[Driver] Vettel vs Webber: Round 2

[mattt]

Originally Posted by SSbaby

... and the contact with Vettel at Turkey is also quite vivid. If Vettel ends up losing the championship by 1 point, Webber doesn't need to be seen as the villain who denied his teammate the ch/ship....

but wasn't that Vettels fault

[Aysedasi]

Exactly - memories are clearly fading.......

[SSbaby]

Originally Posted by mattt

but wasn't that Vettels fault

Given Webber squeezed Vettel onto the grass, I'm not inclined to agree... and Webber's obvious dislike for his team mate tend to raise concerns about the motives behind his driving 'style'.

Those same concerns were also raised in Korea where he was accused of trying to take out other title contenders. I don't believe Webber's mindset is primed for the big prize. He's too distracted, atm, while the other protagonists seem to have a more "let's do it" approach.

[ASCII Man]

Webber didn't squeeze anyone there, he went straight ahead.
Vettel went for a gap that wasn't there, something that he tried to do again with Button in Spa, both with catastrophic results.

[dsg]

Originally Posted by SSbaby

Given Webber squeezed Vettel onto the grass.....

Memories are such imperfect things so you are forgiven.

[greenracer]

Good on you dsg for supporting Webber on the Hungry incident , Vettel was 100% to blame so if Mark loses the title he can turn around and blame Vettel for the 12 points that he lost because of Vettel's stupidity and inept attempts on overtaking moves. People forget that Mark would still be leading except for the Hungry incident.

[Knowlesy]

Do you mean Turkey? Vettel giftwrapped a win to Webber in Hungary.

[greenracer]

sorry turkey

[GTRMagic]

8 hours to go till the start... till we see RBR shown up by the Ferrari with the taxi cab-mileage engine

Potsie can still win the WDC, I just dont see RBR going out of their way to help him do it...

[Aysedasi]

Go Nico........

[SSbaby]

Originally Posted by dsg

Memories are such imperfect things so you are forgiven.

No need to gloat like your eye sight is superior. You can interpret the incident one of two ways. I think Webber was beaten and did his best to thwart Vettel's clear pass... and let's face it, Vettel's rear wheels touched Webber's front wheels when Webber's car was clearly angled toward the apex instead of the proper racing line.

Webber is too Vettel-centric. It's getting quite boring and he needs to move on. It's almost like he expects the championship to be gifted to him when there are still a few in mathematical contention for the title.

[Adam43]

Talking of needing to move on...

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by SSbaby

No need to gloat like your eye sight is superior. You can interpret the incident one of two ways. I think Webber was beaten and did his best to thwart Vettel's clear pass... and let's face it, Vettel's rear wheels touched Webber's front wheels when Webber's car was clearly angled toward the apex instead of the proper racing line.

Webber is too Vettel-centric. It's getting quite boring and he needs to move on. It's almost like he expects the championship to be gifted to him when there are still a few in mathematical contention for the title.

I have to say (being a Vettel fan) that in both the Turkey and Singapore incidents (with Lewis) Webber, although technically doing nothing wrong did put himself (and Vettel and Hamilton) in a position where there was going to be an accident unless they pulled out. In both incidents, Vettel and Hamilton were in front dispite Webber being on the racing line. Webber could have easily pulled out as much as Vettel/Hamilton could have and in both incidents i put Webber at equal balme to Vettel and Hamilton.

[jab]

OK, Vettel drove well today

I'm not going to get bogged down in the pros and cons of whether or not they should've used team orders, as it has passed now

If Vettel wins the title, he will deserve it. Hard for me to admit but it's true

[stripedcat]

It looks like Vettel could have to hold off for a championship next year. Despite making some pretty bad mistakes this year(his collision with Webber being the worst, and the one with Jenson being bad as well) he has matured quite a bit. His last couple of races have been really strong.

[Adam43]

Vettel was just flat better today.

Ultimately Vettel will hold the key to who scores the most points. For me the most likely result will be Vettel-Webber-Alonso in the final race. In which case Vettel holds the key. I don't think Webber can win the title without Vettel's help now.

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by Adam43

Vettel was just flat better today.

Ultimately Vettel will hold the key to who scores the most points. For me the most likely result will be Vettel-Webber-Alonso in the final race. In which case Vettel holds the key. I don't think Webber can win the title without Vettel's help now.

I also think that will be the most likely result, but Vettel is put in a catch 22 situation, he either helps Webber out to win the title, or, they (possibly) finish as above and Alonso wins the title, but much more importantly to Vettel although finishing on the same points, he would come 2nd in the championship due to 5 wins ergo, actually beating his team mate - Webber.

[gert]

Originally Posted by Mr V

I also think that will be the most likely result, but Vettel is put in a catch 22 situation, he either helps Webber out to win the title, or, they (possibly) finish as above and Alonso wins the title, but much more importantly to Vettel although finishing on the same points, he would come 2nd in the championship due to 5 wins ergo, actually beating his team mate - Webber.

Assuming Red Bull wants a Red Bull driver to win the Driver's championship, it's hard to imagine his bosses would be pleased with the outcome (of that second scenario). Moreover, most likely he will have to work at least one more year with Webber. If he helps him now, he may get something in return next year.

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by gert

Assuming Red Bull wants a Red Bull driver to win the Driver's championship, it's hard to imagine his bosses would be pleased with the outcome (of that second scenario). Moreover, most likely he will have to work at least one more year with Webber. If he helps him now, he may get something in return next year.

If Red Bull ask Seb to move over i imagine a scene a la Austria 2002.

[Born Racer]

In what sense, the way he moves over or the public reaction?

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

In what sense, the way he moves over or the public reaction?

The way he moves over, he'd have to leave it to the last possible minute, say for example he let Webber through on the penultimate lap then Alonso's engine blew up?

[manwell]

Originally Posted by SSbaby

... and let's face it, Vettel's rear wheels touched Webber's front wheels when Webber's car was clearly angled toward the apex instead of the proper racing line.

Ummmm..... generally in racing the apex of the corner IS the proper racing line. Its not one or the other.

[GTRMagic]

Joe Saward's view

You would have to say, a deal where the Alonso/Webber crowd are separated by 1 point, in a winner takes all fight, would make for an awesome Abu Dhabi

As it is, Mr Alonso can pretty much coast from here

[gert]

Originally Posted by Mr V

If Red Bull ask Seb to move over i imagine a scene a la Austria 2002.

I assume they will ask, and most likely it will be an Austria 2002 move to underline he was the best.

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Joe Saward's view

You would have to say, a deal where the Alonso/Webber crowd are separated by 1 point, in a winner takes all fight, would make for an awesome Abu Dhabi

As it is, Mr Alonso can pretty much coast from here

But how can Red Bull ask Vettel to move over, during todays race, when he still has a very good chance of winning the title himself?