Home Mobile Forum News Cookbook FaceBook Us T-Shirts etc.: Europe/Worldwide. eBay Motorsport Links Advertising  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Single Seater Racing > Formula One


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 1 Jun 2005, 11:49 (Ref:1316640)   #1
Nismo
Racer
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 121
Nismo is heading for a stewards' enquiry!
BMW? are they loosing the performance advantage they once had?

After producing some of the best engines in recent years, it seems the power advantage they had during 2001-2003 has been lost. last year their engine was ok, this year it seem very weak compared to the opposition and they often run limited revs.

does anyone know if they will introduce any revisions this year? or just concentrate on the new V8 design?
Nismo is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 11:55 (Ref:1316644)   #2
Knowlesy
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
20KPINAL
 
Knowlesy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location:
Didcot.
Posts: 29,156
Knowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
They were set back by late rule changes I think.
Knowlesy is offline  
__________________
"This will be the dullest teammate battle for many years. Worse than Schumacher/Irvine. Ricciardo will never out-qualify Vettel, not once. He might beat him in a race occasionally, if Vettel has trouble. He won't win a single race IMO."

Top Formula 1 analyst Knowlesy previews the 2014 season.
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 12:59 (Ref:1316716)   #3
dsg
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Thailand
Chonburi
Posts: 2,383
dsg should be qualifying in the top 3 on the griddsg should be qualifying in the top 3 on the griddsg should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
I believe they will continue to make improvments to the current engine however these will all be minor fixes because the main thrust is rightly on next years engine.
dsg is offline  
__________________
ยินดีที่ได้รู้จัก
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 13:09 (Ref:1316727)   #4
Valve Bounce
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Australia
Home :)
Posts: 7,491
Valve Bounce has been held in scrutiny for further testing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nismo
After producing some of the best engines in recent years, it seems the power advantage they had during 2001-2003 has been lost. last year their engine was ok, this year it seem very weak compared to the opposition and they often run limited revs.

does anyone know if they will introduce any revisions this year? or just concentrate on the new V8 design?
You're right. You'd think that Williams would have come 1 and 2 last weekend, not just 2, and 2 and 3 the eek before . They've got to get their finger out a kick some ass.
Valve Bounce is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 14:09 (Ref:1316858)   #5
MRJUCY
Veteran
 
MRJUCY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Australia
At the pub
Posts: 605
MRJUCY should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I think they've definately lost there edge but in F1 you don't always need the best engine to be the quickest but it sure helps. I don't think Mclarens engines are the best but there car has been quickest at the last couple of races.
MRJUCY is offline  
__________________
What's this for anyway?
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 14:34 (Ref:1316885)   #6
Glen
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,598
Glen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridGlen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridGlen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Of course no one really knows where the engines are in relation to each other - any car that can run a bit less wing (ie is more efficient) will look quicker down the straights for example. It could be the case that the Williams this year is just not very slippery. On balance though it would seem that BMW have slipped from their highly regarded position as most powerful engine - I have read a comparisson of maximum rpm (a pretty good gauge of max bhp) that puts them down in about fifth place. Most likely they were wrong footed by the two race engine rule, and the primary method at their disposal to mangage longevity is to knock the rev limit down during the races. This is consistent with what the drivers have said.

Oh - and also it might be the case that the radically small sidepods of the FW27 make the car very tight on cooling. If the team's relationship with their engine supplier is less than perfect that kind of issue could be easy to fall in to, and very tricky to solve.
Glen is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 14:42 (Ref:1316892)   #7
Kicking-back
Registered User
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,661
Kicking-back should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridKicking-back should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Maybe BMW should spend their efforts finding more power rather than criticising Williams cars
Kicking-back is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 14:56 (Ref:1316906)   #8
luke
Veteran
 
luke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
England
West Sussex, England
Posts: 7,263
luke should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridluke should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kicking-back
Maybe BMW should spend their efforts finding more power rather than criticising Williams cars

Much easier to criticise.
luke is offline  
__________________
The thrill from west hill
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 14:58 (Ref:1316908)   #9
Glen
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,598
Glen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridGlen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridGlen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
It is a bit rich, isn't it kb?
Glen is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 15:00 (Ref:1316912)   #10
Kicking-back
Registered User
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,661
Kicking-back should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridKicking-back should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I think so.

This year in particular the Williams side of the package has been stronger than the BMW side - yet all we hear about is suggestions from Mario Thiessen that he'd rather pal-up with that midfield team from Switzerland.
Kicking-back is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 15:18 (Ref:1316934)   #11
Glen
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,598
Glen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridGlen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridGlen should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Next race is a proper engine circuit - they have been strong at Monaco (chassis) and Nurburgring (all-round, esp aero) so let's see if they can keep up the good work at a hard acceleration/hard braking circuit like Montreal. Judging by their poor showing at Imola (similar track in some ways) I am less than confident, but we shall see.

Mario Thiessen's attitude is hard to fathom - unless it is the "working together as one team" that he feels is holding them back... that situation might be improved if they had their own team, although every other dimension is likely to be more difficult.
Glen is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 16:02 (Ref:1316968)   #12
John Turner
Race Official
Veteran
 
John Turner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
United Kingdom
Pontesbury, Shropshire
Posts: 12,895
John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!John Turner is going for a new world record!
I'm a big BMW fan but there is no doubt they have not only lost the lead they had in the power stakes but have, in fact, been overtaken. I agree with k-b that it is a bit out of order pointing the finger at Williams, when the latter is proving currently to be the better half of the package. Some one remarked in another thread that there is not much wrong with the handling package for the cars to have been so competitive at Monaco. Incidentally, I think Valve Bounce was being a touch sarcastic (post 4), and, if he was, he has a point!
John Turner is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 16:47 (Ref:1317001)   #13
BootsOntheSide
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
England
Eastbourne, England
Posts: 13,000
BootsOntheSide should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridBootsOntheSide should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridBootsOntheSide should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridBootsOntheSide should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Their strong performance at Monaco coupled with a weaker showing at Imola suggests that the engine isn't the strongest part of the car. It's strange that BMW have faded relative to the opposition so quickly, but does emphasise the point that when you stand still in F1 you go backwards.
BootsOntheSide is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 17:17 (Ref:1317034)   #14
Knowlesy
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
20KPINAL
 
Knowlesy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location:
Didcot.
Posts: 29,156
Knowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameKnowlesy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
I think BMW will be back on front running power next year. They were supposedly less prepared for the two-weekend engine ruling than anybody else and they had to scrap their 'proper' 2005 engine right at the death. I'm not saying this didn't happen to anybody else, but it does seem to have hurt BMW more for whatever reason.

Still, they have no right to criticise. I, for one, feel Williams are doing a fantastic job this year. They started tamely but you can see the improvements race-by-race. They are the most improved team from Melbourne onwards for sure.

I could understand BMW criticising Williams in 2002 or 2003 or even 2004 for not being up to scratch, due to the engines being very good, but not this year. The BMW engine, for once, is letting the side down.
Knowlesy is offline  
__________________
"This will be the dullest teammate battle for many years. Worse than Schumacher/Irvine. Ricciardo will never out-qualify Vettel, not once. He might beat him in a race occasionally, if Vettel has trouble. He won't win a single race IMO."

Top Formula 1 analyst Knowlesy previews the 2014 season.
Quote
Old 1 Jun 2005, 19:30 (Ref:1317200)   #15
TheNewBob
Veteran
 
TheNewBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
England
Lincs, UK
Posts: 2,555
TheNewBob should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridTheNewBob should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
BMW's attitude and their "ultimate driving machine" slogans etc. all point towards the unison of manufacturer and team, something which Williams are obviously not really wanting in on. It's maybe why BMW has more success when they are a proper works team (like '99 Le Mans and the WTCC squads).
TheNewBob is offline  
Quote
Reply

Bookmarks




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Help!! no wonder we are loosing marshals!! aprescott Marshals Forum 11 15 Jan 2004 10:33
Ferrari to blame JPM for loosing ? Piquet Formula One 6 13 May 2001 16:34


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT. The time now is 17:37.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2018 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.