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30 Nov 2003, 18:26 (Ref:799394)
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Racer
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 422
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Judd
Have Judd been able to for the most part solve their reliability issues in the enduros?
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30 Nov 2003, 19:02 (Ref:799428)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,366
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Well the Racing For Holland domes have been pretty reliable in the FIA SCC this year - and finished 6th overall at LM this year so I guess the Judd is pretty reliable yeah. Sure it aint perfect but its better than most.
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__________________
Sportscar Racing fans of the world Unite!
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30 Nov 2003, 19:52 (Ref:799485)
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#3 | ||
 Race OfficialVeteran
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,129
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In 2001, the Oreca Dallaras finished 5th and 6th but 16 laps behind the winning Audi.
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__________________
BoP = egalitarianism
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30 Nov 2003, 20:40 (Ref:799529)
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Racer
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 326
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actually that was in 2002 because in 2001 the oreca dallaras were being run with chyrsler 6 liter V8's and were called the Chrysler LMP 2001. only one finished and it finished 4th overall behind the two works audis and works bentley. in 2002 they lost their chrysler backing and switched to the judd engines where they finished 5th and 6th
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__________________
Always Expect the Unexpected
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30 Nov 2003, 21:01 (Ref:799545)
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,390
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On relaibility the answer is undoubtedly yes - At LM in 2002 7 cars started the race with Judd Engines, 5 of them finished - the two that didn't had failures not related to the engine. At the 2003 race we had 4 starters and three finished, the fourth again had a non-engine related problem (Gommendy had a late accident in the 2nd RfH Dome)
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30 Nov 2003, 23:15 (Ref:799648)
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#6 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 521
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The problem is not reliability or speed. The problem, as I see it, is having organization and finances that can truely compete with the likes of VAG.
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__________________
I specialize in the history of small displacement sports racers from France and Italy, circa 1930-1960.
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1 Dec 2003, 04:39 (Ref:799844)
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#7 | |
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Racer
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 378
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Doesn't it have to have it's rev tuned down quite a bit between the qualifying and race to make it reliable? On Mike's site, the laptime comparison between race and qualifying time of the Audis and the Judd powered cars are staggering....
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1 Dec 2003, 06:04 (Ref:799890)
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#8 | ||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 9,482
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i didn't belive it was possible, but Oreca first, then RFH and Courage demonstrated last two years that the Judd was a good tool for the endurance's races.
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1 Dec 2003, 11:33 (Ref:800213)
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#9 | ||
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Race Official Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 7,618
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didn't Oreca Dallara&Dome use the GV4??? .. the question i would put .. is the GV5 better then the GV4??? and will the Dome start to use it ???
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__________________
Apocalypse becomes creation / Gor-Gor shall erase the nation Before you leap into his gizzard / Fall and worship Tyrant lizard Ciao Marco
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1 Dec 2003, 13:13 (Ref:800302)
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#10 | |||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 9,482
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Quote:
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1 Dec 2003, 13:41 (Ref:800339)
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#11 | |
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Racer
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 356
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I thought they were working on a diesel for LM next year, any more news on this ???
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1 Dec 2003, 14:03 (Ref:800353)
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#12 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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The Doran/Lista Dallara that ran in Grand Am last year and in the 1st half of the ALMS season this year used the GV5...
The ORECA Dallaras ran the Judd GV4 in 2002... There was an issue raised above concerning the ORECA Chrysler entry in 2001 that I wanted to touch on, for whatever it is worth: That Chrysler engine that ORECA used was derived from a Sprint Car engine.... Sprint Car engine in the US generate plenty of power and are fairly inexpensive to build and maintain...there are plenty of builders who are familiar with tese engines and can do them inexpensively... Sure they have to be "de-tuned" to last the 24 hours....but in their Sprint Race configuration, they push about 750 hp.....They are fuel-injected engines already that have all of the computer mapping and such set up on them for racing... If Henri doesn't get the deals he wants with Judd or another builder, and Euros are tight, this would be a GOOD option for him to pursue... |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series!
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1 Dec 2003, 14:59 (Ref:800389)
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#13 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 3,580
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The RfH Domes, as well as the Goddard Reynard, have the GV4.
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__________________
Oops
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1 Dec 2003, 15:07 (Ref:800398)
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#14 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 3,580
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And the Oreca Dallaras of xourse.
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Oops
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1 Dec 2003, 15:13 (Ref:800400)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 13,763
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1 Dec 2003, 15:25 (Ref:800412)
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 3,580
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Quote:
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__________________
Oops
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1 Dec 2003, 16:35 (Ref:800465)
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#17 | |
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Racer
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 356
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If euros are tight Judd V10 diesels are the way to go, just think of the saving in fuel costs !!
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1 Dec 2003, 16:54 (Ref:800484)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 13,763
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1 Dec 2003, 17:25 (Ref:800511)
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#19 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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I wasn't aware that Robinson's engine was the GV5, either...
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series!
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1 Dec 2003, 18:50 (Ref:800586)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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To Spearce...
The fuel costs may be lower, but you're looking at the cost of leasing the engines... I have no idea how much it does cost to lease the Judds, but I do know that Sprint Car teams in the USA are fairly low-budget operations compared to what it would cost to run a sportscar operation.. The sprinters race lots of events, so their travel budgets are probably fairly high, but their engine costs are not...at least not when you compare it to an engine lease program... |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series!
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1 Dec 2003, 22:29 (Ref:800760)
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#21 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 6,699
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Sprint-car engines are tuned to run in one gear only and run on methanol. They utilize an in-and-out box, so the car is either in gear or out of gear. I know some teams have used a manual transmission for events where pitstops are possible. But I've always wondered how they would perform with a full range gear box. Would they still be capable of the same horsepower and torque? What fuels are allowed under ACO rules? My guess though, is that they are quite heavy compared to some of the modern sportscar engines. Neat idea though.
In terms of power plant options, what about the turbo charged V8 Cosworth engine used in CART? |
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__________________
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." Albert Einstein
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1 Dec 2003, 23:08 (Ref:800806)
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#22 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 3,580
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The Mopar was based on a sprint car engine of some sort, wasn't it? It could have been auseful customer engine had Chrysler persevered. That's just my personal opinion though. As for what fuels are allowed, well there is one car that runs on ethanol now; so that's legal. If you can manage to convert the engine from methanol to ethanol (not such a big deal I would imagine) you can run it in ACO competition right now. If you insist on using methanol I guess you'd have to have conversations with the ACO first.
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__________________
Oops
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2 Dec 2003, 12:42 (Ref:801452)
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#23 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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Notes to Jhansen & cybersdorf:
Everything I've read has told me that the engine that powered the Chrysler LMP in 2001 (the Dallara chassis) was was derived from a MOPAR sprint car engine with modifications...I assume that it was the 410 CID engine that they reduced the bore and stroke on to make it a 6.0 L engine, but I don't know that for sure....I do know that the USAC Silver Croiwn car engines are the right displacement (about 6.0 L, but they are required to be a production iron block....the World of Outlaws engines and the USAC Sprint division engines are bigger displacement (up to the 410 CID)but I believe that they are allowed to race aluminum blocks.... On the CART engines....the engine that powers Team Nasamax IS a CART engine that Cosworth is providing the tech assistance on to tune it for endurance racing....so it's already in sportscar racing...I am not letting the Team Nasamax results affect my thinking about this engine's potential for sportscars, because they don't race the car enough to learn anything about how to tweak it and get rid of the bugs....you can't learn anything by leaving the car in the garage, and you can learn only so much on a dyno.... Finally...the father of a grade school classmate of mine years ago ran a business that rebuilt carburetors....I watched him adjust the air-fuel mixture settings on the carb for a gasoline engine and then run that engine on lighter fluid instead of gasoline.... Fuel injection systems and electronic engine management units can be programmed to run a combustion engine on a wide variety of fuels....an additional key would be to ensure that the materials that key parts were made of were able to withstand possibile higher operating temps coasued by other fuels burning hotter....but switching an engine form Methanol to Ethanol (both types of alcohol) would be simple to do, and changing it from methanol to gasoline burning would not be difficult...any engine builder could do it... Since I have sidetracked this thread...I'm bringing it back to the Judd... I'd like to see the GV5 used by more teams...there is a reason why Judd created it...more torque than the GV4....hope Henri goes for it... But I think that running a Judd makes you competitive for only one award...Best Non-VAG...I would rather try something different that might give me an edge.... |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series!
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2 Dec 2003, 14:25 (Ref:801504)
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#24 | ||
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Race Official Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 7,618
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problem is there is nothing else available .. the Pug turbo . is . lets say .. a little underpowered .. and the judd engines seams to have more . i mean they toped the speed traps in 2002 .. with four in the top 5(practice) .. so a judd engine is probably the best privateer engine out there ..
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__________________
Apocalypse becomes creation / Gor-Gor shall erase the nation Before you leap into his gizzard / Fall and worship Tyrant lizard Ciao Marco
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2 Dec 2003, 14:37 (Ref:801513)
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#25 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 3,580
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Quote:
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Oops
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