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Old 22 Jun 2019, 17:46 (Ref:3913516)   #151
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Motorsport Total hints that there is possibility of Nissan, Honda or Lexus teams in the DTM in 2020. Of course, it's unlikely to see Japanese factory teams but as WRT showed, customer teams can be quite successful.
Those bosses who commented are really lame in GT500. First of all GT500 are Klass 1 plus alfa - at least they have jet ignition and more power. Secondly, all cars are leased by the teams, no team has own car.
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Old 22 Jun 2019, 22:33 (Ref:3913583)   #152
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It's well known that Nissan refused to sell cars to Konrad and Lexus to the Swiss team.
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Old 23 Jun 2019, 04:10 (Ref:3913612)   #153
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It's well known that Nissan refused to sell cars to Konrad and Lexus to the Swiss team.


First I’ve heard of either of those happenings.

No real surprise. The Japanese like to keep their GT500 cars close and are very selective on who runs them. Even trying to buy an older chassis that hasn’t raced for years is hard if you don’t have the connections.
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Old 23 Jun 2019, 21:41 (Ref:3913796)   #154
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Those Super GT500 cars come with a lot of technology. Jap-automakers don't want them in wrong hands I guess.
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Old 24 Jun 2019, 01:20 (Ref:3913815)   #155
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Those Super GT500 cars come with a lot of technology. Jap-automakers don't want them in wrong hands I guess.


Very much so. All of the GT500 cars I’ve seen in private hands (could count them on one hand) didn’t come with a drivetrain.

On a slight tangent there’s a GT300 Vemac in America and the owner is trying to put a stroked NSX motor in it. He’s on instagram
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Old 24 Jun 2019, 18:12 (Ref:3913989)   #156
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I'm travelling next weekend!
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Old 4 Jul 2019, 09:36 (Ref:3915837)   #157
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Will be at the DTM event at Brands Hatch this year for the first time, is this normally a big / busy event?
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Old 4 Jul 2019, 14:01 (Ref:3915865)   #158
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Will be at the DTM event at Brands Hatch this year for the first time, is this normally a big / busy event?
I went to last years' DTM at Brands and it was far less busy than expected, I'd say maybe half the crowd of BTCC. There's a lot more down time on the track with bigger gaps in the support package. Less racing + higher prices seemed to keep the crowds away a bit
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Old 6 Jul 2019, 17:46 (Ref:3916175)   #159
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Just came back from the Saturday activities. I certainly enjoyed it, but I expected a bit more, especially from the race action and surrounding scenery.

Between an online delivery and today, I've bought a dozen of model racecars. However I really couldn't convince myself to spend 60 euros for an AF Corse Ferrari.
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Old 6 Jul 2019, 22:45 (Ref:3916223)   #160
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Between an online delivery and today, I've bought a dozen of model racecars. However I really couldn't convince myself to spend 60 euros for an AF Corse Ferrari.

Hope you did it for a Aston Martin Vantage DTM. Money has no fatherland!
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Old 8 Jul 2019, 17:19 (Ref:3916554)   #161
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Just came back from the Saturday activities. I certainly enjoyed it, but I expected a bit more, especially from the race action and surrounding scenery.

Between an online delivery and today, I've bought a dozen of model racecars. However I really couldn't convince myself to spend 60 euros for an AF Corse Ferrari.

Would be interesting, what you are critical on?
Or what could be better.
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Old 9 Jul 2019, 17:12 (Ref:3916710)   #162
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There were few overtaking attempts, especially in race 1.

The venue wasn't as well maintained as I expected. Behind the grandstands there was dirt, and when wind blew the air got dusty.

It was a nightmare to cross the track. Twice we were told to stay in the grandstands of the main straight, rather than finishing crossing it all. This means we had no time to visit the paddock/fan village on Sunday.
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Old 12 Jul 2019, 10:17 (Ref:3917126)   #163
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There were few overtaking attempts, especially in race 1.

The venue wasn't as well maintained as I expected. Behind the grandstands there was dirt, and when wind blew the air got dusty.

It was a nightmare to cross the track. Twice we were told to stay in the grandstands of the main straight, rather than finishing crossing it all. This means we had no time to visit the paddock/fan village on Sunday.

Ok, thats mainly the problem of non-permanent racetracks. I remember my visits at DTM Race in Singen around 1992, where you needed to walk through a muddy field to go on grandstand on mainstraight. Visit to Paddock was only possible, when coming or going to parking lot.


And yes - overtaking was not that much. I expected also more, but i think, power and traction is already to high. It needs some instability and not that much power to have interesting overtakes.
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Old 12 Jul 2019, 10:58 (Ref:3917135)   #164
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... overtaking was not that much. I expected also more, but i think, power and traction is already to high. It needs some instability and not that much power to have interesting overtakes.
It's the brakes and traction that are the problem - if they're too good then overtaking is made more difficult. The power is not an issue (and if aero was reduced then the power would make driving more difficult - more mistakes and more overtakes.)

I've only seen the DTM in the flesh at Donington and Brands Hatch (Indy and GP circuits) - the cars are at their best through the quick sections (they're much better on the GP loop than the Indy circuit at Brands for example). I don't know whether the Norisring is the best circuit for these cars? (It's an iconic venue but it may not show the cars off at their best?)
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Old 12 Jul 2019, 11:00 (Ref:3917136)   #165
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Will be at the DTM event at Brands Hatch this year for the first time, is this normally a big / busy event?
Not as big or busy as BTCC but usually busier than British GT - don't know if that helps?
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Old 18 Jul 2019, 21:03 (Ref:3918402)   #166
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Here's my public photos of Norisring: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/C...g_Speedweekend

Unfortunately I forgot my camera on Saturday, and had to use my old mobile phone. The Sunday photos are hardly better, as I was poorly located.
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Old 10 Aug 2019, 19:05 (Ref:3922221)   #167
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Just had my first taste of DTM at Brands and sum what mixed feelings from the day.

First off, the new breed of DTM cars are fast, really really fast!! Standing trackside it just bends the mind to see how late on brakes and early on throttle they are. But, this is also seamed to be a big problem in terms of the racing or lack off. All the action seamed to be focused around the pit stops and the mix of cars on old / new tyres. Apart from that, it was all very much as you were apart from the odd manover here n there. There just didn't seam to be a way to overtake. Maybe I'm too used to the BTCC door banging.

Also the timetable was a bit odd, the DTM race could have been held later in the afternoon as it was very noticeable how many people left after that was finished.

Last point from me, considering the scale of the DTM,it surprised me how little the manufacturers had to show off. Audi had a stand with one of last year's RS5's and a R8 V10, BMW had a 8 series and a M4 to Taxi on show and that was it. Nothing from Aston Martin. Compared to what you see when the Blancpain are in town, it was very poor.
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Old 11 Aug 2019, 10:27 (Ref:3922278)   #168
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Good to hear that Aston got on the front row, shame di Resta jumped the start, but it gives hope and encouragement for the future
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Old 11 Aug 2019, 11:51 (Ref:3922283)   #169
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Honestly saying the alleged di Resta's jump start is quite a debatable issue. Paul himself states he didn't jump the start, the commentator also claimed that and from my perspective it didn't look clearly like one but stewards have more data to judge. Nevertheless, his pace was good, which, as you said, gives hope for future. In my view Aston Martin ruined their own race. Great quali results turned into a disaster. Di Resta's jump start from P4, Juncandella (P9) crashed into Glock, which resulted in him getting drive through and Dennis (P6) being squeezed into the wall by Glock. Dennis by the way had a terrible start. Habsburg had a very lengthy pitstop (not quite sure what happened there) and there we go - potential for two-three Top 10 positions was wasted.
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Old 12 Aug 2019, 05:41 (Ref:3922373)   #170
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Honestly saying the alleged di Resta's jump start is quite a debatable issue. Paul himself states he didn't jump the start, the commentator also claimed that and from my perspective it didn't look clearly like one but stewards have more data to judge. Nevertheless, his pace was good, which, as you said, gives hope for future. In my view Aston Martin ruined their own race. Great quali results turned into a disaster. Di Resta's jump start from P4, Juncandella (P9) crashed into Glock, which resulted in him getting drive through and Dennis (P6) being squeezed into the wall by Glock. Dennis by the way had a terrible start. Habsburg had a very lengthy pitstop (not quite sure what happened there) and there we go - potential for two-three Top 10 positions was wasted.
“aston Martin” on the pace in UK race? Hmm......
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Old 12 Aug 2019, 08:30 (Ref:3922390)   #171
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“aston Martin” on the pace in UK race? Hmm......
That was more to do with the conditions in qualifying that anything else on Saturday - Aston rolled the dice and sent cars out on slicks after the red flag. The Astons started lighting up the timing screens as the tyres came in and those on wets had to make a dash for the pits with the clock ticking down. Whilst the Astons were pounding around setting quicker and quicker times the others were still trying to get heat into the tyres - once they got them working the Astons started dropping down the order (as expected) but time ran out before everyone got them.

The cars are quicker than last year (they were below last years pole time in practice on Saturday and the track was nowhere near it's best at that point) but they don't sound as good now - rather than the ear splitting howl they now sound more like a GT3 car. Lap times were 8+ seconds quicker than the GT3 cars though so there's plenty of grunt still!

I was at Brands on Saturday only - but I have to say despite the ridiculous weather I still enjoyed it
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Old 12 Aug 2019, 09:07 (Ref:3922394)   #172
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Originally Posted by geordiecriag101 View Post
Just had my first taste of DTM at Brands and sum what mixed feelings from the day.

First off, the new breed of DTM cars are fast, really really fast!! Standing trackside it just bends the mind to see how late on brakes and early on throttle they are. But, this is also seamed to be a big problem in terms of the racing or lack off. All the action seamed to be focused around the pit stops and the mix of cars on old / new tyres. Apart from that, it was all very much as you were apart from the odd manover here n there. There just didn't seam to be a way to overtake. Maybe I'm too used to the BTCC door banging.

Also the timetable was a bit odd, the DTM race could have been held later in the afternoon as it was very noticeable how many people left after that was finished.

Last point from me, considering the scale of the DTM,it surprised me how little the manufacturers had to show off. Audi had a stand with one of last year's RS5's and a R8 V10, BMW had a 8 series and a M4 to Taxi on show and that was it. Nothing from Aston Martin. Compared to what you see when the Blancpain are in town, it was very poor.

I think you are right, cars are too powerful and still too aerodynamic for good racing. And of course too many cars from each manufacturer, which leads to heavy team orders...
Only pit stop strategy and safety cars change the races, and thats not what it should be.


I still don't think, you need 600+ hp in a racecar and F1-like aerodynamics. Both should be less, its all about the fighting.

But thats theory...most manufacturer don't want to see their cars fighting too close...
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Old 12 Aug 2019, 10:39 (Ref:3922406)   #173
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I’d be happy if the cars had 600hp but less aero. That’d spice things up a bit.
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Old 13 Aug 2019, 12:22 (Ref:3922565)   #174
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Was at Brands for both the Saturday and Sunday and have to say I enjoyed both days - the qualifying for the W-Series on the sunday was exciting too!
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Old 13 Aug 2019, 13:57 (Ref:3922569)   #175
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I think you are right, cars are too powerful and still too aerodynamic for good racing. And of course too many cars from each manufacturer, which leads to heavy team orders...
Only pit stop strategy and safety cars change the races, and thats not what it should be.


I still don't think, you need 600+ hp in a racecar and F1-like aerodynamics. Both should be less, its all about the fighting.

But thats theory...most manufacturer don't want to see their cars fighting too close...
Eh, it isn't always like that. Hockenheim last year had an insane amount of DRS-overtakes for the lead between Glock and Paffett. I think they'd race much better at Silverstone or Donnington. Brands Hatch is just not a great track for "big cars"... Even British GT two weeks ago was rather processional.


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