Winter Projects

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

These things were permitted for the Capri whereas they aren't for the Rover. All due to the manufacturer certificates presented to the RAC by Ford but not by Rover.

Dont think I'm thick head here (agreed, I often am…) but does this mean that each model or/and make had special agreements to compete in the Grp1,5 category, meaning that its hard to be understood if you're not deeply involved in?
Short words: you keep your ex-works SD1 as was in period, compliant, having a new HTP form filled from what you have not what you could have. Right? If any other SD1 was legally more developed than yours, engaged in an international series, proofs of period brought, all legal, you could have yours to the same state of tuning (may be have to change the livery?). Right? Could you keep the same HTP front page with only red pen marks written by an official scrutineer after this kind of alterations?
Apart from Blue Book, do you know someone ready to supply a copy of what Ford got from RAC and how much it would cost?

As to your Rover I consider being a piece of history, its not about what you could do but what you're allowed to do. Keeping her as was is a respectable and courageous choice, you dont go the easy way. No misunderstanding here, I hope. Yes?

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

............. does this mean that each model or/and make had special agreements to compete in the Grp1,5 category, meaning that its hard to be understood if you're not deeply involved in?

Remember this was for the BSCC but yes, the certificates provided "enhanced" accessories such as those drop links, 48IDA etc. I've seen copies of the certificates produced by Ford. Some of those were later homologated for Group 1 (that carb again). I believe only Ford produced them at the request of the teams.

Originally Posted by Gerard C

Short words: you keep your ex-works SD1 as was in period, compliant, having a new HTP form filled from what you have not what you could have. Right? If any other SD1 was legally more developed than yours, engaged in an international series, proofs of period brought, all legal, you could have yours to the same state of tuning (may be have to change the livery?). Right? Could you keep the same HTP front page with only red pen marks written by an official scrutineer after this kind of alterations?

Yes as was remarked at Oulton Park, my HTP has no red marks, and the engine is sealed.

Originally Posted by Gerard C

Apart from Blue Book, do you know someone ready to supply a copy of what Ford got from RAC and how much it would cost?

I know Martin Thomas has some but he was a constructor. Not sure he's willing to sell them though, he's always worth talking to though for reasons other than these certificates. Again Ric W will have some copies, if not an original.

Originally Posted by Gerard C

As to your Rover I consider being a piece of history, its not about what you could do but what you're allowed to do. Keeping her as was is a respectable and courageous choice, you dont go the easy way. No misunderstanding here, I hope. Yes?

Understood. As long as the punters realise the differences and that's always a problem hence at Goodwood it really isn't competitive anymore.

[Gerard C]

I can't imagine your feelings when at Goodwood. Keeping the Rover as she is, you have no other choice than have a good weekend forgetting about victory. Match a pro lap time same day, same track, same everything brings proof in the pudding. I had the immense privilege to share a - very bad - L'Tina with Simon Hadfield and I can tell you that more than one month before all my nights were short ones… in spite of my experience in endurance where your first "enemy" is your team mate. I'll go to Ric he knows my car and my face but its hard for him to relate those to my name. Anyway, I've absolutely no past due there! Few months ago, I sent him a copy of our regulation and some others too.
Tanks for your help.
Still I dont understand why in my country they dont want to adopt your regulation. On the contrary, they went for Production '81 rules, not one of the best year ever…

Other mode:
what will be your New Year eve menu, Chef? Spare ribs with apple juice may be… Dites nous tout pour que nous ne restions pas sur notre faim!

[zefarelly]

Well I've not been holidaying much, too much stuff to do . . . . although may have a pint tonight.

[delta]

No 2 Toyota engine up and running sounding sweet. I've had pistons machined and just this minuet run her up much to Mrs Delta annoyance. Rolling road but probably not until I get back from lower hemisphere. Then if all is good and I can earn some money this year I will enter Louis Historic F3 Cup race at Zandvoort.

[delta]

So far we have rear axel , I’ve located a shell in Belgium which we can collect when I get back from Oz . Just on my way back to work with a 1760 BDA. Hmmmm might change my mind about the 1300 idea .

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by delta

So far we have rear axel , I’ve located a shell in Belgium which we can collect when I get back from Oz . Just on my way back to work with a 1760 BDA. Hmmmm might change my mind about the 1300 idea .

Good on you, Iain.

Now you can create a proper Escort; a Special Saloon!

[Gerard C]

In other words a french Group One…

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Good on you, Iain.

Now you can create a proper Escort; a Special Saloon!

Won’t need the shell then! Probably cheaper to build a space frame and hang a few fibreglass panels on it. Guess you’ve got a few single seater suspension bits lying around as well....

Coincidentally Canary’s shell came from Belgium, rot-free in all the important places. Strange as they their winters are no kinder on cars than ours...

[andy97]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

In other words a french Group One…

Where is the “Like” button??!!

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Won’t need the shell then! Probably cheaper to build a space frame and hang a few fibreglass panels on it. Guess you’ve got a few single seater suspension bits lying around as well....

I said proper, like wot we did in the 60s and very early 70s. As far as we knew, a space frame hadn't been invented! But will give you the fibreglass as most of us had them for our bonnet and boot lids, along with aluminium door skins for some of us.

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

I said proper, like wot we did in the 60s and very early 70s. As far as we knew, a space frame hadn't been invented! But will give you the fibreglass as most of us had them for our bonnet and boot lids, along with aluminium door skins for some of us.

I appreciate that, Mike. Super/Special Saloons in the early days!

[Gerard C]

And after all this, dont be surprised if the Boss comes back asking: where can I race it?

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

I appreciate that, Mike. Super/Special Saloons in the early days!

And Dave Brodie is currently having the original 'Run, Baby, Run' Escort shell incorporated into a car that should be taking to the tracks this year. When he stopped racing the car back then, he dumped the bare shell in an unused barn on a friend's farm, and on a whim went back there last year to find that it was still there, untouched.

Although he won't be going down the space frame route, he has bowed to the modern ways of doing things, and the car will have a sequential g/box plus other bits and pieces that didn't exist back then.

[delta]

I am afraid the shell is full of rust Mike. Real shame as I did have a sports 2000 tub years ago. I gave it away. Still think I would rather carry on with the 1300.

[zefarelly]

As did one of my Cortina, never welded. The weather may be average but everyone has a barn!

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Won’t need the shell then! Probably cheaper to build a space frame and hang a few fibreglass panels on it. Guess you’ve got a few single seater suspension bits lying around as well....

Coincidentally Canary’s shell came from Belgium, rot-free in all the important places. Strange as they their winters are no kinder on cars than ours...

[Gerard C]

Delta when you say 1300 I guess you mean a BDE or something like that. If its a screamer you'll have to rev it. Imagine that one day all the twincam engines are restricted in revs what will happen? Just a thought.

[delta]

I raced in F4 in the 70''s and 80's with 1300 cross flow. We revved them pretty hard. Mind you I blew a few up as well.

[PeterMorley]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Won’t need the shell then! Probably cheaper to build a space frame and hang a few fibreglass panels on it. Guess you’ve got a few single seater suspension bits lying around as well....

Coincidentally Canary’s shell came from Belgium, rot-free in all the important places. Strange as they their winters are no kinder on cars than ours...

Sounds like the Anglia on racecars direct - carbon fibre bodied, spaceframe with 630 Bhp.
Possibly an acceptable celebrity car for Goodwood!

Belgium also uses a lot more salt in winter so really surprising it is rot free - except the mot equivalent doesn't like any rust, none of this it isn't structural business.

[zefarelly]

They're bullet proof with a few tweeks . . . . and yes, very good power for what is essentially a cheap race engine. most underrated and arguably the best factory bottom end in the Ford/kent line.

Originally Posted by delta

I raced in F4 in the 70''s and 80's with 1300 cross flow. We revved them pretty hard. Mind you I blew a few up as well.

[andy97]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

They're bullet proof with a few tweeks . . . . and yes, very good power for what is essentially a cheap race engine. most underrated and arguably the best factory bottom end in the Ford/kent line.

Isnt the Crossflow block the basis for the BDA range?

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by andy97

Isnt the Crossflow block the basis for the BDA range?

Yes.. My RS1600 road car engine was built on a crossflow 711M iron block. The crank is different (longer) in order to take the cam belt pulley, but I think even that can be got over if you want.

Obviously the alloy block that was homologated for the RS1600 later in 1972 changed things.

[Gerard C]

Just a thought, may be you could find one or two homologation forms to help delta before he starts the building.

[zefarelly]

Changed things, like when they find their way into elans/ginettas and possibly even the odd lotus Cortina

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Yes.. My RS1600 road car engine was built on a crossflow 711M iron block. The crank is different (longer) in order to take the cam belt pulley, but I think even that can be got over if you want.

Obviously the alloy block that was homologated for the RS1600 later in 1972 changed things.

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

Changed things, like when they find their way into elans/ginettas and possibly even the odd lotus Cortina

Bit of special ‘magnetic’ paint and job done!

Did the standard RS 1.6 litre alloy block have an outside oil feed from the pump to the gallery the other side, or is that only on 2 litre blocks? It is a bit of a give-away....