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22 Nov 2023, 12:04 (Ref:4186868) | #1 | ||
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2024 Rallying
So with the 2023 WRC season over it's time for the 2024 thread to fire up!
Toyota: Rovanpera has signed a new multi year contract but 2024 will not be a full time drive for him. Ogier continues with a part time programme. Evans and Katstuta will compete in all rounds in 2024. The new Yaris Rally 2 car looks set to make its debut on the Monte Carlo. Hyundai: Neuville continues with the team and is joined by the returning Tanak for a full season. Lappi has a part time drive confirmed. The other 'half' of the Lappi deal could see Sordo retained, Suninen or Linholm promoted. Other names mentioned are Formeaux and Solberg. M-Sport: I've not seen anything from M-Sport regarding driver lineup but obviously the loss of Tanak is a huge blow. Possible drivers - Formeaux, Loubet, Greensmith? General observations: The addition of the Yaris Rally 2 car adds some more variety to the class - it has to be said that the Rally2 regs seem to be working well. A lot better than Rally 1 - the number of Rally1 cars for next year looks very poor. Assuming 2 Pumas, 3 Yaris and 3 i20 - that's only 8 starters in the top category. Not sure what can be done about that? |
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22 Nov 2023, 16:06 (Ref:4186895) | #2 | |||
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Said it in the 2023 thread, but probably more relevant posting here! I think next year could be an interesting one. Hyundai look to have the stronger full time driver line up, but Evans definitely seems to have the speed to at least hold Neuville off.
Hoping that M-Sport can bring the drivers (and cars) to get themselves in the mix. If they can find a work around for potential sponsor conflict, is there a possibility of Oliver Solberg appearing in a Puma? Quote:
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22 Nov 2023, 20:57 (Ref:4186935) | #3 | ||||
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Quote:
Quote:
You'd have to think they've got orders in the book if they're building that many - you can't really afford to have them sitting around waiting to sell. The question is who is buying them? Interesting to see which current crews replace existing cars with the Yaris. |
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28 Nov 2023, 13:42 (Ref:4187657) | #4 | ||
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Yeah, from the outside it looks like M-Sport have lost their way entirely. Unless I am entirely wrong, that leaves a 4 car world championship unless one of the part timers wins enough races to embarrass the full timers.
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28 Nov 2023, 14:46 (Ref:4187670) | #5 | ||
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Tänak is the Fernando Alonso of the WRC. He has terrible timing to switch teams.
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Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed! by NaBUrean Prodooktionz naburu38.itch.io |
28 Nov 2023, 14:58 (Ref:4187677) | #6 | ||
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M-Sport is just bad signing drivers. Can't they get Yohan Rossel?
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Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed! by NaBUrean Prodooktionz naburu38.itch.io |
4 Dec 2023, 17:54 (Ref:4188280) | #7 | |
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Don't knock M Sport please. Remember that they have very limited funding and no manufacturers' money like the other two.
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5 Dec 2023, 11:25 (Ref:4188331) | #8 | |||
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Quote:
I wonder if the introduction of the Rally2 Yaris will hit their Rally2 sales/customer base as well? |
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5 Dec 2023, 14:37 (Ref:4188345) | #9 | |||
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You've got to think it'll dilute the sales somewhat but M-Sport do seem to have a good customer base of models below the Rally2 car as well so that might protect them somewhat. Also the R5 cars are cropping up on more clubman events now as well so with support for those still coming from M-Sport there's still a good sized revenue stream I'd think. |
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12 Dec 2023, 10:27 (Ref:4188879) | #10 | ||
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Toyota have revealed their colour scheme:
https://www.wrc.com/a/news/w27089_Al...;s-2024-livery The black scheme will also be applied to their WEC cars as well. I think it looks ok - an improvement on the white/red/black from the last few years. |
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12 Dec 2023, 13:51 (Ref:4188894) | #11 | ||
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I think that all black cars look the same. I like colors.
Toyota should have returned to white, red, orange and yellow. |
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Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed! by NaBUrean Prodooktionz naburu38.itch.io |
15 Dec 2023, 20:10 (Ref:4189172) | #12 | ||
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They are not skint for goodness sake, they still get money from Ford just not as much as a full manufacturer, they still make enough to massively expand the factory, build a test track and run several other programs.
They are though the poorest choice for any decent driver hence they never really keep anyone long enough. Ogier was superb when he was there because he and he alone made the difference, the car as good, but Ogier was the reason they won, not the car. |
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16 Dec 2023, 14:23 (Ref:4189236) | #13 | ||
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Interstingly, Ford have just announced their GT3 Mustang drivers.....and all are good choices - and no 'pay drivers'.
I think we can assume that is more of a priority than the WRC........Where M-Sport will need pay drivers for the 2024 season. |
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17 Dec 2023, 15:46 (Ref:4189326) | #14 | ||
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Quote:
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20 Dec 2023, 19:40 (Ref:4189526) | #15 | ||
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I am sure he has spent a fair bit over the years and is about breaking even, he has spent a huge amount expanding, land is cheap there and that is why he can do this, he would likely not be able to do this further south. AS an aside it also means he can pay people far less than they would get elsewhere, I can tell you this from real experience!
he has also forsake good drivers in favour of pay drivers like greensmith, he is tight, it is that simple, and that is a way to be a businessman sure, but not the best way to win sadly. I too have been there and he runs a tight ship, he also has that usual trait people like him have of being very odd about people going on his grass! Which I found rather odd for a man who has spent his entiore life getting dirty rallying! |
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20 Dec 2023, 19:53 (Ref:4189530) | #16 | |
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With the income from the Mustang engine deal he can fund their WRC effort.
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22 Dec 2023, 09:47 (Ref:4189638) | #17 | ||
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M-Sport confirm Fourmaux and Munster for 2024:
WRC - M-Sport confirm 2024 line up Nice to see M-Sport hanging in there but, as much I like Fourmaux, I can't see the car making much progress under those two. Fingers crossed M-Sport can secure some decent results with the car in 2024. |
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22 Dec 2023, 10:23 (Ref:4189641) | #18 | ||
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It's a bit underwhelming isn't it?
No mention of a 3rd car in that announcement either - I thought they might have a 3rd car with possible outings for Loeb and/or another more well known driver at some point in the year. The other bit of news was Oliver Solberg committing to WRC2 for 2024 in a Skoda: https://www.wrc.com/a/news/w27126_So...-glory-in-2024 |
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24 Dec 2023, 11:50 (Ref:4189768) | #19 | ||
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The most underwhelming M-Sport line up since 2005; Gardemeister & Kresta - and there were reasons for that. Developing the new Focus, and preparing for a full effort with a top driver in 2006....
Which is what happened, they signed Gronholm. There is no such plan this time..... |
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28 Dec 2023, 20:21 (Ref:4190102) | #20 | ||
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Bigger effort for Citroën Racing in WRC2 next year with a three cars for Yohan Rossel, Nikolay Gryazin and Marco Bulacia
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29 Dec 2023, 21:40 (Ref:4190197) | #21 | |||
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What do people think about the incoming points system? I think I see what they are trying to do, but the fan should be able to understand it a bit more readily.
https://us.motorsport.com/wrc/news/f...stem/10558452/ Quote:
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30 Dec 2023, 18:38 (Ref:4190277) | #22 | ||
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I understand the idea of awarding points on Sunday, but this format doesn't make sense to me.
A driver that leads on Friday and Saturday, then cruises on Sunday to finish 6th would score 20 points. And a driver that finishes 3rd on Sunday but wins the overall race would also score 20 points. A better solution would be to give 15-12-10... points for each leg classification (Fri-Sat-Sun), and then again the same points scale for the overall result. With that score system, those two drivers would earn 37 and 50 points respectively. |
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Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed! by NaBUrean Prodooktionz naburu38.itch.io |
31 Dec 2023, 11:01 (Ref:4190332) | #23 | ||
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Better to leave it as it is.....they've got the priorities all wrong. The current points system is not the issue in the WRC.
Rallying is meant to be an Endurance sport, cruising to the finish is what sometimes happens - if fans can't accept that, then maybe rallying isn't the sport for them....Maybe watch Rallycross. It's like handing out points at 60 mins in a football match, and then some more at 90; or giving points out at 4 hours in a WEC race, and some more at the 6 hour end of race...... More dumbing down of a sport that seems to want to become irrelevant..... |
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31 Dec 2023, 11:48 (Ref:4190339) | #24 | |||
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Quote:
As you say the priorties are wrong - working on more entries in the top class (or changing the top class so there are more entries) would seem to be the better long term solution. This tinkering with points doesn't solve the underlying issues. |
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31 Dec 2023, 12:24 (Ref:4190345) | #25 | ||
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It is what is perhaps most obvious when you look at the Roger Albert, a 5 day rally where numerous people led, numerous people were quick, but the same guy won, as he knows full well that is a long event, and you have to be there at the end. Everyone loved it, kids, old farts like me, it was simply majestic, why because it was proper rallying, parking in roads off the grid, wandering in, watching a few duds then seeing Oli or Marty on it!
That is what rallying should and ought to be about, and further to this point you could easily do events like this in an R5 type car, they have enough development to allow it and it just needs careful driving and servicing arrangements to do it. I think you could still have 4 or 5 day events with the right planing and have maybe 1 or 2 central service areas. Can you imagine an old style Portugal or Sanremo, 2 days on tar then three on gravel and the one stage thrown in on both. they were real tests, and you can see now with some reverence how rallies were won and why there is so much emphasis on winning say an RAC, SanRemo, Acropolis or especially Safari back in the day. Drievrs want it, fans want it, teams I dont know. The issue is money, the owners want more rallies, that means more hosting fees, more tv coverage, easier to sell. The teams want less, less expense, less testing less cars to build. |
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