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10 Feb 2006, 01:54 (Ref:1519338) | #26 | ||
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I can see the point - I suppose what I am thinking is it is the top of the mountain that makes Bathurst what it is, if you are not goint to use it (fair enough as you say) then why hold it at Bathurst? I've only seen pictures of Goodwood and there doesn't seem to be a similar track in Australia, Sandown might be the closest I suppose, or somewhere like Oran Park/Winton/Wakefield where you can see most of the track. Re the not seeing much, I would treat it like the Arthurs Seat or Mt Tarrengower where you can work your way around a few different vantage points.
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10 Feb 2006, 01:58 (Ref:1519340) | #27 | |||
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The name is Nigel - not Nige, definately not Nigo and never Niger - Nigel - plain and simple! |
10 Feb 2006, 02:08 (Ref:1519344) | #28 | ||
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If the BRC accepted MPAC's proposal of running the 24 Hour race as part of the Bathurst International Motor Festival, it would have solved this concern of lack of actual racing. Maybe for next year.
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
10 Feb 2006, 03:08 (Ref:1519361) | #29 | ||
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The 24 hour as a viable race at Bathurst is finished.
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The name is Nigel - not Nige, definately not Nigo and never Niger - Nigel - plain and simple! |
10 Feb 2006, 03:55 (Ref:1519366) | #30 | ||
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Finished is a very definate word, Storyline.
While there are groups/promoters such as MPAC or others, there is always the possibly of such as races return. There is much room for improvement from the previous 2 installments, which would go a long way to making such an event more viable. Such as the decision to pay for 9 hours of commercial TV in 2003. Remember IMG were a naming rights sponsor away from taking control of the race in 04, had WPS jumped on a 2nd Bathurst event then, things could have taken a good turn. Just my feelings, though. |
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
10 Feb 2006, 05:35 (Ref:1519384) | #31 | ||
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For the 24 Hour to run again it needs major major backing as well as support from categories capable of running a 24 hour event.
The problem is, in this country, that racing is not geared towards events of this distance therefore we don't have the necessary infrastructure which Europe has (interms of hardware and officials) and we certainly don;t have lead in events for cars and teams to be able to run events of this distance. At best (and correct me if I am wrong here) but about the longest race any cars capable if running a 24 hour event have in which they can test, practice etc is around 1 hour (and I don;t think they even have races of that duration any more). But - and this is probably the most important ingredient - the Australian motor racing public simply has not gelled with 24 Hour endurence events - they don (read haven't in the past) supported it and, in all likelihood, won't in future - one of the key reasons for this apitahy is, unfortunate but has to be said, simply because it is run at Bathurst which when push comes to shove, is one of the most expensive spectator circuits in the country to attend. |
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The name is Nigel - not Nige, definately not Nigo and never Niger - Nigel - plain and simple! |
10 Feb 2006, 05:37 (Ref:1519385) | #32 | |||
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Interesting press release that has come out this afternoon from ADRAD Racing (Brysce Washington) in SA. Amongst all the normal hype of a release, was this little gem:
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The name is Nigel - not Nige, definately not Nigo and never Niger - Nigel - plain and simple! |
11 Feb 2006, 01:51 (Ref:1520083) | #33 | ||||
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2 years wasn't a long enough time for the Australian public to gel with a 24 Hour race at Bathurst. |
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
11 Feb 2006, 02:43 (Ref:1520095) | #34 | ||
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But do you think even a 3 hour race is sufficient lead in to a 24 hour enduro? Personally I don't.
Keep in mind that Procar pulled the plug on the 24 hour before Ross pulled the plug on Procar itself - which, in my ind at least, says a lot for the financial side of the event. Don;t get me wrong - I would love to see a 24 hour enduro be successful in this country - but the simple fact is that Australian racing fans are NOT avid fans of sports cars and that Mt Panorama, whilst everyone would like to see it held there, is simply too expensive a track to run this type of event at unless you have full financial backing. Dare I say the track is over-rated? |
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11 Feb 2006, 02:58 (Ref:1520099) | #35 | ||
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Calder at Easter
Is there not a similar style event at Calder at Easter ?
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11 Feb 2006, 03:49 (Ref:1520108) | #36 | ||||
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2002 all the teams only had the Sandown 500 as a lead in but I thought the reliability and quality/professionalism on show was quite impressive. Quote:
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
11 Feb 2006, 03:50 (Ref:1520111) | #37 | ||||
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Quote:
I also believe that there are categories which are definately capable of running a 24-hour event; GT Performance, GT Production and the GT Chammpionship (which seems to have strengthened since last year), Future Tourers, etc. However, I do agree with you in stating that the 24-hour is probably not likely to return. If the BIMF does succeed this year, and in the short-term, perhaps a 6 or 12 hour race would benefit the event, and even up the show 'n shine and racing aspect of the event. Quote:
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11 Feb 2006, 04:17 (Ref:1520119) | #38 | ||
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Storytime likes to take a negative view about everything and this is a trimmer . The point conveniently overlooked is that from an entry point of view the cancelled 24 Hour was going to be oversubscribed with the depth and quality being a significant upgrading from the previous year. Many better amd more serious efforts were in the planning and the cancellation was a significant kick in the guts for a lot of people .
If you do not run long races how do you get experience for teams,drivers and let everyone get used to the idea.All that takes time.The 1 Hour races have been a small step in that direction.There are several proposals floating for longer races at the moment. Conceptually it is possible to fill the grid- not much doubt that would happen-- the idea implied that it has to be a a level of participant that ST approoves of to be deemed a success is curious. 24 hour races around the world are gaining in popularity and support so there is no reason that would not be the case here. An event at Bathurst is better than none-- and it may represent a step in the right direction. |
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11 Feb 2006, 04:46 (Ref:1520125) | #39 | ||
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2004 Bathurst 24 Hour over-subscribed???
Were any entry forms ever handed out. The international entry was never going to be high with the continued prescence of the 7-litre Monaro, the likes of Martin Short had indicated he wouldn't return if the rules stayed the same. There were indications of interest from BMW (who would have run them, from memory an ETCC race clashed in 2004, removing Schnitzer from the equation) and the Alzen's with their Bi-Turbo Porsche. The race needed the international entry to stand-up, it couldn't support itself on a Australian-only entry. With reference to GT cars, i'm personally more interested in this 1000km race at a Sandown Sportscar Festival that was alluded to (anything but confirmed) in another post somewhere. In the current climate it's the best we can hope for, rather than longing for a 24-hour return. It's been gone 2 years, it's not coming back anytime soon. |
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11 Feb 2006, 09:33 (Ref:1520183) | #40 | ||
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I'm led to believe there will be a few of the V8 teams up there with their ride day cars giving punters a chance for a lap around the mount.
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11 Feb 2006, 10:02 (Ref:1520199) | #41 | |
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It might be hard for those that have already decided we will never see another 24hour at Bathurst.... but answer this question;
If a 24hr Bathurst for GT cars came our way again; would you turn up to watch it ? Because in the end; if a consortium such as MPAC is successful; we'd sure as hell better stop bagging the event out saying its not viable, by voting with our feet. The very early "Great Races" at Phillip Island were very much doomed in their early days by a lack of "interest". Look what we have today with the 1000kms. Races at Bathurst cost a lot of money, just ask the ARDC, there were times when the 1000km was on shakey ground... it wont be easy for a B24hr to be a commercial success, but lets stop putting all these negative thoughts out there. 24 Hour racing around the world is gaining more and more interest.. keep the dream alive. |
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11 Feb 2006, 13:51 (Ref:1520336) | #42 | ||||
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The name is Nigel - not Nige, definately not Nigo and never Niger - Nigel - plain and simple! |
11 Feb 2006, 13:58 (Ref:1520341) | #43 | ||||||
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For racing purists - there will be screams for a 24 hour event BUT, as I said before, the Australian motor racing public has shown it's 'dislike' of this type of racing. Yes - initial events generally do well - but not afterwards (if they were deemed to be successful, why didn't Panoz try and run another event out here? Quote:
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The name is Nigel - not Nige, definately not Nigo and never Niger - Nigel - plain and simple! |
11 Feb 2006, 14:11 (Ref:1520347) | #44 | |||||
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Quote:
[/quote]The point conveniently overlooked is that from an entry point of view the cancelled 24 Hour was going to be oversubscribed with the depth and quality being a significant upgrading from the previous year. Many better amd more serious efforts were in the planning and the cancellation was a significant kick in the guts for a lot of people .[/quote] This 'kick in the guts' was primarily with the people trying to put the event on - not the competitors. Talk to those actively involved in the event - the race was NOT oversubscribed (give Mike Dennis a call and talk to him about it) Quote:
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Look what happened to the event that Wakefield put on in 2004 - plenty of support when it was announced 'Yes - we'll run - great event, we need more like this - 500km race. Beauty' What happened? 17 entries (26 in the 250). And why? Because of the cost of having to fit dry break systems, the cost of running for 228 laps became 'prohibitive' for many of the teams who were 'going to enter' and 'support endurance' racing. We won't even mention the crowd - err sorry - the number of officials outnumbered the crowd for the main event (bad planning though also took care of that finishing the event - a 9:30 start and a 4 1/4 hour race) So what happened - last years event gets cancelled due to 'lack of support' And you honestly think these same teams will support a 24 hour race if they can't support shorter enduro races they say they 'can't afford to run'? There is one other aspect that hasn't been mentioned yet - except for the purists, a 24 hour event is not something that can be easily followed at a track - it needs TV coverage - something the Bathurst 24 hour events totally lacked. |
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11 Feb 2006, 17:11 (Ref:1520425) | #45 | |||
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The point is that two attempts have been made in successive years to stage a 24 Hour race at Bathurst since Ross Palmer pulled his support of it. Both have fallen short, and now the second date is taken....by an event that i'm not sure it even knows itself what it is...... May i ask though with regards to the MPAC bid for a 24 Hour race at the Festival for GT cars, how did they expect to get a grid at Easter for it? The top international teams would be to busy focussing on Nurburgring, Le Mans, or their regular championships. The thing the original 24 Hour had going for it was that it was at the end of the championship season for everyone. |
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12 Feb 2006, 01:06 (Ref:1520644) | #46 | ||
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The Bathurst 12hr IMO had a much better class structure - sure, there were exotics & 'homologation' specals- RX7 SP, Porsche 968 RS, BMW M3R (even though that never ran), but all were production vehicles that the punter could buy off the showroom floor on the Monday (depending on your respective budget of course!! )
The 24hr, as great as it was & certainly could've been, didn't have that same feel about it - the 'race on Sunday, sell on Monday feel. |
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12 Feb 2006, 02:08 (Ref:1520656) | #47 | |||
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Mark Alan Jones Opinionated Human My opinions only have the power you give them |
13 Feb 2006, 08:30 (Ref:1521580) | #48 | ||||
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Preparation wasn't ideal,damn the raced was only officially announced in March, they had to spend money of all above mentioned equipment but what was put on was a good show. They all found a way to get there. I am not saying that your point isn't a valid one, if such an event was serioulsy being looked at, it needs to be addressed however I feel it is an issue that will be overcome. Quote:
One of the people from the MPAC group was frequent member of this forum during late last year. It would be nice if they popped back into shed light on many of the questions being put foward here. |
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
13 Feb 2006, 10:22 (Ref:1521646) | #49 | ||
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37 entries for a track such as Bathurst is not, really, a good field though, is it? (not being flippant btw)
This is why I earlier made the comment about Bathurst being 'over-rated'. An event such as this needs a track where people can easily see a majority of the track - not just the few hundred metres in front of them and then lights (at night only) in the far off distance. I hesitate to say that either Phillip Island or even Eastern Creek would possibly be a more suitable venue for a 24 hour enduro (forget the logistical and environmental problems for the time being though). |
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The name is Nigel - not Nige, definately not Nigo and never Niger - Nigel - plain and simple! |
13 Feb 2006, 13:49 (Ref:1521793) | #50 | ||
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Seems to be ignoring the model of every other 24 Hour race on the planet. Well all bar Daytona I suppose.
So you can only see small amounts of the track at Bathurst. It's never stopped massive crowds showing up for the 1000. Nor does it seem to bother spectators at the 24 Hour of Spa. The Nurburgring event, you'd be luck to even see 1% of the Green Hell from any given space. And Le Mans isn't exactly an ampithetre either. What do all the 24 Hour races have in common, even Daytona? A sense of grandeur. A Bathurst 24 Hour needs to a) capture that, and b) convey it. I can't help but think even Phillip Island would be too constricting. |
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