'Best' place to take your ARDS?

[MikeHart]

Now I am aware of the search facility, and I have indeed searched, but I can't find anywhere a conclusive 'which courses are any good' thread.

I've had my GoRacing pack since December but haven't had the time to organise anything yet (final year engineering degree and building a Formula Student car take up a lot of time :P). I've been 'offered' a drive in a FF2000 towards the end of the summer though, so I'm wanting to get my ARDS out of the way within the next month if possible. I'm based in the Midlands so ideal tracks would be Silverstone and Mallory, but someone warned me off Silverstone saying they have a rather high failure rate.....now I know you have to be a bit special to fail your ARDS, but do some schools make it hard for you in the hope they can get you back to do it again (ie pay them more money)?

I'd say personally I've narrowed it down to Silverstone, Brands and Mallory. So....from peoples experience, which is the best? I wouldn't mind getting more than a few laps for my money which is what appeals to me about the Silverstone course. I don't however know my way around Mallory or the Stowe Circuit whereas I do at least know what's coming up at Brands.

I'd be tempted by Brands seeing as it is a pretty awesome track, but all I can find re:ARDS is this: http://www.motorsportvision.co.uk/re...p?sponsor=ards

It says nothing about track time or anything and almost makes it sound like you get there and don't get any practice laps at all....and as amazing as I am I think even I'd struggle to get used to a car and track actually during the test!

Cheers,

Mike

[R59]

Perhaps I'm biased, but I'd say Silverstone. Yes their failure rate is higher, but that's because their standards of what is expected is probably higher than other circuits.

Not saying that other circuits let any muppet through, but it's a case of what the school's management/chief instructor interprets as acceptable and what is not.

[MikeHart]

Thanks for the reply. I agree that it's better that they don't let any idiot through, but I was just a bit concerned that they will fail you on some really annoyingly petty point. I guess I'm a little worried that since I've been racing karts for a while (C100) and drive in Formula Student I know more than most true 'novices' and I worry that they'd count this against me since I'm likely to be a little bit more confident in the car. I'm the first one to admit I don't know everything and am always happy to listen and learn, however, will me idea of a 'steady pace' be different to theirs?

[brickkicker]

Have to agree with R59, I did mine at Silverstone and had a great day, you do more at Silverstone than at many tracks such as the skid car and some 'drift' style stuff in a caterham.
They told us in the morning that as long as you dont go off the track and you can keep good lines you should have no problem as its not all about speed. You need to make sure you know what is around you though as when I did mine there was a Ferrari day on, funny thing was we were quicker than them in the lotus's

[MGDavid]

ARDS is ARDS and is a pretty set format wherever you go and only lasts about 2 hours. IIRC the price is set by MSA too. If you want extra laps / tuition / coaching then you are taking additional 'product/services' - and will be paying more ! I suspect S'stone like to encourage you to do this...

[ScoopJumps]

I did mine few weeks ago at Snetterton with MSV.

Watched a video, had a discussion, took a written test then went out on circuit.

I'd never turned a wheel on a circuit before and I passed so I'm sure you can too.

Was great experience, the instructors do give you tuition so its not like you are just expected to get on with it and as stated, its not about speed. They were more interested in seeing that you are using the correct lines (although I messed mine up a few times) and awareness of other vehicles.

I personally didn't want to spend the extra money at the Silverstone Money Spinner... or whatever its called

[nelson.tfr]

I did my ARDS at Silverstone last September and I was impressed with both the quality of the instructors (and, obviously, their instruction) and with the activities on the day.

I did the One-Day ARDS which included:

Audi skid car (FWD)
Caterham skid car (RWD)
Lapping sessions in Lotus Exige (by instructor first, then under instruction)
Written ARDS
Further lapping session
ARDS test

The lapping sessions all take place on the South Circuit.

It cost about £350 and, in my opinion, was worth every penny.

There were a couple of failures (out of about 12-15 of us), but I was reassured by this.

My instructor was Chris Alford, a well-respected driver (and, indeed, champion) in historic F2 cars. I was especially pleased, as he was very complimentary!

Obviously, I have no experience of other circuits' courses, but, if I had to do it again, I would choose Silverstone.

[MikeHart]

Well thanks for all the opinions I understand the fixed price is indeed £250. The Silverstone course is indeed extra. I feel there could be something learnt from it personally, so I think for me it's worthwhile the extra.

Nelson - Did you see any of the guys that failed? I would tend to think they'd be the type that think they know it all.

I'll try and get my Medical sorted next week maybe and then book the course as soon as I can. Will let you know how I get on :P

[MikeHart]

LOL. Incidentally Nelson....it appears we share a birthday!

[nelson.tfr]

Not sure on the guys that failed; I was "in the zone" as they say and concentrating more on myself than on anybody else.

As far as my actual test was concerned, I did catch and pass quite quickly someone else who must have been doing his test too. Maybe he was failed for being a bit slow? In fact, just after passing him, I got a bit crossed up coming into the tight left at Vale (that 100m(?) board is just slightly too late to use as a braking point) which received a comment, but no penalty, from Chris. Had I spun, on the other hand, it would have been an instant fail!

As I said above, I would recommend this course; you do get quite a bit of track time.

Glad to see we share a birthday, I usually spend mine on Houx Annexe campsite at Le Mans, but I'm testing at Silverstone this year for the MGCC racing weekend. Gutted to miss LM, though, I've missed only 3 since 1990.

[MikeHart]

Yeah, I was well aware that a spin is an instant fail. Understandable really considering you're not really supposed to be 'going for it' in the same way you would in say a race or qualifying :P

I have to say, LeMans is something I've yet to do but really should get round to doing one of these days! The past few years it's fallen just after Uni exams which has been pretty good so usually I've just spent it down the pub!

[BrendanM]

Mike
I did mine down at Thruxton, did the ARDS+ with a morning of 1x1 instruction and then video, test, laps in the afternoon. Good team there and only a small group (3 of us) so plenty of advice not only about test but racing in general.
Brendan

[Stuart H]

hey Mike

When I done my ards at Silverstone There was only 2 of us. We both had our own instructors.

With no one else around it made it a bit easyer.

Passed in the end

Stuart

[crofty]

I did the £360 ARDS day at silverstone. there were a few of us, one instructor for 2 people though for the actual track work, so that's not too bad.

The day was:

A briefing in the morning

4x15 minutes in the exiges (2 sessions AM, 2 sesions PM) -The last of which is your test.

A go (x2) in an Audi something or other on the skid pan with the trolleywheels thing (AM)

A go (x2) in the catheram on the skidpan/slalom course (PM)

Written tests in the afternoon. You must get 100% on the first half -mostly flags & safety. I think you can drop one or two marks on the second half -track craft.


Silverstone does have a higher amount of people that don't make it through (about a third when I was there)
It was a good day, though I would happily have sacrificed the audi for more track time in the exiges, as that's the only practical work that counts towards your passing the ARDS. The other stuff is handy and fun.

Hope you do well!

Dan

[Char1ie]

I passed at Brands a few weeks ago. Very friendly instructors and a very easy written test - make sure you know your flags.

The track test was challenging and I would recommend that wherever you do your ARDS you get track time there before the day. Two out of six failed the track test when I did mine and both had never been to Brands before.

Charlie

[terence]

That could be down to one of two reasons[1] The Instructor was crap,Highly unlikely.[2]The pupils had no idea------.

[MikeHart]

Originally Posted by terence bower

That could be down to one of two reasons[1] The Instructor was crap,Highly unlikely.[2]The pupils had no idea------.

LOL. Abrupt but also probably true

I know some of you may baulk at this, but I'm a fairly keen sim racer and, having done a track day round the Silverstone GP circuit, I can honestly say, with the advent of GPS and laser mapping of the tracks they are uncannily realistic these days. Whilst driving on a sim takes a very different approach to driving an actual car, there was no doubt in my mind that the hundreds of laps I've done round the track on rFactor meant after all of one lap I was into the groove. Rather handily, the south circuit exists on it too, so several hours may have to be spent in a Corvette C6

Thankfully I can usually learn a track fairly quickly, although this skill may be tested in a couple of weeks when I do the final karting round of the championship I'm competing in. It's at Llandow and I've never seen the track, let alone raced on it before! Could be interesting considering 90% of the other drivers are in the same position!

[Gore]

Mike,

I did my ARDS at Brands a couple of weeks ago (strangely enough because I've also been offered a test in a mate's FF2000, which suggests we may be meeting in person at some point this year...), and was happy with the overall service and experience.

The written part of the test was almost patronisingly simple, and with the instructor showing us the MSA video beforehand and highlighting particular 'tricky points' that 'might' come up in the test, there's not much more they could have done to pass us, short of filling in the answers on our behalf.

As has been said above, the emphasis in the practical test is on proving you can control a car safely and responsibly, not demonstrating how quick you can be. As my instructor said to me, he's not looking for the next Lewis Hamilton, he just wants to make sure he'd feel safe sharing a circuit with me on a test day. I didn't drive especially well, and was chastised for braking too late for Graham Hill bend on a couple of occassions, but easily made the pass mark, as did the other five applicants there on the day. The instructor did say before we left the pitlane that if he didn't think I was up to scratch after a few laps we'd come in and talk through what I needed to improve on and then have another go; so as with the written element, they do seem very keen to pass you if you're at all sensible.

In terms of track time, Brands use road spec Meganes for the test, which aren't espcially exciting, and you only get about three laps being driven by the instructor, and about six laps driving yourself. I didn't think that was a great deal for the costs involved, but you have to think of the expense as part of paying for the licence, rather than buying track time or tuition. The idea is that the £250 will pay off when the licence lets me take the FF2000 out...

Final point, Brands don't actually require you to do the medical in advance of the test, as the assessment is run under trackday rules. Although, if you're at all like me, that just means you'll just end up putting off the trip to the doctor, and never quite get round to applying for the licence.

Best of luck for the test (and for Llandow; I've only ever raced there in the wet, in which conditions the place is a complete nightmare).

Dan Gore.

[terence]

All instructors are usually keen for thier pupils to pass thier ARDS.Bearing in mind that having some one fail whilst under your instruction is not a feather in your cap,if anything it is a reflection on your teaching ability but sometimes there is the odd case who always wears invisible ear defenders!!

[Suze]

Final point, Brands don't actually require you to do the medical in advance of the test, as the assessment is run under trackday rules. Although, if you're at all like me, that just means you'll just end up putting off the trip to the doctor, and never quite get round to applying for the licence.

I'm not sure anywhere requires you to have done the medical in advance....? Saying that I did take mine at another MSV venue [Snett] but I thought you only had to take the form on the day so they can sign the relevant parts. Maybe some places that don't run them as a trackday prefer you to do the medical in advance?

[terence]

Relevant parts? Like arm's and leg's?

[nelson.tfr]

When I did mine at Silverstone, they checked my medical declaration. You'll have to do it anyway, so cover your bases and have it done beforehand so there can be no problems with it.

[Suze]

Originally Posted by nelson.tfr

When I did mine at Silverstone, they checked my medical declaration. You'll have to do it anyway, so cover your bases and have it done beforehand so there can be no problems with it.

Yes that's what I did, but I did check in advance as wasn't sure if I'd get medical done in time and they said you didn't have to have it done in advance....

Relevant parts? Like arm's and leg's?

No, signing relevant parts to say you've passed the test.....

[al_sami]

Brands isnt a bad place, just one instructor I did not see eye to eye with.. watch out for him though, he has long hair, but dont know his name.

He gave me 3 laps and did not give the chance to drive uninterupted, he was always pulling at the wheel and put me off the whole test.

[terence]

Thats what he was there for,maybe a little concerned that you could have been on the wrong line?