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30 Dec 2009, 21:44 (Ref:2606578) | #101 | ||
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"Double Kidney Guv'nah?" "No thanks George they're still wavin a white flag!" |
1 Jan 2010, 15:54 (Ref:2607075) | #102 | ||
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Cheers chunterer. I still say that Ayrton would have got the 1994 title if it wasn't for that race. Senna would have probably realised what Schu had done and just sat on the rear of the benetton and waited for it to retire/pit
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2 Jan 2010, 03:25 (Ref:2607252) | #103 | ||
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Quite a sentimental list, here it goes...
1980 Pryce 1981 Reutemann 1982 Villeneuve 1983 Prost 1984 Prost 1985 Prost 1986 Mansell 1987 Mansell 1988 Senna 1989 Senna 1990 Prost 1991 Senna 1992 Mansell 1993 Prost 1994 Schumacher 1995 Schumacher 1996 Senna 1997 Senna 1998 Hakkinen 1999 Hakkinen 2000 Schumacher 2001 Schumacher 2002 Schumacher 2003 Montoya 2004 Schumacher 2005 Alonso 2006 Alonso 2007 Hamilton 2008 Massa 2009 Button |
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7 Jan 2010, 23:11 (Ref:2609777) | #104 | ||
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Mekola, I find your list most interesting.
Pryce WDC in 1980!!! presumably he would have been at the wheel of the Williams as AJ went there from Shadow........ Had both liveed, maybe Tony Brise (Brabham) might have pipped Tom in an all Brit title battle. I'd agree with most of the rest of yours with the following exceptions again some massively assumptive: '81 Jones '82 Pironi (or maybe Prost if not for shocking reliabilty) '83 Villeneuve (would not have overhauled Didier in '82 but would drive for the title in '83 surely) '85 Villeneuve (would have been quicker than Alboreto in good car) '95 Senna '05 Kimi (or JPM had he not injured himself.... McLaren was the car that year) '07 Alonso |
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"Double Kidney Guv'nah?" "No thanks George they're still wavin a white flag!" |
3 Dec 2019, 12:27 (Ref:3944520) | #105 | ||
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Hello again!
2017 Vettel 2018 Vettel He had the equipment but fluffed it! |
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3 Dec 2019, 13:11 (Ref:3944535) | #106 | ||
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The best car won in both years. When people look at those two years they always only see the first half and forget that Mercedes/Lewis utterly dominated the second halves.
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3 Dec 2019, 14:14 (Ref:3944547) | #107 | ||
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What if Nico had not retired after 2016?
Would LH still have won? Would Nico have won? Would the Merc drivers have taken enough points off one another that Vettel could have taken one? |
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3 Dec 2019, 14:30 (Ref:3944553) | #108 | ||
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I do not think I have read the full definitive story of what went on behind the scenes at Mercedes the year that Nico Rosberg won the title, but it took so much out of him (psychologically) that I do not think that he would necessarily be able to continue on that level in the following years, hence his early retirement.
We will never know of course. Have we been robbed of two or three years of classic / bitter rivalry akin to Senna and Prost? Maybe. |
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3 Dec 2019, 18:25 (Ref:3944609) | #109 | |
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If Lewis had left for say Ferrari at the end of 2016, would Nico have stayed on? Who knows, maybe he would have found it easier knowing he had a team mate in Bottas
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
4 Dec 2019, 07:53 (Ref:3944675) | #110 | ||
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Shoulda woulda coulda - that way madness lies. It's simple - the person who wins is the one who ends up with more points -or even half a point - more than everyone else at season end . Everybody works to this objective . The person who wins deserves to because he -or she - has got more points. That year, for this simple fact alone , winning it makes them 'best '.
Moss may never have won ,nor Peterson or Villeneuve (G) , Rosberg (K) may have won with only a single win , some drivers have had such great cars they've won the championship before summer's ended , some seasons have had 21 Grands Prix and others less than half that total ... but when you win , you win. End of story . |
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4 Dec 2019, 10:02 (Ref:3944696) | #111 | |
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I think you’re missing the whole point of the thread. And to say the one with the most points is automatically the best is not true. Sure there’s bit little if any undeserving champions, but that doesn’t mean some might deserve it more
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
4 Dec 2019, 12:29 (Ref:3944720) | #112 | ||
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I am not missing the point , but making one; it's what people do in discussions . 'Deserving' doesn't come into it - because we then allow emotional judgement to carry more weight than the facts. For instance, maybe somebody will explain why Mario Andretti should surrender his '78 crown to Niki Lauda on the grounds that Lauda's fan car would probably have won the remaining 8 races from Sweden on , had it not been withdrawn ?
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4 Dec 2019, 13:01 (Ref:3944727) | #113 | |
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We’re not saying that titles in the past should change, just how different it could have been
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
4 Dec 2019, 14:29 (Ref:3944748) | #114 | |||
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Just think how different it could have been if a driver was born in 1990 who was such an exceptional talent in the junior formulae that they were in a Renault in 2005 instead of Alonso....... Or how different it could have been if Ralf Schumacher had turned out to be better than Michael...... |
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4 Dec 2019, 15:25 (Ref:3944758) | #115 | |
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Who should’ve is a subject to debate. And that’s what we are doing here. Don’t need to pick out everything I say and completely misread it
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
4 Dec 2019, 16:10 (Ref:3944763) | #116 | ||
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this is supposed to be a fun thread and its going to be a long off season if we start criticizing people for using their imagination and deep knowledge of the sport to play a little 'what if'.
heck it is F1 so for sure there are enough examples of a team running an illegal car, using someone else's IP, race distances being changed, outcomes decided by stewards instead on on track, bad driving etc etc that these sorts of 'what if' discussions are inevitable. anyways, i think we have all seen enough Flavio Briatore teams to have some qualms about simply believing 'he who has the most points is the most deserving winner' right? |
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Home, is where I want to be but I guess I'm already there I come home, she lifted up her wings guess that this must be the place |
4 Dec 2019, 16:37 (Ref:3944775) | #117 | |
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And let’s not forget the Brabham rocket fuel
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
4 Dec 2019, 20:15 (Ref:3944852) | #118 | |
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5 Dec 2019, 13:51 (Ref:3944971) | #119 | |||
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To counter Kempi's point, I don't agree the Mercedes was the better car in the second half of 17 & 18. Vettel was regularly in contention but simply events (or himself!) conspired against him, allowing Hamilton to breeze it in the last few rounds. If Vettel has not gone into the kittylitter at Hockenheim last year, he would have been right in there. |
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"Double Kidney Guv'nah?" "No thanks George they're still wavin a white flag!" |
5 Dec 2019, 18:29 (Ref:3945036) | #120 | ||
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But it wasn't banned at all. It created a huge fuss, Andretti claimed it threw debris at him and Chapman was enraged at somebody thinking even further outside than than he had with the 78 and 79 . But not banned - Ecclestone , eyes on bigger picture , withdrew it , much to Gordon Murray's chagrin.
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5 Dec 2019, 21:28 (Ref:3945066) | #121 | |||
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And on top of that they had an error prone Vettel who was never himself anymore after Singapore 2017 and even less Hockenheim 2018. Something went off mentally. |
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7 Dec 2019, 13:14 (Ref:3945363) | #122 | |
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So many what ifs.
1976 1982 could ahve had numerous champions 1986. and the sad occasions of 1989 and 1990 1995 were it not for a dodgy German |
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7 Dec 2019, 22:35 (Ref:3945440) | #123 | |
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8 Dec 2019, 10:09 (Ref:3945531) | #124 | |
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1982 had so many potential champions apart from Rosberg in the coulda woulda shoulda category
Pironi would have won it but for his crash in Germany Wattie could have done it, but for his mid season bad luck Prost perhaps should have, if only his Renault was much more reliable Lauda had an outside chance depending on McLaren's appeal against his Zolder DQ, but a lot depended on other things Arnoux could also have done it, had he had better reliability. He was back on form after a tough 1981 Patrese was actually ahead of Rosberg at the halfway point of the season. Who knows if he had stuck with the reliable Cosworth engine in the second half of the season? Same with Piquet, although he probably wouldn't have won 83 if he stuck with the Cosworth engine Villeneuve we know what happened to him, he would certainly would have had the car to take the title Lole if had done a full season could have done it, certainly he would have been the No. 1 in the team Amazingly Tambay feels he could have won the title if not for the neck problems which made him miss a couple of races. Certainly if had won Dijon he would have gone into the final race with a good chance. And this after missing the first half of the season |
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
10 Dec 2019, 00:10 (Ref:3945848) | #125 | ||
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81 and 82 were 2 of the most open seasons in the last 40 odd years!
Back to topic. Mario receny said he could've joined McLaren for'81 but plumped for Alfa. |
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