[Official] Saudi Arabian Grand Prix 2022: Grand Prix Weekend Thread - Round 2

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by S griffin

The only thing I can think is Lewis side of the garage went the wrong way on setup.

Lewis has explained the reason. He says that the car was being taken in a certain direction of setup, and it felt (to him) like it was getting near the sweet spot. But his input to the team took the direction too far, and it became difficult to drive.

So it was a setup issue, that is attributed to Lewis.

[Moneyseeker]

Seems a dangerous circuit, is the new Saudi circuit at Riyadh progressing...?

[Taxi645]

I think these new cars also show how dependent a driver is to being able to set acar up to ones liking. Perez like all before him was struggling with a fast but very sensitive car designed around Verstappen's abilities. These years car have much more blunt aerodynamics and instantely Perez is much closer.

[Lancsbreaker]

Heck of a catch by Ocon - so nearly a repeat of Schumachers accident......


Its a scary circuit....

[Beau2]

As feared Mick Schumacher has been ruled out of tomorrow's race. That's a shame. I fancied him to scrape the points.

[Lancsbreaker]

Originally Posted by Beau2

As feared Mick Schumacher has been ruled out of tomorrow's race. That's a shame. I fancied him to scrape the points.

From what Steiner is saying that is more a question of not being able to sort a car - he seemed to think Mick was OK.

[steve_r]

I simply do not believe that this track is safe. Not any better than last year when we saw some terrible crashes in F1 and F2. I hope we come awy without injuries and never go back with this layout.

[Tourer]

Firstly, thank you for a great intro BR - not easy to do on only the 2nd F1 race in a new country but you nailed it, nice work.

Secondly, really pleased to see that MSC is OK after a big shunt - smart move to not race, he'll be feeling pretty seriously 2nd hand on the day after most likely and the team are better to pull the car fully apart & either scrap or repair/replace every component, rather than rebuilding under time pressure and missing something small. It's the reality of these days with no T cars.

Lastly, it seems to me that none of them have yet figured out how to get the most out of the new wheel/tyre size in P and Q - the whole process of getting the tyres up to temp & in the sweet spot is all over the place and I don't think that anyone has nailed it yet - at least not with any certainty from session to session. Some interesting discrepancies between team mates kinda backs up that view - don't know how many races it'll take for them all the get a handle on it but currently it is all pretty wide open - gotta say that I'm loving that.

Oh and fantastic work from Checo - loved seeing a driver so outrageously happy after his Q run, made it even more special.

[Taxi645]

Originally Posted by steve_r

I simply do not believe that this track is safe. Not any better than last year when we saw some terrible crashes in F1 and F2. I hope we come awy without injuries and never go back with this layout.

Personally, like I said last year, I don't understand why after 30 years of rigoreus track and car safety improvements with a clean sheet of paper you would go and design a track as inherently dangerous as this one.

Safety is so important that we accept cars 60 or so kg heavier, but then then sacrifice it at the other end for more commercial media coverage over the "excitement" of this track.

To me it shows a lack of integrity and genuine concern over the safety of the drivers.

[Moneyseeker]

Originally Posted by Taxi645

Personally, like I said last year, I don't understand why after 30 years of rigoreus track and car safety improvements with a clean sheet of paper you would go and design a track as inherently dangerous as this one.



Safety is so important that we accept cars 60 or so kg heavier, but then then sacrifice it at the other end for more commercial media coverage over the "excitement" of this track.



To me it shows a lack of integrity and genuine concern over the safety of the drivers.

Follow the money, as the saying goes...

Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk

[S griffin]

Apparently Max was being investigated for something in qualifying. I assume he hasn't got punished, but what was he investigated for?

[BTCC frog]

Originally Posted by Taxi645

Personally, like I said last year, I don't understand why after 30 years of rigoreus track and car safety improvements with a clean sheet of paper you would go and design a track as inherently dangerous as this one.

Safety is so important that we accept cars 60 or so kg heavier, but then then sacrifice it at the other end for more commercial media coverage over the "excitement" of this track.

To me it shows a lack of integrity and genuine concern over the safety of the drivers.

I agree entirely with this. The track is too dangerous and the country is too dangerous. It makes you wonder just how much money Formula 1 gets from this race.

But it was great to see Perez on pole position, and Horner said the new cars suit him better. This could be the start of him genuinely challenging Verstappen. Ferrari still look strong for now, and Ocon in fifth was a nice surprise. It was a baffling lack of pace from Hamilton, and I suppose he must have had a different setup to Russell, who nonetheless drove a great qualifying session. Bottas now just 0.079s from outqualifying both Mercedes.

[Anyopenroad]

During the BBC R5 chatter durung the red flag (which I endured as I was on a long drive) it was pointedly observed that existing tracks like Spa and Silverstone are being told to spend large amounts on improving safety while street circuits like Baku and Jeddah are seemingly held to very different standards.

Stuart Pringle, Silverstone MD, apparently texted one of the presenters to confirm this (not sure he intended for his message to relayed live on air, but there you go!).

[Greem]

Ignoring the politics and the threat of terrorist attacks for a moment, this thread sums up years of comments from F1 fans about circuits...

Fans: We're bored of anodyne Tilkedromes with miles of tarmac run off!
F1: That's for safety purposes
Fans: Street circuits!
F1: Like Monaco?
Fans: A bit like Monaco, but quicker
F1: *Races in Baku*
Fans: Sort of, but that twiddly bit by the castle is silly and there are too many right angle turns
F1: hrm
Fans: We want some fast, sweeping circuits with some jeopardy!
F1: *builds the Corniche Circuit*
Fans: NOT LIKE THAT!

[steve_r]

What you are doing there is summarising the most extreme reactions, and assuming that each extreme thing have all been said by one single person called "fans".

Whilst it is quite amusing, it fails to take into account the fact that "fans" are made up of millions of people, some with extreme opinions either way, and some with more middle of the road thoughts on all of the issues summaried. It also diminishes genuine safely concerns of many, who dont want to see F1 regress to levels of safety more akin to past eras.

Last years incidents and crashes combined with this years incidents have convinced me and seemingly plenty of others that this is unsafe. You should not end up in hospital beacuse you clipped a curb. F1 can never be totally safe, but this tracks blind corners and absulte lack of run off and massive high speed sections look inherantly unsafe. I am thankful that Schumacher is OK and I hope that we end the weekend with no more drivers in hospital.

[BTCC frog]

Originally Posted by Greem

Ignoring the politics and the threat of terrorist attacks for a moment, this thread sums up years of comments from F1 fans about circuits...

Fans: We're bored of anodyne Tilkedromes with miles of tarmac run off!
F1: That's for safety purposes
Fans: Street circuits!
F1: Like Monaco?
Fans: A bit like Monaco, but quicker
F1: *Races in Baku*
Fans: Sort of, but that twiddly bit by the castle is silly and there are too many right angle turns
F1: hrm
Fans: We want some fast, sweeping circuits with some jeopardy!
F1: *builds the Corniche Circuit*
Fans: NOT LIKE THAT!

I think fans generally like circuits with grass or gravel runoff, the level between tarmac and walls. Almost all of the most popular circuits have this: Spa, Monza, Silverstone, Suzuka, Interlagos, Red Bull Ring, Zandvoort, Hungaroring. The exception is of course Monaco, which is popular for its unique nature. Montreal and Albert Park perhaps are other exceptions as the walls are usually close there, but it is far less dangerous than Jeddah as most incidents will involve hitting the wall lightly from the side and moving forward with it so the change in speed will be considerably less than Schumacher's in Jeddah (Kubica in 2007 was the exception but that is very rare). COTA is another popular track with runoffs, but I think that is because it is still far more of a challenge to drive than the likes of Abu Dhabi or Paul Ricard, despite the runoffs.

[Mike Harte]

Sometimes it is easy to please some, and just as easy to displease some; and I fear that F1 and the tracks it visits falls in to that category.

Take Canada for example. pretty well universally liked, yet it has one corner that has caught out multiple drivers, including WDCs on occasions, and that is the exit from the left hand corner right before the pits' straight where there is a wall greeting the cars.

Countless drivers have finished their races at that point, with others being able to carry on after a fairly light brush against the wall.

Circuits should be challenging, and it up to the drivers to navigate them safely. Unfortunately most of the crashes occur when the drivers push the boundaries by a fairly minute amount. That is not the fault of the circuits.

[Greem]

My tongue was firmly in my cheek.

Do bear in mind that muggins here spends a lot of time behind a variety of barriers, fences and walls trying to ensure that people do not get hurt. That specific corner is an awful compromise IMO in terms of layout - and I imagine the probability of an accident like Schumacher's was "one in a million". The problem with one in a million probabilities is that they can happen early or late in that million.

I tend to agree that the circuit is dangerous, but all circuits are to a greater or lesser degree. If this track is ever used again, that corner will be changed.

[Alan52]

Magic lap by Sergio.Max seemed to be having repeated problems with warm up both in practice and the race.
Ferrari looks strong.Those people who picked them as constructors champions would be feeling pleased with themselves.
Alpine are this weekends big improvers.Both cars consistently strong and both drivers looking very confident in post qualifying incidents.
I truly hope this is the last race in Saudi Arabia.Stupidly dangerous circuit and buddying up with people who 2 weeks ago beheaded 81 people is not a good look for anyone.

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by Greem

I tend to agree that the circuit is dangerous, but all circuits are to a greater or lesser degree. If this track is ever used again, that corner will be changed.

I don't know quite what it is Graeme, but I have the same feeling of trepidation watching the coverage this season as I did for the race last season. It just feels dangerous - the cars look 'ragged' and the margins by which they're just missing walls seems pretty darned fine to me. I don't recall another circuit leaving me feeling this way for a very long time (if at all). Perhaps it's just me? I get the 'they know the circuit and they should drive within it's limitations', but these are F1 drivers desperate to get a winning advantage. They will always push to the limit and for some drivers (in some cars right now) that limit is going to get crossed. I don't buy the 'not the fault of the circuit' argument. F1 should not race on circuits where pushing beyond the limit has such likely calamitous outcomes as drivers will always have to find the limit, and at this level with these stakes you only do that by going beyond it - even if only once. I'm really hoping for an accident free race.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by BTCC frog

It makes you wonder just how much money Formula 1 gets from this race.

I read an "article" yesterday that suggested the payment is $50M .

Presumably the real numbers for the total trip are, one way or another, a great deal more than that.

[Moneyseeker]

Originally Posted by steve_r

What you are doing there is summarising the most extreme reactions, and assuming that each extreme thing have all been said by one single person called "fans".

Whilst it is quite amusing, it fails to take into account the fact that "fans" are made up of millions of people, some with extreme opinions either way, and some with more middle of the road thoughts on all of the issues summaried. It also diminishes genuine safely concerns of many, who dont want to see F1 regress to levels of safety more akin to past eras.

Last years incidents and crashes combined with this years incidents have convinced me and seemingly plenty of others that this is unsafe. You should not end up in hospital beacuse you clipped a curb. F1 can never be totally safe, but this tracks blind corners and absulte lack of run off and massive high speed sections look inherantly unsafe. I am thankful that Schumacher is OK and I hope that we end the weekend with no more drivers in hospital.

We will be doing well to get the race completed without at least some safety cars and probably red flag(s).

Terribe and unsafe circuit, rushed through (it still wasn't complete for last years race) in order for F1 to start a lucrative deal with the Saudis whilst their shiny new one was being built (have they started on it yet?)

A street circuit with concrete walls as fast as Monza is nothing to be proud of, quite how the FIA can have passed it fit for F1 is a wonder?

[dcp2685]

Originally Posted by Alan52

Magic lap by Sergio.Max seemed to be having repeated problems with warm up both in practice and the race.
Ferrari looks strong.Those people who picked them as constructors champions would be feeling pleased with themselves.
Alpine are this weekends big improvers.Both cars consistently strong and both drivers looking very confident in post qualifying incidents.
I truly hope this is the last race in Saudi Arabia.Stupidly dangerous circuit and buddying up with people who 2 weeks ago beheaded 81 people is not a good look for anyone.

I completely agree. Probably also doesn't help that the track looks like a scimitar.....

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Moneyseeker

A street circuit with concrete walls as fast as Monza is nothing to be proud of, quite how the FIA can have passed it fit for F1 is a wonder?

Highest speed at Jeddah - 322km/h
Highest speed at Baku (Concrete walls) - 378km/h

It's always interesting to see the 'lens' through which certain circuits are viewed.

I have not heard many calls for Spa-Francorchamps to be removed from the calendar, but the circuit has undergone extensive revamps to make Raidillon a safe place to race.

So should the same approach not be made with Jeddah? Rather than call for an immediate ban on racing there, the question should be how to make it safer - surely?

[chillibowl]

only 18 cars taking the grid?

when was the last time that happened?