

From what it appears, the Aussie fans are quite enthusiastic about their motorsport, while also expecting a decent standard of racing. So I don’t find them spineless at all

[bathurst77]

Im a motor sport tragic/anorak since the mid 70s (I thinki my user name gives away the game) but only as a spectator. Made many a haul to amaroo/oran/ecreek/bathurst over the decades.

I can quote chapter and verse on the championships and bathursts up to late 90s, but it ends there. I dont even know the names of all the drivers now and I dont like the current car (Its really 1 car with different engine and skin)

These days come race weekend I watch all the supports. I love Gt3 Bathurst 6/12 hrs, and the (ex) ARG series, but anything with the word super (car 2 ute etc) or stadium (truck) is an excuse to watch netflix or go light the bbq.

Ask me about f1/2/3 tho and I will bore you for hours.

I know a lot of old timers like me who feel the same. I think the new owners will have to work hard to keep supercars as the premier. Given they also own TCR, some multiclass hybrid of the two, (classes are good) or merge could be a path forward down the track.

[S griffin]

You've definitely seen a lot B77, so are more than qualified to give your opinion. Why did you give up by the late 90s?

There are still plenty of top quality drivers in the series and the cars still are great to watch, even if it is more standardised, although still with different makes

It has a great weekend package too. I think Aussie motorsport has done a brilliant job and Supercars is still king and probably always will be. No surprise considering how popular motorsport is down under, I mean the Oz GP has always been packed out

I hope the new owners continue the good work and don't squander it. I don't think going with TCR is the best solution, they work well separately, but we'll see what happens

[bathurst77]

Well Griffin, thank you for asking.....

Actually as im getting old the memory gets fogged... it wasnt mid 90s, it was mid 2000s when project blueprint came along..
Making it a parity formula through making the cars pretty much the same mechanically yet "pretending" to be what i consider to be a touring car (highly modified production based cars), i kind of lost interest.

I still kept an eye on it and watched when i could (never miss any racing on mt pan) but it went from a passion to something i would watch if i wasnt doing something else.

Then came COTF/gen2 and it was too artificial the one space frame chassis and underpinnings purpose design and built racing car, crate 5 litre v8 racing engines, with plastic "looks sort of like a commodore/falcon) claiming the touring car atcc moff brock heritage when it suited them, but they are closer to sports sedans.
At least sports sedans have many different wild crazy ycars, mechanicals and body kits
these strike me as "spec sports sedans" neither touring cars nor sports sedans.... aussie nascars

and with the availability of so many different catagories on tv these days, i found others suited my personal tastes better. im spoiled for choice, and found ARG categories appealed to me more.

(note guys, i havent bagged super cars... i know lots love them, and super cars took the class from a few teams running round pretty underdeveloped tracks to small crowds in the early 90s to the fully razzle dazzle prime time circus it is todayi. I just said "not my taste")


Things i dont like

v8 rwd altima, v8 rwd zb, hideously ugly mustang.

the fact that a car can race as a ford, then be sold reskinned new engine and its a hol.. buic.... psa or whoever makes that insignia

the reliance on ford vs gm, when holden are dead and ford cars (not suv/utes) are a bit player, two brands only, that dont matter anymore

the loss of the privateer and non professional battlers that can only do some weekends - but some become great


the lack of variety of cars and classes.
-
who knows maybe arg supercar common ownership and gen 3 and beyond cars or some driver or story will catch me again, Im watching eastern creek (ooops smp) practice now

[Mixer]

It's good to know that 8 or 20 years later you guys still watch and care enough to come and gripe about the old days.

You could go watch production based series like TCR, except the engines and gearboxes aren't production at all, some manufacturers use an engine that doesn't even come from it's own brand of car, and a bunch of the cars run the "series" engine which is the VAG unit.

Plenty of other things you could watch, and post about.

I ask again, did you have an onion on your belt?

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[Alan52]

Originally Posted by one five five

Agree about the fans

The majority of Australian Motorsport fans have done nothing but prove how gullible and spineless they are over the last two decades

I don’t understand this at all.
Can you give me an example of what a fan is supposed to do to show they have a spine?
What behaviours indicate a fan is spineless?
Asking for a friend.

[bathurst77]

oh go on mixer i will bite
Onion on my belt?

as i said my personal taste

i guess i cared if a heavily modified falcon could beat a heavily modified torana or commodore, and in the group a days the commodore was still there to hate , and there were the nissans bmw etc and classies, and they were still "production based" and the drivers i loved and hated moff brock bond dj grice richards seton were there.

now how can i care if they are just racing cars with plastic skin and as i put in another post, i dont know the drivers.

somebody once said to be a real fan of any sport, its not about having a team to love, its about having a team to hate. I hated the hdt/hsv, and now they dont exist... who should i hate now and why... i cant even find the enthusiasm to hate "son of hsv" wau or the traitors of 888..... well maybe a little... ok some... yeh i dont like them at all

[Mixer]

So WHY are you here to whine about something you don't like and don't watch?

The onion on your belt is old people telling a story that doesn't go anywhere.

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[bathurst77]

ok you young whipper snapper

i was asked so i told
im a life long mad crazy fan of all motor sport especially aust sedans and that track a few 100km west of sydney. and the category i grew up obsessing over has gone a way i dont like, and many i know agree, so i think im entitled to voice my concerns

maybe if we speak up, and they hear us and "tweak it" we might come back.
this is a place for discussion... so im discussing.... be kind of boring if every one said the same thing

[one five five]

Originally Posted by Mixer

So WHY are you here to whine about something you don't like and don't watch?

The onion on your belt is old people telling a story that doesn't go anywhere.

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Fans of the Australian Touring Car Championship aren’t allowed to complain about the current state of it?

Do you tell F1 fans of 40 years to go away if they complain about the modern engines or current car specs? Do you tell WRC fans of 40 years to go away if they complain about the current generation of Rally1 cars that only get ten to each event?

You can love a series while disliking the current direction of it, if the fans who didn’t like the current rule set just walked away you’d likely then just accuse them of never being a real fan in the first place?

Fans of the AFL, NRL, soccer etc etc regularly complain about aspects of their sports and those fans aren’t told to move along if you don’t like it by other fans

Why are Supercars fans, let alone Supercars management, so touchy about any criticism of the modern formula that all they do is whinge “if you don’t like it don’t watch it” rather than take criticism constructively, especially as the majority of fans who don’t like the current direction of the series are long time watchers of the championship

[bathurst77]

Most businesses are always extremely keen to know why loyal long term repeat customers turn away from them and start using a competitor.
If supercars doesnt, just the current customers, that could be part of the problem.

'Only tell s why you love us, not how we could improve"

[Mixer]

Seriously, someone said I haven't watched it for 30 years, I don't even know who is in it anymore. Literally pointless comment. Just whining for the sake of it.

Brock, Johnson, modified production cars. All the past. We can't have it back and even if we tried it wouldn't be the same.

If you like that racing, proddies or IP are awesome fun to watch.

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[gravin]

Originally Posted by Mixer

If you like that racing, proddies or IP are awesome fun to watch.

I used to like when prod cars were on the support list and given decent TV time in the late 80s to early 90s. The Winton 300 etc were good viewing. The current field is a little out of touch; there is even a Lotus sports car allowed.

I would be very happy if the returned to cost capped prod racing like the early 90s - when EA Falcon S vs Commodore vs Supra vs Pulsar SSS vs Corrolla GT vs Swift GTi etc.

Current top prod cars are expensive and limit who can race them - cost cap formula would level the field a bit more for closer racing IMHO.

[rich07]

And yet most of the people who harp on about returning the category to a more production based future have no interest in proddie cars or IP. Shrugs..

[bathurst77]

if you are referring to me Mixer read it again

I did not say I have never watched in 30 years i said about 10 years or so i went from a passionate never-miss-it fan to, watch it sometimes and never miss any race of anything on mt pan and why i and others i know feel that way

and i do watch proddy, ip and supports whenever i can - I actively search for racing and try all categories.

this is a discussion forum. be boring if every post were from people who think the same as each other.

[Mixer]

Discussion is fine but these rose coloured glasses posts are nothing but gasbagging with no point. You don't want anything that is on offer you just want to complain it isn't as good as it used to be.

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[one five five]

Originally Posted by rich07

And yet most of the people who harp on about returning the category to a more production based future have no interest in proddie cars or IP. Shrugs..

That’s not an accurate comparison though. Put SVG, Whincup & Anton in cars prepped by DJR, Triple 8 and walkinshaws and it would have much more interest.

It’s for the same reason that if you put an event on with just Super2 and Super3 races on, nobody would be interested in that either