New car revealed.

[mac]

Personally, I think marketing types and focus groups have been too close to this project - it's got that whiff about it.

I actually don't mind it the look of the car... Apart from those rear "fenders" behind the rear wheels - remove those and it starts to look a little bit better. BUT...

Indycars are suppose to be simple, pure racing machines... Of all the open wheel categories, they are a man's car - no styling, no fake bits, no swooshy lines for the sake of having swooshy lines... Just a neat, well-proportioned body, a couple of bits for aero, a rollover bar, a blow-off valve and that's about it...

Something like this:
http://www.alex-zanardi.com/public/i...37_Cart/25.jpg

[Jonerz]

Amen, guys.

Chris

[Purist]

I don't think it's as dire as you guys paint it, but yes, I would make changes. The front-to-rear depth of the wings, or at least the endplates, should be reduced significantly. The rear wheel guards should be removed, or at least cut back a fair amount. Get rid of the air box bulge. And make it a low nose.

If we're going for a more conventional idea, look at the 1994 or 2000 CART machinery.

If we're going to do something more "out there", but that I could still call attractive, I think I've found the best example out there. This page has a rendering of a concept that is significantly based upon the Interscope Batmobile that was driven by Danny Ongais at Indy in 1981.
http://www.motorracingblog.nl/?p=3831

It's sharp and sleek. The bodywork is pretty simple. The wings are fairly minimal. There's enough space in that envelope for adequate crash protection. It's striking and looks fast even in a still image. Heck, it even has plenty of space for sponsors to put their names/logos.

I'm guessing that the original Interscope car had some input from Porsche designers, with that long tail, before the Porsche Indy Car program was scrapped in 1980.

[gttouring]

They can go back to frank lockharts speed trials car that ended his life, that is a better start than the dallara. With safety.improvment why not go back to the late90's CART spec? The cars were universally liked and fast, and I don't recall wheel lock ups being that big of a problem. It is open wheel racing contact is a no no, that is what makes this a more precision and driver talent requiring form of racing, this isn't bull riding. If you area poor driver or do not take care and rather take unsound chances you might lock wheels or find somewhere else to drive.
ahem viso, tags, a few other clowns...now the car is safer to do what hit each other

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by gttouring

They can go back to frank lockharts speed trials car that ended his life, that is a better start than the dallara. With safety.improvment why not go back to the late90's CART spec? The cars were universally liked and fast, and I don't recall wheel lock ups being that big of a problem. It is open wheel racing contact is a no no, that is what makes this a more precision and driver talent requiring form of racing, this isn't bull riding. If you area poor driver or do not take care and rather take unsound chances you might lock wheels or find somewhere else to drive.
ahem viso, tags, a few other clowns...now the car is safer to do what hit each other

When toyota was pestered repeatedly since 2007 to come back to the irl, by irl management, toyota's response to them was "use updated 1994 CART regs and we'll come back".

Obviously that fell on deaf ears, because this is after all the irl and doing anything that makes sense isn't going to happen.

[TerribleWone]

I think from head on the car will look tolerable as it will hide the ugly side proportions and profile. That said indy is not doing itself any favours making their new car so ugly. IMO they should have just bought a bunch of Lotus 125 track cars and been done with it (the F1 car you can buy).

[christcc2]

Originally Posted by mac

Personally, I think marketing types and focus groups have been too close to this project - it's got that whiff about it.

I actually don't mind it the look of the car... Apart from those rear "fenders" behind the rear wheels - remove those and it starts to look a little bit better. BUT...

Indycars are suppose to be simple, pure racing machines... Of all the open wheel categories, they are a man's car - no styling, no fake bits, no swooshy lines for the sake of having swooshy lines... Just a neat, well-proportioned body, a couple of bits for aero, a rollover bar, a blow-off valve and that's about it...

Something like this:
http://www.alex-zanardi.com/public/i...37_Cart/25.jpg

Agreed.

[anthonyvop]

Looks like a car that was designed by committee.


The funny part is that Dallara makes some good looking cars except for the US market where the sanctioning bodies tell them what to make..ICS and Grand-Am.

[gttouring]

aside from a thousand issues i may have with the car, why does it have those 'bumperettes" on the rear wheel at midohio?
i can understand those things on the OVAL package but on a regular circuit, leave them off as wheel to wheel nonsense isn't going to force a concrete barriers/wall collision or throw the car into a pack of cars at 220mph (or a fence and spectators) i can see that working the oval package looks quite different anyway now and in CART days

[Paradise City]

The early to mid 90's Indycar is what an Indycar should look like perhaps with sleeker dimensions for the 21st century.

Now we've got this gimmicky new Dullara over the old Dullara f3000-scale car.

I suppose it doesn't look like Formula One scaffolding is about all you can say about it.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by Purist

I don't think it's as dire as you guys paint it, but yes, I would make changes. The front-to-rear depth of the wings, or at least the endplates, should be reduced significantly. The rear wheel guards should be removed, or at least cut back a fair amount. Get rid of the air box bulge. And make it a low nose.

If we're going for a more conventional idea, look at the 1994 or 2000 CART machinery.

If we're going to do something more "out there", but that I could still call attractive, I think I've found the best example out there. This page has a rendering of a concept that is significantly based upon the Interscope Batmobile that was driven by Danny Ongais at Indy in 1981.
http://www.motorracingblog.nl/?p=3831

It's sharp and sleek. The bodywork is pretty simple. The wings are fairly minimal. There's enough space in that envelope for adequate crash protection. It's striking and looks fast even in a still image. Heck, it even has plenty of space for sponsors to put their names/logos.

I'm guessing that the original Interscope car had some input from Porsche designers, with that long tail, before the Porsche Indy Car program was scrapped in 1980.

That BAT car is miles more disgusting looking than the Dallara.

[Purist]

If you mean the all-red rendering at the top of the page I linked to, I don't care for that one either. The same goes for that cluster of five renderings at the bottom of the page.

The one I'm interested in is that mostly black concept with the red highlights, the red #25 and IZOD lettering. And I realized the other car that concept reminds me of is the 1988-89 Nissan ZX-T GTP, which I can't say is a bad thing.

And do remember, I was putting this one up specifically as a more "out there" concept direction. I did say I like the 1994 cars as a good, more conventional example. The 1981-86 period saw quite a few very good looking Indy Cars as well, but I don't think those have enough ahead of the driver's foot box to be considered acceptable models for today's car.

[JagtechOhio]

The car is a pig, they just pulled the plug on multiple aero kits for 2012, and the rotten TV deal with ABC/ESPN was just renewed thru 2018.

In the immortal words of Kid Rock: "I wanna be a Cowboy, baby".

[jondownunder]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

they just pulled the plug on multiple aero kits for 2012

More on that story:
http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...ld-until-2013/

"I've been pushing for that and I'm glad to hear it," said Michael Andretti, who operates the only 4-car team in the series. "My point is why right now? What's the point? We've got new engines and a new car next year so we can have another new story for 2013.''

Er, maybe because fans of AOWR have made it clear that they're sick of spec racing? What an arrogant ****. Andretti of all people must surely realise that what we have now is a joke compared to the past, merely another GP2/A1GP/Superleague while the CART machinery could put F1 to shame, and it's time for forward momentum, not more stalling.

Spec junior series in Europe, with less TV exposure than IndyCar (I presume), have generally had to buy new cars every 3 years or so, so what exactly is wrong with the IndyCar teams' accounts that they're whining about an upgrade after all these years?

I presume they're all hoping the delay will mean they can sweep the whole idea and demand for aero kits under the carpet, that's the gut feeling I have.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by jondownunder

More on that story:
http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...ld-until-2013/



Er, maybe because fans of AOWR have made it clear that they're sick of spec racing? What an arrogant ****. Andretti of all people must surely realise that what we have now is a joke compared to the past, merely another GP2/A1GP/Superleague while the CART machinery could put F1 to shame, and it's time for forward momentum, not more stalling.

Spec junior series in Europe, with less TV exposure than IndyCar (I presume), have generally had to buy new cars every 3 years or so, so what exactly is wrong with the IndyCar teams' accounts that they're whining about an upgrade after all these years?

I presume they're all hoping the delay will mean they can sweep the whole idea and demand for aero kits under the carpet, that's the gut feeling I have.

And that's where you're wrong. The amount of sponsorship in the European junior series is more than there is in the IICS. That's why when they fail in the Euro ladder they look toward the IICS.

[JohnMiller]

Originally Posted by TerribleWone

IMO they should have just bought a bunch of Lotus 125 track cars and been done with it (the F1 car you can buy).

Surely they didn't make enough of the GP Masters cars?

[nickyf1]

I seem to recall Panoz building a grid full of cars a few years ago... They aren't being used are they?

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by nickyf1

I seem to recall Panoz building a grid full of cars a few years ago... They aren't being used are they?

And that was a beautiful car that once a few bugs were worked out, ran like a train.

And still a few of them run in BOSS races in Europe, fast as ever and they've turned out to be pretty reliable.

It is shocking the junk the irl has come up with.

And then i've heard the irl is looking to equalize the 2 engines, which is just spec racing.

How pathetic.

[Mr Pink]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

And that was a beautiful car that once a few bugs were worked out, ran like a train.

And still a few of them run in BOSS races in Europe, fast as ever and they've turned out to be pretty reliable.

It is shocking the junk the irl has come up with.

And then i've heard the irl is looking to equalize the 2 engines, which is just spec racing.

How pathetic.

They´re actually equalizing the engines?

I'm 21 years old so I grew up watching Kenny Bräck, I love the american type of open wheel racing and I really thought they had the chance and will to somewhat resurrect the series to it's former glory but this is certainly going nowhere fast.

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by Mr Pink

They´re actually equalizing the engines?

I'm 21 years old so I grew up watching Kenny Bräck, I love the american type of open wheel racing and I really thought they had the chance and will to somewhat resurrect the series to it's former glory but this is certainly going nowhere fast.

Yep I saw it recently mentioned in either one of Curt Cave-in's articles or some other media blurb.

[JagtechOhio]

The last three years have been a great lesson in how to use every available resource to achieve the least possible benefit.

Seems fitting that the race will be run today (and it will be a "one and done") in NH, touted as the next big incursion into the northeast market.

A bunch of guys running around in very small circles with very few people paying attention. This series is in worse shape than it was at Richmond 2008 and has demonstrated no ability to institute any positive changes: technical variety, marketing, broadcasting, or viable budget structure for participants.

By the way, Pink: Thanks to your original assistance, I was able to meet Andreas Erikkson at a Rallycar event in New Jersey last November. He was very interested, and stated that his company had the capabilities for the task.

Ford Racing acknowledged the viability of the concept but had no interest in participating in IndyCar. So much for that idea, and any other which would produce the best results from utilizing existing resources.

The guys running in small circles in front of empty grandstands are getting exactly what they have earned.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

The last three years have been a great lesson in how to use every available resource to achieve the least possible benefit.

Seems fitting that the race will be run today (and it will be a "one and done") in NH, touted as the next big incursion into the northeast market.

A bunch of guys running around in very small circles with very few people paying attention. This series is in worse shape than it was at Richmond 2008 and has demonstrated no ability to institute any positive changes: technical variety, marketing, broadcasting, or viable budget structure for participants.

By the way, Pink: Thanks to your original assistance, I was able to meet Andreas Erikkson at a Rallycar event in New Jersey last November. He was very interested, and stated that his company had the capabilities for the task.

Ford Racing acknowledged the viability of the concept but had no interest in participating in IndyCar. So much for that idea, and any other which would produce the best results from utilizing existing resources.

The guys running in small circles in front of empty grandstands are getting exactly what they have earned.

And the grandstands are very empty today.

[nickyf1]

Here's hoping, for 2013, when Penske, Chevrolet and Lotus develop bodies, they will come up with something more functional looking..

[hotlavaaaa]

What a frustrating day to be an Indycar fan. Everything that happened today is exactly why the stands are empty in New Hampshire. Poor officiating. Low driving standards. Boring cars. And none of those things will change for next year. The car will hopefully perform and sound better, but as we found out this week they will look even uglier. Four years after unification and the cars will still look identical. What a dissapointment. Do the ******s running the show not see what made Indycar great in the 90s? The blueprint for a successful formula is right there and they can't seem to figure it out. They make one step forward and you think they might be on the right path and then they just take one step right back and end up going nowhere.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by hotlavaaaa

What a frustrating day to be an Indycar fan. Everything that happened today is exactly why the stands are empty in New Hampshire. Poor officiating. Low driving standards. Boring cars. And none of those things will change for next year. The car will hopefully perform and sound better, but as we found out this week they will look even uglier. Four years after unification and the cars will still look identical. What a dissapointment. Do the ******s running the show not see what made Indycar great in the 90s? The blueprint for a successful formula is right there and they can't seem to figure it out. They make one step forward and you think they might be on the right path and then they just take one step right back and end up going nowhere.

Couldn't agree more. As you say the blueprint is there so what was the point of the Iconic Committee?