AUSTRIA'S Trivia - Lap 6

[AUSTRIA]

TIMEOUT !!!

The Questions will be given on Friday, May 5th, 18:00 o'clock - as usually.

Sorry for the delay ...

E.T.

[AUSTRIA]

We are back again !

So don't forget: today evening, 18:00 o'clock

[TimD]

Looking forward to it.

I have my references honed and ready!

[AUSTRIA]

Tim, it will be a great honest to have you in my trivia, competing for the first time . I missed you in the former laps.

Here you go ...

Question A)
The European Champions of Formula 2: Which three drivers succeeded afterwards best in Formula 1 ?
Of course as usual the names will be not enough to score.

Question B)
An interesting thing was the new reglement for Formula 1 for 1966 and the following years, the change to the 3-liter-engines. How did Lotus manage this problem? (Hope you have a lot of time

Question C)
A very interesting team brought in a car for Colin Davis for two GPs. Which team was it and what make and type of a car did they enter? I'm deeply intrigued in a brief story about the team.

Wish you some pleasaing hours.

[TimD]

Heh heh! Just because I posted nothing to the previous five laps, does not mean I wasn't competing. It's just that everyone else beat me to the few answers that I knew.

Regard me as a competitor with 0 points. The Andrea Moda of Austria's Trivia, if you will...!

Now... Question C. I might be able to do that... see ya later, I'm off to my Motor Sports.

[Testa Rossa]

Question C

Colin Davis was seen driving a Cooper-Maserati T51 (F2/12/59) during the ACF GP and Italian GP in 1959. (he had already tasted Formula 1 racing at the Modena GP in 1957 in Horace Gould’s 250 F) The Cooper was engaged by the Scuderia Centro-Sud, founded by Signor “Mimo” Dei.

The team debut were I think in 1955 with a Ferrari 625 F1 for Scarlatti. For 1956, 1957, 1958, they engaged several 250 F Maseratis in virtually every GP for drivers like Gregory, Bonnier or Villoresi. From 1959 to 1962, they used Cooper T51 and T53 fited with Maserati 4 cylinders. In 1963 they had a P57 BRM for Bandini and Scuderia Centro-Sud was listed as entrant for several Ferrari 250 GTO. In 1964, the P57s were used by Maggs and Baghetti. The team also played with the ATS berlinetta that year. 1965 saw the old P57s again used, mostly by Baghetti. I think it was the last year for the Scuderia Centro-Sud.

Testa Rossa

[AUSTRIA]

Poor Tim ...


... but there is opportunity to get points for some more 'additional stuff', come on !


[This message has been edited by AUSTRIA (edited 05 May 2000).]

[TimD]

Aaaaauuuugggghh!

Half an hour's research and Testa Rossa trumps me - and comes up with more than I did to boot!

Ah, well. While you're online, T-R, if you get an attachment with my email address this weekend, it'll mean the fix I've been given for splicing documents to AOL on my system has worked.

That goes for Dino IV and Corktree too, but I'll herald it in advance, so that you don't think it's the ubervirus that's wrecking the net this week.

[Testa Rossa]

Question A

The best three would be :

1967 champion
Ickx
8 wins 13 poles 14 fastest laps

1971 champion
Peterson
10 wins 14 poles 9 fastet laps

1977 champion
Arnoux
7 wins 18 poles 12 fastet laps

This is chronological order. I don’t want to rank these 3 drivers, because I think it may be different for each people according to the importance you give to wins only or also take sheer speed like in qualifying into account.

Testa Rossa

[Mephisto]

Question b)

Answering this question will not be easy.
First of all, the Formula 1 had 1,5 litres engines that made them nearly slower then the Formula 2 cars. The team chefs wanted to increase to 2,5 litres. Knowing that the FIA rejects
Most demands, the constructors aimed at 3,0 litres so the FIA would agree to 2,5.
As the introduced their ideas though the FIA surprisingly accepted the 3,0 litres.
The problem was though that nobody had a 3,0 litres. The engines only could be upgraded to 2,5 maybe 2,6 litres.
Now came Lotus with a very good idea. They took two four-cylinder engines with 1,5 litres
out of a Lotus Cortina and wanted to stick them together so they would have an eight-cylinder engine with 3 litres. Lotus themselves couldn’t engineer their idea so they contacted
Ford. They couldn’t solve the technical things either so they contacted Frank Costing and Keith Duckworth. They managed the details and gave birth to an new engine named Cosworth. The engine had an incredible power ca. 420 HP as they started with it.
This engine gave Lotus a huge advantage, and they had even the exclusive rights for the wonder engine. Lotus knew though, that if they would keep that right for themselves, the other teams wouldn’t have a chance, so Lotus gave the engine free to every team.
The Cosworth engine was used then by all cars except Ferrari. They have always kept their own engines.

[AUSTRIA]

Welcome back Testa Rossa ! Very quick as usual!

To question A)
Formula 2 was very selectiv. What were the reasons, that many of the F2 drivers also competed very well in formula one. This has changed now, if you compare the F1-success of the younger F3000-champions. Nick Heidfeld maybe will do it, and Montoya will also climb the hill, but the others? Do you agree with me, that formula 2 was the better school for the drivers than F3000 is and why do you think so or so ?

to question B)
Good stuff, Mephisto; new for me is the shown fact, that the cosworth-engine was based on a chapman-idea, postulating that lotus = chapman. I wonder, why Lotus had that big troubles to find a quick solution - for 1966, that could be better than this Repco-engine in the Brabhams, that certainly could not be expected to get a championship-winner. The sinnless efforts with this BRM W16-engine? The jumping between three different engines ...

To question C)
I'm missing Michaels Centro Sud story

He Michael, too easy, fallen asleep ?

Good evening, see you tomorrow ...

[Mephisto]

First I have to correct some things. Of course it is Costin and not Costing.
The second thing is, that apparently Lotus had the skill to do it themselves, but they didn’t had time for it, so that’s why they gave it away to Ford and Ford to Cosworth.
A further small correction : it was not a 1,5 litre engine out of the Lotus, but a 1558 cm^3

[Michael M]

What, fallen asleep?? Hey Austria, I just sent you 12 MB by e-mail about your 1947-1949 Ferraris ..., no complains please!

Concerning Lotus & Cosworth, yes, obviously it was Chapmans idea. He had in mind duplicating the E105 (was it 105?) Ford/Lotus engine, and Ford was logically the first choice, also based on their cooperation in other areas (e.g. Indy). However, it took some time of course until the Cosworth was ready.

F2 v/s F3000, I realized already earlier your opinion about this this, but frankly spoken, cannot follow you. Sure, the F2 was principally a downsized F1, and in those days there was no great technical difference between both - except the engine. Even a lot of F1 cars had been bolted together somewhere in garages, as had most of the F2.

Don't forget, the F3000 series was introduced to have a home for outdated F1 machinery, and the starting grids of the early years confirm this. Still today a F3000 car can be described as a low-tech F1. By the way, it still has some version of the Cosworth DFV in it's rear! For the difference between F3000 and F1 not F3000 can be blamed, but the F1, which in the last 10-15 years has grown into an absolutely high-tech sphere, which cannot be compared with any other series.

So what do you propose as preparation for F1?


[This message has been edited by Michael M (edited 05 May 2000).]

[Gerard]

I would like to add something to the Lotus/Cosworth story.

In 1966 Colin Chapman started to search for an engine to replace the Coventry-Climax.
This search led him back to one of his earliest collaborators. Keith Duckworth had worked for Lotus at Hornsey as a development engineer. He later formed Cosworth Engineering together with another ex-Lotus colleague, Mike Costin.
Colin Chapman asked Keith Duckworth if he could design a Formula 1 engine.
Duckworth thought he could, so Chapman went off to find the money.
The Ford Motor Company had already backed Cosworth in the production of the 1000cc SCA engine for Formula 2 racing, loosely based on a Cortina.
Duckworth put the cost of the Formula 1 project at 100.000 pounds.
Chapman already had strong connections with Ford through the Lotus Cortina. Ford agreed to take a chance on the young engineer, Duckworth being still only 33.
Ford then advanced 25.000 pounds for an engine based on another of their production units, the 116E four-cylinder Escort, for the 1967 Formula 2. This permitted engines up to 1600cc and a four valves per cylinder layout was envisaged, so Duckworth dubbed the engine FVA, for Four Valve Type A.
When he doubled-up the FVA to make a 3-litre V8, he called it the DFV, or Double Four Valve.

[AUSTRIA]

A accept all your answers, once more well done;

Let me say, it was to easy; Lap seven will make you scraping your head ...

Question A)
2 points ... Testa Rossa

Question B)
2 points ... Mephisto
1 point .... Gerard

Question C)
4 points ... Testa Rossa

Tenth bonus Point ... Of course TimD !

P.S. Michael: my answer at the moment is formula 3 and I'm not alone with this opinion. And believe me, it was not formula 3 whilst the formula 2 EC era !