GTE/GTLM 2016 discussion - Page 5

Deleted · 25 Jun 2015, 10:55 (Ref:3553833)

They will do the roof hatch + IIRC new floor, and whatever else ACO might demand but nothing really more, obviously the one and only reason that car has continued to be competitive, and will be competitive next year as well is because of extremely generous BoP. They will match the Ford, new Ferrari, updated C7.R, Porsche with whatever they have, because of it. People aren't afraid of cars now (as someone said in the Ford thread), they are afraid of specs given to them

deggis · 25 Jun 2015, 11:53 (Ref:3553843)

So I take it you don't approve these regs anymore than you approved GTE (been waiting for you to post in this thread

).

One promise/idea from was to have more freedom, but less waivers, and "Cars will be expected to fit into very tight performance window" (url)... but what when they don't?

Coach Ep · 25 Jun 2015, 14:39 (Ref:3553880)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiana

They will do the roof hatch + IIRC new floor, and whatever else ACO might demand but nothing really more, obviously the one and only reason that car has continued to be competitive, and will be competitive next year as well is because of extremely generous BoP. They will match the Ford, new Ferrari, updated C7.R, Porsche with whatever they have, because of it. People aren't afraid of cars now (as someone said in the Ford thread), they are afraid of specs given to them

I'm pretty sure next year's BoP for the big race will favor Ford and Ferrari as they revive their old rivalry. Without a new car neither Aston, Porsche and Corvette stand a chance. Besides, AM had their chances to take victory at LM in both GTE classes this year but blew it - of no fault of the ACO.

Here was the 'news' about the updated cars:

Aston: http://sportscar365.com/gt/aston-mar...w-car-in-2018/

Corvette: http://sportscar365.com/industry/che...c7-r-for-2016/

Deleted · 25 Jun 2015, 15:35 (Ref:3553891)

Quote:

Originally Posted by deggis

So I take it you don't approve these regs anymore than you approved GTE (been waiting for you to post in this thread

).

One promise/idea from was to have more freedom, but less waivers, and "Cars will be expected to fit into very tight performance window" (url)... but what when they don't?

I approve the apparent boost in overall performance levels. And that the sub classes aren't total clones of each other - well at least for one year...

Everything else sounds just as crap and superficial as before. I think if it weren't for ACO dumbing down LMP2 I would be more happy as I'd still have two classes to enjoy, but as it stands there is only LMP1 in few years time.

Well I say "only" but as it stands P1 now is pretty magnificient, so I guess it's not too bad...

deggis · 25 Jun 2015, 21:09 (Ref:3553948)

Quote:

Originally Posted by morningview66

Aston Martin: Hindy for RLM mentioned that he had seen the '16 Aston and noted that he liked how the cars were going back to looking more production spec. (im not 100% sure if I am remembering this correctly)

Looking at the Ford GT, how does that make sense...

morningview66 · 25 Jun 2015, 22:26 (Ref:3553971)

Quote:

Originally Posted by deggis

Looking at the Ford GT, how does that make sense...

Funny say this because after hearing Hindys comments and seeing the Ford GT thats exactly what i thought.

Maybe i misheard him or he got it wrong somehow, but he was talking about about how then new GT3's are far more agressive/modified than the road car versions e.g. Lamborghini Hurcan and Audi R8. Whereas the GTE will look more like the road cars.

Maybe its just the Aston, its kindof crazy that the car started out in 2007/08, has gone through two rule changes/upgrades and will be 10 years old by the time its replaced.
Looking at its BoP the ACO/FIA are keeping the car competitive so they dont loose Aston from the championship.

TF110 · 25 Jun 2015, 23:12 (Ref:3553975)

The sc365 article confirms the car will be 'new' next year. Updated bodywork isnt too big of an expense for Aston. Hope its reminiscent of the dbr9, thatd be great!

Articus · 26 Jun 2015, 02:18 (Ref:3553988)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TF110

The sc365 article confirms the car will be 'new' next year. Updated bodywork isnt too big of an expense for Aston. Hope its reminiscent of the dbr9, thatd be great!

It very well might. Front splitters and rear diffusers are set to GROW with the new ruleset.

Pole2Win · 26 Jun 2015, 05:35 (Ref:3554004)

How are turbo cars regulated by the ACO? We haven't had any in GTE in a long time, and I believe it was because the regulations were too restrictive, which made Porsche abandon its 911 GT2 long ago.

Sorry if it's a pedestrian question. It's honest.

MitchZ06 · 26 Jun 2015, 06:15 (Ref:3554008)

Turbo engines can only be a maximum of 4litres capacity, 8 cylinders maximum. Believe the road going turbo system was required to be used (no race turbo like in GT3) so many mfgers were reluctant to go down the 'homologation special' route.

Pole2Win · 26 Jun 2015, 06:52 (Ref:3554016)

Quote:

Originally Posted by MitchZ06

Turbo engines can only be a maximum of 4litres capacity, 8 cylinders maximum. Believe the road going turbo system was required to be used (no race turbo like in GT3) so many mfgers were reluctant to go down the 'homologation special' route.

The bolded part is the most important, I think. Porsche for example would have no problems making a 4 litre, 6-cylinder turbo engine. The turbo 911s use different engines from the GT3 and don't go past 3,8 litres, too.

The 488 GTB has a 3,9 litre V8 engine, and the Ford GT has a 3,5 litre V6 engine, so they are within the rules. I really don't think more than 8 cylinders is necessary for a turbo to be competitive. BMW would have problems since the S63 in the M6 is 4,4 litre I think, but they don't seem interested anyway (more like they don't have an eligible car, actually, since their current effort is a Frankenstein with Z4 body and E92 M3 engine). McLaren could make a GTE with the 650S's current engine.

Bob Baldwin · 29 Jun 2015, 19:37 (Ref:3554775)

Well Nothing new here , Moving right along !!!

**joeb** · 30 Jun 2015, 01:16 (Ref:3554817)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Baldwin

Well Nothing new here , Moving right along !!!

Other than the Ford's upcoming testing, not much has been in the news regarding 2016. I expect by August we will start to hear some things as the BOP test is to take place in September I believe?

Just to recap we expect GTE cars from:

Ferrari
Corvette
Ford
Porsche
Aston

With possible IMSA specials (or otherwise) from

BMW
Bentley
McLaren

Did I miss any?

tux · 30 Jun 2015, 01:27 (Ref:3554818)

I just wish ACO/SRO would get together and if not agree ONE set of GT rules at the very least allow teams to take a GT3 car and upgrade it to a GTE. It just seems a logical thing.

**joeb** · 30 Jun 2015, 02:13 (Ref:3554825)

Quote:

Originally Posted by tux

I just wish ACO/SRO would get together and if not agree ONE set of GT rules at the very least allow teams to take a GT3 car and upgrade it to a GTE. It just seems a logical thing.

They tried to get together on this and failed. Seemed to be mostly on how to control the performance of the cars. ACO still wanted restritors and SRO wanted something else which I can't remember.

But I agree, it would be so much easier with a (more) common platform.

Accident · 30 Jun 2015, 07:31 (Ref:3554846)

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeb

They tried to get together on this and failed. Seemed to be mostly on how to control the performance of the cars. ACO still wanted restritors and SRO wanted something else which I can't remember.

But I agree, it would be so much easier with a (more) common platform.

I believe GTE manufacturers wanted restrictors because it allows them to still do development work with the engine to gain an advantage. The electronic torque sensor things that the GT3 manufacturers wanted would remove the ability to develop the engine and make a few more horsepower as the torque sensor would just catch it and the car would be penalized.

Basically it was manufacturers in GTE wanting to use their money on development to gain an edge, while GT3 manufacturers wanted to save money by not needing to try to develop more power so that selling GT3 cars is more profitable.

Or at least that's how I understood it.

deggis · 30 Jun 2015, 12:27 (Ref:3554887)

I remember it like that too. I don't know if it was that clear cut in reality between ACO vs SRO and their manufactuters, but the torque metering would certainly be more BoP-friendly...

Akrapovic · 30 Jun 2015, 12:31 (Ref:3554888)

I don't see teams like Aston Martin voting for a system that allows better regulation of the BOP.

YZFrider · 30 Jun 2015, 14:59 (Ref:3554914)

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeb

Other than the Ford's upcoming testing, not much has been in the news regarding 2016. I expect by August we will start to hear some things as the BOP test is to take place in September I believe?

Just to recap we expect GTE cars from:

Ferrari
Corvette
Ford
Porsche
Aston

With possible IMSA specials (or otherwise) from

BMW
Bentley
McLaren

Did I miss any?

Deltawing GT?

seanyb505 · 30 Jun 2015, 15:20 (Ref:3554916)

^lol

How terrible of an idea would it be to drastically lower the overall pace of GT3? Thinking back to GT1/GT2 days, the top GT2 cars would never challenge the top GT1 cars at any point of the circuit. I might be wrong, but I can't say the same for GTE and GT3.

Knock GT3 down a few pegs. It should make the class less expensive, safer for the Ring, and having GT3 and GTE cars on the same track a non-issue.

Stupid idea?

MitchZ06 · 30 Jun 2015, 15:24 (Ref:3554918)

Instead, GTE (under new GT Premium regs next year) have gotten faster as the ACO wants their cars to be faster than the GT3s.

seanyb505 · 30 Jun 2015, 15:29 (Ref:3554920)

I haven't researched the increase in overall speed, and maybe this has been discussed.

Won't faster GTLM cars make PC, delta wing and the Mazdas that much more irritating?

deggis · 30 Jun 2015, 16:01 (Ref:3554940)

Quote:

Originally Posted by seanyb505

I haven't researched the increase in overall speed, and maybe this has been discussed.

Won't faster GTLM cars make PC, delta wing and the Mazdas that much more irritating?

http://tentenths.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=485

Will not be an issue for ACO P2s because they're also going to be 3-4 secs faster.

Coach Ep · 30 Jun 2015, 16:36 (Ref:3554957)

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeb

Other than the Ford's upcoming testing, not much has been in the news regarding 2016. I expect by August we will start to hear some things as the BOP test is to take place in September I believe?

Just to recap we expect GTE cars from:

Ferrari
Corvette
Ford
Porsche
Aston

With possible IMSA specials (or otherwise) from

BMW
Bentley
McLaren

Did I miss any?

I think we can move BMW up to the 'expected' category (IMSA only):

http://www.dailysportscar.com/2015/0...-to-churn.html

**joeb** · 30 Jun 2015, 17:34 (Ref:3554979)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

I think we can move BMW up to the 'expected' category (IMSA only):

http://www.dailysportscar.com/2015/0...-to-churn.html

Thanks, I missed that article. Interesting to hear of the testing issues as well.

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