Ferrari and Sauber sharing more than everyone thought

[Jukebox]

Taken from the New Straits Times Malaysia...

A POTENTIALLY devastating two-pronged attack is brewing in Formula One with Sauber-Petronas lending credence to suspicions that they may be lining up a programme to serve as Ferrari’s back-up team.


Although it has been announced that the two stables are in a closer relationship than previously, there seems to be more than what meets the eye.

Already, Sauber have been upgraded to running current spec Ferrari engines in their C23s this year besides being the only other team rolling on Bridgestone rubber, apart from Ferrari.

The C23’s design is also suspiciously similar to that of Ferrari’s F2003GA, which the Maranello outfit ran last year. But to be fair, Sauber have in their set-up a spanking new US$55 million (RM209 million) wind tunnel that would put Ferrari to shame and that had contributed considerably to the production of the C23.

To top it all, the first shipment of F1 equipment and cars brought in for the Petronas Formula One Malaysian Grand Prix on March 19-21, arrived at the Kuala Lumpur International Airport (KLIA) Cargo Terminal at 9.50am yesterday.

The Malaysia Airlines Cargo (MAS Cargo) flight MH6412 from Melbourne, Australia, brought in 38 containers belonging to Ferrari and Sauber.

Now, it seems, they are even sharing the same cargo flight, and checking in at the Sepang Circuit at the same time.
Malaysia Airlines cargo operations general manager Mohamed Yunus Idris confirmed that the two teams will even share the same cargo flight to Bahrain on March 24.

"We were actually expecting the flight to come in at noon, but somehow it was rearranged. Luckily, we were well prepared to handle the cargo. Fortunately too, it didn’t rain as this is extremely sensitive cargo," said Yunus.
Ferrari had signed Sauber driver Felipe Massa as their test driver last year, and this year the Brazilian is back with a seat at Sauber alongside Giancarlo Fisichella.

Although there aren’t any indications whether world champion Michael Schumacher or Rubens Barrichello will be replaced, Fisichella has often been linked with a move to Ferrari before the end of his carreer.

That combination of Italian driver and machine is what Italians would perceive as ideal, and 31-year old Fisichella could finally be lining himself up with just that.

All that makes for interesting speculation, but the results thus far seem to indicate otherwise.

Ferrari homed in on an easy one-two finish with Schumacher and Barrichello in the Australian Grand Prix last weekend, while Sauber capped a less than encouraging start to the season with Fisichella finishing 10th and Massa retiring with 14 laps to go.

The Malaysian Grand Prix next week, regarded as Sauber’s ‘home race’, could produce a proper indication of how deep the bond between the two teams really is.

[Wrex]

Originally posted by Jukebox
Already, Sauber have been upgraded to running current spec Ferrari engines in their C23s this year besides being the only other team rolling on Bridgestone rubber, apart from Ferrari.

I think the fact checker needs a kick in the bum, or this is a good indicator of the accuracy of the rest of the story.

Originally posted by Jukebox
The Malaysia Airlines Cargo (MAS Cargo) flight MH6412 from Melbourne, Australia, brought in 38 containers belonging to Ferrari and Sauber.

Now, it seems, they are even sharing the same cargo flight, and checking in at the Sepang Circuit at the same time.

I noticed McLaren and Williams did this at Melbourne. Should I call the FIA now?


FWIW, if the Sauber is a Ferrari copy someone needs to shout Peter some new carbon paper.

[ysofast]

It did sound like someone wanted the gloves to hit the ice before the puck eh. Sorry couldn't help it. It was slanted a bit, but would it be posted here if it wasn't?

[mark_l]

"Already, Sauber have been upgraded to running current spec Ferrari engines in their C23s this year besides being the only other team rolling on Bridgestone rubber, apart from Ferrari."

What about Minardi's tyres, are they still running on Avon?

[Wrex]

Jordan are just using the rims as well

[Fogelhund]

Having noted the inaccuracies, I for one wish that there were more such teams running. If each of the big teams had "B" teams running year old chassis with upgrades, it surely would be good for the grid.

[Mal]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jukebox
[B]Taken from the New Straits Times Malaysia...

[B]
Already, Sauber have been upgraded to running current spec Ferrari engines in their C23s this year besides being the only other team rolling on Bridgestone rubber, apart from Ferrari.

The reason Sauber has to run the same spec engine this year is due to the rule changes as last years engine wouldnt be suitable for the one engine rule.

That was anounced long ago.

Besides I thought last year they were encouraging the big teams to sell on their chassis to the small teams.

[Redblurr]

...there is bound to be communication, you don't spend millions on an engine without being allowed to talk to the manufacturer

[1200Datto27]

Also,

Sauber and Ferrari are geographically close to each other, making it easy to arrange shipping together. However, coming to Australia, it was Ferrari and Minardi together.

[Armco Bender]

A POTENTIALLY devastating two-pronged attack is brewing in Formula One with Sauber-Petronas lending credence to suspicions that they may be lining up a programme to serve as Ferrari’s back-up team.

"Holy Bat Robin,to the Batmobile quickly"

Even my dog knows they are more or less one team,did this super slueth get an all expense paid junket trip to Italy to uncover these startling revelations that with shake f1 as we know it to the core?.
I think Ferraris one pronged attack is doing exceptionally well from what I have seen so far,must have been a quiet news week in Malaysia if thats all they could have come up with

[Gt_R]

Sorry Jukebox, I'm often on your side regarding Ferrari matters, but frankly, i don't trust that article.

I mean, it's not just Malaysia, but you know Singapore's New Paper? probably they have this "sports journalists" who is a jack of all trade, master of none. And more often than not, they string their relatively pathetic knowledge to form an article to provide coverage of a sports event- just for the sake of it.

Other posters had noted all the wrong "facts", or rather i'd call them assumptions and wrong knowledge. All these mistakes are blatantly obvious to us, but i doubt the guy who wrote it knew any better.

Let's just stick to itv-f1, F1-racing, Formula1.com for more reliable news.

[Bononi]

Bah, just some people trying to make some money...

[golem]

Or pitpass?

[Mr V]

It makes sense (to me) that Ferrari upgrade Sauber to the latest engine spec, that way Ferrari proberbly get more definate results when they use Saubers wind tunnel!

[Jukebox]

that's why i pasted the whole article in here.....shows of how ignorant a sports writer could be

the windtunnel part might be makin sense....

[Cougar]

Originally posted by Jukebox

The C23’s design is also suspiciously similar to that of Ferrari’s F2003GA, which the Maranello outfit ran last year. But to be fair, Sauber have in their set-up a spanking new US$55 million (RM209 million) wind tunnel that would put Ferrari to shame and that had contributed considerably to the production of the C23.

$55 Million! Thats mighty exspensive wind! Have they not heard of baked beans?

[Snrub]

Let's say for a moment that Sauber and Ferrari are violating the rules, or just doing enough to not quiet violate the rules. Why the heck is the Sauber so slow? The F2003 was clearly faster than the new Sauber. They're obviously sharing, they've admitted that much, but I don't see the fruit of the joint venture.

[Knowlesy]

Originally posted by Cougar21
$55 Million! Thats mighty exspensive wind! Have they not heard of baked beans?

That could simulate the dirty air effect!

[Dutton]

Whatever the situation with regards the level of information exchange going on between Ferari and Sauber, I would say it is certainly not going to contravene the rules. Ferrari will have put a lot of lawyers on the job to see how far it can go, as they would not wnat to jepordise themselves - it just wouldn't be worth it, for whatever benefits might be present.

[GP Racer]

One thing these two teams will never share are... wins!

[Kirk]

Originally posted by Dutton
Whatever the situation with regards the level of information exchange going on between Ferari and Sauber, I would say it is certainly not going to contravene the rules. Ferrari will have put a lot of lawyers on the job to see how far it can go, as they would not wnat to jepordise themselves - it just wouldn't be worth it, for whatever benefits might be present.

When I read comments like this it makes me sick to think that F1 teams go to this extreme to cheat. I'm not sure how accurate this observation is but it speaks volumes as to the state and direction of contemporary Formula 1. No wonder F1 seems to get at least as much ink in the business section as in the sports section, here in Canada.

[Skam85]

Yeh, I heard that BBC will show a Ferrari-Sauber wife swap special this week....

[Glen]

Originally posted by Kirk
When I read comments like this it makes me sick to think that F1 teams go to this extreme to cheat. I'm not sure how accurate this observation is but it speaks volumes as to the state and direction of contemporary Formula 1. No wonder F1 seems to get at least as much ink in the business section as in the sports section, here in Canada.

Well, duh - it doesn't mean they go to extremes to cheat - it means they go to extremes to ensure that they don't break the rules. The "cheat" part is merely your assumption.

The difference in performance between the two is evidence in itself that it isn't nearly enough to have a near-duplicate car - so what's the problem?

[climb]

And, what is more, why should a leader team like Ferrari, need the help of a way smaller outfit like Sauber?
OK the Swiss have set up a new windtunnel, and so what?
It needn't sucha partnership to ensure the use of such an innovative device: a good discount on engines price could have been enough...

[Gt_R]

One thing i find illogical is how people believe that Ferrari actually "cheats" with Sauber, and that they NEED Sauber's help just because Sauber have a new windtunnel, space to run a third driver etc.

Having the newest windtunnel that runs larger scale models or having rolling roads doesn't take anything away from the fact that Ferrari have a very impressive windtunnel of their own which is modern and more than sufficient to handle the needs of Ferrari.

There's no question whatsoever as to whether Ferrari broke any rules or go beyond the limits of sportsmanship. And unless there's any reasons to justify, such assumptions really are pointless.

Sports journalists ought to practice some self-respect.