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Old 7 Aug 2020, 09:11 (Ref:3993479)   #16
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Originally Posted by steve nielsen View Post
Marko really did not appreciate Sainz seniors comments in the Spanish press about promoting Max over Carlos, and it was Carlos(and/or his father) who decided they did'nt want to wait anymore at Toro Rosso and left for Renault.
...And it worked out well for him,, now out of /away from the toxic Marko influence and after a hiccup at Renault, now with a good future on his own terms.
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 09:47 (Ref:3993492)   #17
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Exactly, Danny and Carlos saw the light and decided that they would be better off going their own way.
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 10:03 (Ref:3993500)   #18
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Red Bull seem to basically be Benetton in the Schumacher days.

Avoid that second seat like the plague youngsters.
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 11:58 (Ref:3993529)   #19
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The problem is you need to prove yourself there or you have nowhere else to go. Thatís how Sainz and Ricciardo have got other seats
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 13:29 (Ref:3993548)   #20
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Columbus should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I agree, thereís no curse on the second seat. If youíre good enough, itís an incredible opportunity to prove your worth in a top-three car - albeit in a supporting role. No one is expecting the #2 driver to take points away from Max, but if Red Bull wants to take the fight to Mercedes and Ferrari for either title, Verstappen needs a wing-man capable of taking points from Hamilton, Bottas, Leclerc and Vettel. Next season, theyíll have an ambitious Ferrari-mounted Sainz - with a point to prove - to contend with.
Gasly wasnít good enough and Alexander Albon - who has the weakest CV of any Red Bull/Torro Rosso/Alpha Tauri driver - probably wouldnít even be in F1 if he hadnít switched to Thai nationality (son of ex-BTCC racer Nigel, he was born and raised in the UK and thanks to mum had much of his racing career funded by British tax payers!).
Red Bull needs to forget Markoís failing Junior Team ladder and remember its radical roots. Time to recruit some real talent from elsewhere. Hire Perez or Vettel? Make Norris an offer he canít refuse? Or look further afield to Formula E and beyond? There are plenty of drivers out there with the skills to get the job done.
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 13:47 (Ref:3993556)   #21
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I agree, there’s no curse on the second seat. If you’re good enough, it’s an incredible opportunity to prove your worth in a top-three car - albeit in a supporting role. No one is expecting the #2 driver to take points away from Max, but if Red Bull wants to take the fight to Mercedes and Ferrari for either title, Verstappen needs a wing-man capable of taking points from Hamilton, Bottas, Leclerc and Vettel. Next season, they’ll have an ambitious Ferrari-mounted Sainz - with a point to prove - to contend with.
Gasly wasn’t good enough and Alexander Albon - who has the weakest CV of any Red Bull/Torro Rosso/Alpha Tauri driver - probably wouldn’t even be in F1 if he hadn’t switched to Thai nationality (son of ex-BTCC racer Nigel, he was born and raised in the UK and thanks to mum had much of his racing career funded by British tax payers!).
Red Bull needs to forget Marko’s failing Junior Team ladder and remember its radical roots. Time to recruit some real talent from elsewhere. Hire Perez or Vettel? Make Norris an offer he can’t refuse? Or look further afield to Formula E and beyond? There are plenty of drivers out there with the skills to get the job done.
There is no curse on the second seat, no. But RBR struggles to have 2 drivers who can take the fight to Mercedes as Marko and Christian have the attention span of a kid with ADHD overdosing on sugar in a brightly coloured room. As soon as the new talent comes along, they don't care about the other driver. Danny Ric went from Hero to second best in record time. Albon may not be doing that well, but the team has a history of badly managing drivers.
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 13:55 (Ref:3993561)   #22
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steve_r should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridsteve_r should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridsteve_r should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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Or look further afield to Formula E and beyond? There are plenty of drivers out there with the skills to get the job done.
Half the Formula E grid are Red Bull Rejects.
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 14:40 (Ref:3993567)   #23
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Iíd go further and say most of the FE grid are F1 rejects

And yes, you need a strong head and be able to stand on your own two feet when you drive for Red Bull. They ainít one for lending a helping hand when times are tough
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 15:02 (Ref:3993569)   #24
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They ainít one for lending a helping hand when times are tough
And maybe that is one of the main causes of their curent (and past) problem(s) ?
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 15:08 (Ref:3993570)   #25
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I'm just waiting for another "Max" to land the 2nd seat. Sparks will fly..
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 15:53 (Ref:3993575)   #26
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Time to recruit some real talent from elsewhere. Hire Perez or Vettel? .
I confess I struggle with the examples given. If you were Horner, would you take Vettel back to partner Max?
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 16:10 (Ref:3993578)   #27
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Are we putting ourselves in Horners shoes? If so - I'd continue to talk about how Max is a 1 of a kind superstar, and then I'd be upset at the second driver for also not being 1 of a kind. I'd sack or demote them and then put someone else in the seat, and then be upset how they are also note 1 of a kind. This cycle can continue for as long as it needs to.

If someone does become 1 of a kind, then I'd immediately forget about Max and he'd leave. At that point I'd bad mouth Max and say he's ungrateful. And I'd **** off my engine supplier telling them how terrible they are whilst I win titles, and then I'd go find a worse engine to put in the car and get worse results with. I'd then start looking for the next 1 of a kind to match my 1 of a kind, and then demote them when they don't become a 1 of a kind.

That's about all I've got. How did I do?
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 16:11 (Ref:3993580)   #28
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That's about all I've got. How did I do?
Christian, cut it out with the sockpuppet accounts.
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 16:23 (Ref:3993586)   #29
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Are we putting ourselves in Horners shoes? If so - I'd continue to talk about how Max is a 1 of a kind superstar, and then I'd be upset at the second driver for also not being 1 of a kind. I'd sack or demote them and then put someone else in the seat, and then be upset how they are also note 1 of a kind. This cycle can continue for as long as it needs to.

If someone does become 1 of a kind, then I'd immediately forget about Max and he'd leave. At that point I'd bad mouth Max and say he's ungrateful. And I'd **** off my engine supplier telling them how terrible they are whilst I win titles, and then I'd go find a worse engine to put in the car and get worse results with. I'd then start looking for the next 1 of a kind to match my 1 of a kind, and then demote them when they don't become a 1 of a kind.

That's about all I've got. How did I do?
This is all very well. But would you take back Vettel to partner Max.....?

I can't believe I'm even asking that question.....
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Old 7 Aug 2020, 18:07 (Ref:3993608)   #30
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No, and if I was Vettel I wouldn't want that seat even if I was offered
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