New single seater series in America?

[wolfhound]

FOM is rumoured to be launching a new F1 feeder series in America to cover north, south and central America. It is suspected that the idea might use GP2 and/or GP3. The rational behind the idea is that there is currently no series that produces drivers suitable for F1 from America.


http://www.crash.net/f1/news/186057/...rt_series.html

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/2...feeder-series/

Formula Atlantic and Indy Car have produce F1 drivers in the past but none in recent times.
With single seater racing in America relatively weak at the moment there might be an oppertunity for a new series to start.
I await developments with interest.

[Jacques Rabbit]

The dynamic of a GP2 series racing spec Dallaras in the U.S., Canada, and Brazil going up against an IndyCar Series racing spec Dallaras in the U.S., Canada, and Brazil is interesting.

I see a few things:

1. Same pool of team owners. IndyCar has subsidies, but many team owners are upset about the cost and other issues.

2. Same pool of drivers, particularly funded ones. Both series will have teams relying on funded drivers, so where will the funded drivers want to be? The series with the Indy 500, or the series with the off-chance at F1?

3. Similar pool of road course venues in the U.S. IndyCar's very high sanctioning fees could open a door for GP2 to pick up great tracks that IndyCar does not visit.

4. Same pool of viewers, and it's a small one.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by wolfhound

a new F1 feeder series in America to cover north, south and central America

Ridiculously expensive. IndyCar teams complained about racing in Edmonton and Mexico...

Originally Posted by wolfhound

With single seater racing in America relatively weak at the moment there might be an oppertunity for a new series to start.

Bernie wants to get some cash from this region. For that, they need decent television ratings. If IndyCar doesn't, how will they?

In Brazil there's six major motorsport championships: Stock Car, Formula Truck, Trofeo Fiat Linea, GT Brasil, Top Race, Copa Petrobras de Marcas. But people only care about the first two. How will Bernie fit into there (teams, schedule, drivers, sponsors)?

Mexico is Nascar land, and they race one road course only. Argentina is focused on tin-top racing.

[Down F0rce]

It doesn't necessarily have to be in competition with IndyCar. Indy's own Indy Light category has low grid numbers with ancient cars, they are looking to introduce a new chassis for 2014. Why not have GP2 USA and Indy Lights as a joint venture? If would benefit both series (since former F1 drivers often end up in IndyCar anyway) and I'm sure Bernie would listen if the money was right...

[Alex K]

Gents let's face it, the cost of running in FIL is not massive, and they still have problems, huge problems with car counts, same with Star Mazda. Where would you get the drievers with sufficient budgets to run a series in new(-ish) GP2 cars on two continents across thousands miles (Argentina to Canada)?

[wolfhound]

I wonder would GP 3 be a better bet if it supported all the GPs in the region plus about another 6 or 7 events?

but then the whole thing could be a kite to get a reaction.

http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2012/...-the-americas/

[ivanalesi]

I think the way junior formula organizers and teams do business in EU isn't suited for the US, they would expect much more when they see a bill for half a season of IndyCar racing

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by Alex K

Gents let's face it, the cost of running in FIL is not massive, and they still have problems, huge problems with car counts, same with Star Mazda. Where would you get the drievers with sufficient budgets to run a series in new(-ish) GP2 cars on two continents across thousands miles (Argentina to Canada)?

It's about 1.2-1.5 million USD to do the full season, I've heard. And then there's the fact that it's not likely that the FIA/FOM would let this series go without a decent TV deal, like IndyCar has let happen to Indy Lights. That's why Lights is having so much trouble. You don't see most of the races, the fans don't care about them because it's the worst of both worlds.



Again, people are focusing way too much on GP2, when it makes more sense for it to be GP3, considering the plans for that car going forward. I'm sure that they can match the current Indy Lights budget because when Daly and Newgarden did GP3 at Carlin, I heard they paid 250K GBP for their seats. Admittedly they were the bargain seats, but I doubt the premium seats were going for 500K+ GBP and with the upgrades to the car, it could still come in cheaper than the Indy Lights car to buy, especially when they can be built right here in the US.


Plus, if it were GP2, even the last gen cars would be faster than the current car around road and street courses.

[ivanalesi]

I think the current GP3 is as fast or faster than Lights It's lighter + lots of ground effect downforce. The new car will be for sure faster.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by ivanalesi

I think the current GP3 is as fast or faster than Lights It's lighter + lots of ground effect downforce. The new car will be for sure faster.

I was talking about IndyCar, sorry for the confusion.

[Alex K]

If Swift that is used by F Nippon teams is faster on road courses than IndyCar GP2 cars will race even faster. But that is not the point. The point is racing GP2 class around two continents will be difficult and highly expesive. If IndyCar cannot get a decent telly coverage in US, GP2 America won't get it either. And, do we really think GP2 America could harm ICS in any way?! Wont believe until I see it, and even than doubt it'll survive without subsidies.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

Ridiculously expensive. IndyCar teams complained about racing in Edmonton and Mexico...


Bernie wants to get some cash from this region. For that, they need decent television ratings. If IndyCar doesn't, how will they?

In Brazil there's six major motorsport championships: Stock Car, Formula Truck, Trofeo Fiat Linea, GT Brasil, Top Race, Copa Petrobras de Marcas. But people only care about the first two. How will Bernie fit into there (teams, schedule, drivers, sponsors)?

Mexico is Nascar land, and they race one road course only. Argentina is focused on tin-top racing.

ive always found it hysterical that one of brazil's top racing series is a one-make cup for fiat linea's...that'd be like the BTCC being run with production vauxhall astras for everyone.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by Matt

ive always found it hysterical that one of brazil's top racing series is a one-make cup for fiat linea's...that'd be like the BTCC being run with production vauxhall astras for everyone.

The Stock Car Brasil was a Chevrolet one-make for decades!!!

[Go_For_Pole]

SudAm GP3 anyone? Better than F3 that is going nowhere

[wolfhound]

Originally Posted by Go_For_Pole

SudAm GP3 anyone? Better than F3 that is going nowhere

I would rather see F3 than GP3 as it is technically more challanging for the drivers and F1 is still a multi chassis formula unlike GP2 & GP3.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

The Stock Car Brasil was a Chevrolet one-make for decades!!!

yeah but at least those are fast.

[Jacques Rabbit]

Originally Posted by Matt

yeah but at least those are fast.

Chevrolets? Fast?

All racing cars are pretty fast, no matter what the make, of course.

I hope the series is centered on South America rather than North America. I don't need any more televised racing for Leigh Diffey to shout to me.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by Go_For_Pole

SudAm GP3 anyone? Better than F3 that is going nowhere

F3 Sudamericana doesn't work because nobody cars. People around here care about stars running tin-tops, which are much less expensive than Dallaras.

[Mekola]

As I said before: Bring us back Formula 2 Codasur instead. With chassis made in the region, that were the great days of formula racing in South America.

[MagVanisher]

Hmm, I don't think a feeder series in North (and South) America would not work since they would have to compete against IndyCar, NASCAR, and other series.

Unless The Bernie bought IndyCar and destroy Indy 500 (which would not happen), there's no way an American would become a F1 World Champion.

[ivanalesi]

Bernie isn't this stupid. It'd be great if he buys IndyCar and all the Hullman-George family finally goes out of it. Tbh, it would make a lot of sense as F1 will never be very popular in US because of the time difference. IndyCar can be a local form of F1. GP2/GP3 America? At the end of the day a driver from this series will have a much better chance and preparation than those coming from the current Lights field.
I remember Conor Daly winning a Indy Lights race and the next race he did was GP3 in Turkey, his teammate was on pole and he was on the last row!

[Mekola]

I remember it was a Facebook group that proposed a GPA (Grand Prix Argentina) series that claimed to use old GP2 cars, but at last it seems it was an delusion. First I followed them in the group to leave it, deluded, when results never came to fruition.

Argentina used to have many formula series in its history, first Fuerza Limitada and Fuerza Libre and later Mecánica Argentina F1, F2, and F4. The MAF2 turned to F2 Codasur in 1982, and to SudamF3 in 1987. F4 is the current Argentine F. Renault.

Unfortunately the preponderance of tin tops (TC, TC2000, TRV6, TN) gave very small room for formula racing in Argentina during this century, then SudamF3 is bound by Brazilians only, despite its Argentinian roots.

[Good Publicity]

If FOM thinks GP2 or GP3 will steal drivers out of Indycars' three 'ladder' categories (Indy Lights, Star Mazda & USF2000), then it's in for a rude shock.

For all their difficulties getting the IRL to acknowledge their existence, the Road to Indy categories at least give their series champions fully paid drives at the next level.

On the other hand, GP3 (actually Pirelli) gives its champion roughly a third of a GP2 budget, and GP2 gives its champion a trophy.

Take your pick.

[W.A Trichlorostyrene]

Originally Posted by Good Publicity

For all their difficulties getting the IRL to acknowledge their existence, the Road to Indy categories at least give their series champions fully paid drives at the next level.

True, except for the final part of the ladder. The Indy Lights champion doesn't get a "fully paid drive" in IndyCar. He/she gets a scholarship of either $500.000 or $1M, depending on which team he/she gets to drive for. This is only a fraction of the cost of your average IndyCar ride.

The problem is, IndyLights is such in an awful shape car count- and talent-wise these days, it doesn't really have any credibility anymore. It doesn't make much sence for an IndyCar team to take a risk on a partly-funded driver, if they doesn't even know whether he/she is truly real deal.

Past Lights champions have had different fortunes so far. JR Hildebrand(not sure whether the scholarship system was already in place back then?) spent a year on the sidelines - bar an eventful homeland one-off at Sonoma - before landing his Panther ride in 2011. Jean-Karl Vernay went straight back home to Europe after taking his title. Josef Newgarden landed a ride at SFHR, but I'm wondering how much Sarah Fisher's patriotic/philanthropic side weighted in the overall decision. It'll be interesting to see where the talented Tristan Vautier ends up, although his short term future looks very bleak so far.


Anyway, you're right, considering FOM's gigantic revenues, it's a shame they don't decide to invest more in the feeder series. You can critisise IndyCar on many points, but at least they did a good job at making their own ladder clear and straightforward again.

[ivanalesi]

Then why Indy Lights postponed the introduction of their new car? It truly is outdated now, too slow.