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Old 26 Sep 2020, 07:59 (Ref:4006325)   #31
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Originally Posted by S griffin View Post
A key in how hard Rosberg pushed Hamilton is seen by how many times Nico finished second when Lewis won.

2014: 11/8
2015: 10/7
2016: 10/5
What does that tell us? Particularly the 10/5 in 2016 when NR took the title?

When you look at the comparison for VB
2017: 9/4
2018: 11/2
2019: 11/6

Does that mean VB hasn't pushed Hamilton as hard? Or does it mean that the Merc has not been as far ahead of the field with VB in the car, so there has been more a contest with other teams?

I think there are too many other variables involved for simply looking at statistics for Merc's other driver finishing second to LH to actually mean anything.
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 09:26 (Ref:4006336)   #32
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I'm just puzzling what all this has to do with the subject of the thread.....
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 09:54 (Ref:4006342)   #33
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Originally Posted by Aysedasi View Post
I'm just puzzling what all this has to do with the subject of the thread.....
I think it's in relation to how Hamilton responds to a team-mate who is/isn't a challenge, and establishing how much of a challenge his previous team-mates were.

In the context of this thread - would a challenge from Max as a team-mate at RBR be something LH would welcome, or want to avoid?
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 10:37 (Ref:4006346)   #34
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Originally Posted by crmalcolm View Post
What does that tell us? Particularly the 10/5 in 2016 when NR took the title?

When you look at the comparison for VB
2017: 9/4
2018: 11/2
2019: 11/6

Does that mean VB hasn't pushed Hamilton as hard? Or does it mean that the Merc has not been as far ahead of the field with VB in the car, so there has been more a contest with other teams?

I think there are too many other variables involved for simply looking at statistics for Merc's other driver finishing second to LH to actually mean anything.

Or maybe you need to stop trying to read too much into things. If you think Bottas has done as well as Rosberg in terms of Hamilton, well I have yet to see enough to convince me, good as Valterri. You canít paint things up, when not just stats, but performance also shows it too
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 10:42 (Ref:4006348)   #35
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Casper should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridCasper should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I am not sure Verstappen will win a WDC at at all, he has the talent but I can see it is possible that the younger drivers coming through may move the goal posts so to speak and MB's long domination has certainly prevented him from being a WDC already. In ordinary circumstances he could just have been a WDC already but MB have effectively blocked his way so far.

If MB continue their winning ways which is more likely than not how many years do you think Verstappen has to wait his chance? He has just about gauranteed that a move to MB is out of the question because his contract is out of phase with everyone else's. RB do not look like they are going to return to the podium within the next decade and all in all I would not put a bet on his WDC chances at all. Time will tell of course but brilliant drivers before him have not won either.

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Originally Posted by steve_r View Post
Jordan talks as if Hamilton has something to prove. Verstappen is the one with something to prove. And yet he keeps signing long term contracts with Red Bull, instead of trying to get a seat in the best car on the grid. But that is another matter altogether. Eventually I'm sure he will win the WDC - and maybe several - whether that is with RBR or some other team. But while he is the hottest or 2nd hottest property in F1, perhaps his management should be trying to get him into a car that will deliver a WDC.
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 11:13 (Ref:4006350)   #36
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Originally Posted by S griffin View Post
Or maybe you need to stop trying to read too much into things. If you think Bottas has done as well as Rosberg in terms of Hamilton, well I have yet to see enough to convince me, good as Valterri. You canít paint things up, when not just stats, but performance also shows it too
I did not state that I think Bottas has done as well as Rosberg.
I was trying to establish what you meant by saying that the statistics of Rosberg being second to a Hamilton win being 'key'?

Please don't take any query for clarification as a criticism - sometimes it might just be that people are trying to get a better understanding of the point you are trying to make.....
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 11:13 (Ref:4006351)   #37
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Originally Posted by Casper View Post
I am not sure Verstappen will win a WDC at at all, he has the talent but I can see it is possible that the younger drivers coming through may move the goal posts so to speak and MB's long domination has certainly prevented him from being a WDC already. In ordinary circumstances he could just have been a WDC already but MB have effectively blocked his way so far.
...

Time will tell of course but brilliant drivers before him have not won either.
This, exactly.

Max is surely talented and determined enough, that is not the problem.

He may end up as a multi-time champion but he may as well end his carreer without a title at all.
Nobody can tell.

Eveything has to be in order at exactly the right, there is too many circumstances out of his control.

Same is true of course for Leclerc (and other upcoming talents).

Just imagine Ferrari gets its acts together in the next few years. We may see a Ferrari-Leclerc dominance.
Or if Mercedes keeps doing what it is doing, then maybe Lewis' eventual successor (Russell? or someone else) will pick up where Lewis left.
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 11:18 (Ref:4006353)   #38
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I'm just puzzling what all this has to do with the subject of the thread.....
Which is Eddie Jordan right?
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 12:32 (Ref:4006368)   #39
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Which is Eddie Jordan right?
No idea. I've completely forgotten (both him and the purpose of the thread.....).
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 12:44 (Ref:4006376)   #40
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User joined yesterday, makes one post, edits profile to have a commercial link as their home page...

Looks like a duck to me!
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 14:48 (Ref:4006407)   #41
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User joined yesterday, makes one post, edits profile to have a commercial link as their home page...

Looks like a duck to me!
Good catch!
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 14:56 (Ref:4006410)   #42
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User joined yesterday, makes one post, edits profile to have a commercial link as their home page...

Looks like a duck to me!
Yeah good call..... Reported.
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Old 26 Sep 2020, 15:42 (Ref:4006421)   #43
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Total non-story. Just like the one about Hamilton joining Ferrari.....
Ah but then again....... Webber to Renault.
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Old 27 Sep 2020, 00:21 (Ref:4006584)   #44
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2 litre Touring Car Star is heading for a stewards' enquiry!
Verstappen will be in F1 til he's 45, and will have his period to cash in on success. Similar to how it's evolved for other wunderkinds like Vettel and Hamilton.


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Originally Posted by Aysedasi View Post
I'm just puzzling what all this has to do with the subject of the thread.....
It's all to point out how team/driver dynamics plays out. For my contribution to it, I kind of don't like how old rusted on notions are expressed when I think they're incorrect (Or even objectively incorrect).

The thing about a Verstappen/Hamilton team up, is who would the development of the car sway towards? At MB it's Hamilton, and at RB it's Verstappen. So idk what'd happen at a neutral team.
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Old 27 Sep 2020, 00:38 (Ref:4006591)   #45
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Ah but then again....... Webber to Renault.
That is such old news. Itís Webber to Alpine.
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