Sunbeam Rapier in Historic racing?

[kkj]

I actually have a Rapier, unfortunately a Series 5

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

having recently acquired and watched colour footage of the tin top meeting at Silverstone in May 1963 ( first outing of the Galaxy) You can see that the Cortina GT was the class leader but the Rapier was up there with it. both battling for class honours. The Jag was obviously a front runner at that point. It was the beginning of the end for that wave of cars.

I'm old enough to have seen the Cortina GT's first-ever race (?) at Oulton in April 1963; at the time it seemed sacrilegious that a mere Ford could beat such thoroughbreds as Rapiers & Riley 1.5s! A few years later I was driving a Mk1 GT, the first of a succession of Fords. . . racing does (or did!) sell cars.

[SAMD]

Is there a race for pre '63 saloons? Would a 1962, 997 Cooper be competitive anywhere?

[simon drabble]

there should be a race - I think it would get a lot of traction. Giulia Ti Supers, Mni 997's, Fiat Arbaths, Sunbeams, Riley's Cortina GTs and Zodiacs and Mk2's... whata great grid

[LAK]

Pre-60 Touring Greats with HRDC - we race the Aurelia and my Fiat Abarth in this. Admittedly rules out the Cortina and some Jags etc but cracking racing. More here (take a look at the gallery): http://www.hrdc.eu/

[kkj]

Originally Posted by LAK

Pre-60 Touring Greats with HRDC - we race the Aurelia and my Fiat Abarth in this. Admittedly rules out the Cortina and some Jags etc but cracking racing. More here (take a look at the gallery): http://www.hrdc.eu/

Noticed that -57 Hillman MInx with a Holbay 1725 engine etc. Is all that allowed?

[simon drabble]

I hate to disagree with you Louise but take a gander at this list of cars: http://homepage.mac.com/frank_de_jon...63%20Cars.html
and if you look at the individual rounds there are some other cars liek Zodiacs etc the point being IMHO you either go 66 and scoop up the Lotus Cortinas Mustangs etc or you go back to Jaguar Mk2's etc but a cut off in 1960 is neither fish nor foul

[LAK]

Hi Simon. No diasagreement at all - just mentioned a Series that's currently running although didn't mention that there are no Mini's - it seems very popular so Julius must have hit a nerve there. Also forgot to mention Carol Spagg's U2TC but of course that precludes the big boys. Love the look of the pre-63 TC list - how about a Lancia Flavia Coupe!

[simon drabble]

it would make a very cool and diverse grid

[AGD A105/6]

The Minx uses period Holbay parts I believe, hen's teeth to find, and they were raced (or maybe it was rallied) in period like that, Robin did give me chapter and verse last year. HRDC rules permit capacity up to 1738cc, same for Sunbeam Rapier (all models).

There is plenty of Rootes engine exertise among the Alpine fraternity. Have sent you a pm.

For the record my A105 (technically not a Wessie, don't ask me, blame BMC marketing) is built to pass HRDC rules as I haven't the means to rebuild/replace anything on the spot that any Eligibility Scrutineer might pick up on. I have looked at HSCC rules as I hope to race at Croft and I can't see anything particularly amiss there either. I don't think Jim Woodley's would be a million miles away, I haven't really looked at the A90 so cannot speak for that one. Available Healey engine mods within the rules are extensive, it's only money - mine has the original crank for example rather than some umpty-grand steel thing which can rev higher. It is MoT'd and is driven on the road from time to time when I'm feeling particularly deaf.

I'm never going to win anything but I did have a fantastic time at Brands and look forward to more of the same. And yes, you can even have fun racing for last position, as I have done frequently with my Tiger in Intermarque.

KKJ, have a chat with Julius to find if your car would be acceptable. Certain models / marks (eg Mini, Anglia 105E, A40 Mk2) are prohibited, presumably because it could lead to dominance by one or the other rather than the enjoyable diversity we have today. Not sure how that would apply to a series V Rapier.

I believe you would also be most welcome to join the annual Sunbeam Challenge race which takes place on Sunday June 26th at AMOC Donington; 2x 10 minutes races this year, televised on Motors TV. The Minx joined us last year as the eligibility was extended to historic Rootes cars.

[kkj]

Originally Posted by Andrew Davenall

The Minx uses period Holbay parts I believe, hen's teeth to find, and they were raced (or maybe it was rallied) in period like that, Robin did give me chapter and verse last year. HRDC rules permit capacity up to 1738cc, same for Sunbeam Rapier (all models).

Holbay 1725 5-bearing engine?
Where can the HRDC rules be found?

[zefarelly]

KKJ, email Julius and he'll issue a set forthwith!

THe whole idea of HRDC (Like CTCRC) is to offer something sensible for those on a sensible budget, its a difficult and vague line to draw between modern and period modifications, but both have done so, as well as can be expected. Minis and Anglias have ben excluded for good reason, over the years they have been incredibly over developed, mini's more notably, and they have plenty of alternative playgrounds. I do think 850 minis and 997 Anglias in '59 trim would be unique however . . . but could anyone be trusted/persuaded to prepare and compete as such! I think the CTCRC is the only place in the country where period correct minis race.

the problem with cut off dates is everyone wants to change it to suit their own car. I'd go May '63 myself! HRDC nicely hits a spot where its got something different to offer without really interfereing with anything else. the grid at Brands speaks for itself.

[kkj]

Sounds like an interesting idea when even an Hillman Minx is an option .
Any video clips on youtube?

How many "old car" series are there in UK? Can anyone list them?

[zefarelly]

sorry, haven't got time, I'm unlikely to live past 100!

[riley1.5]

Here's a clip of us at Brands a few years ago ..... yep - racing against Mike Peets Rapier!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKO83GSIs9Q

What Julius has done is great - we just cant wait to get racing again (just the small matter of no engine at the moment!)

Roger

[Alan Morgan]

Iain's en route (or should that be on root in Iain-speak) to Pau. I can confirm that Jim Woodley's A105 Westminster has a Healey 3000 engine and overdrive box. I've never driven it on track, but I have been around Goodwood in the passenger seat on a number of occasions. Suprisingly, it's a very nimble and "planted" race car.

The Galaxie is a bit more of a handful...

[kkj]

Every chassis (car) can be made usable, but I guess some need some extra treatment

[zefarelly]

indeed they can kkj . . . .modern lap times for old cars give it away really!

[Mike Bell]

Following this thread suddenly the idea of 850 Minis and 997 Angleboxes racing on standard wheels and drum brakes sounds somewhat appealing- and no doubt challenging. Where do I enter?

[Peter Mallett]

Could you run the Broadspeed 997 Anglia or the 998 Mini Cooper?

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Could you run the Broadspeed 997 Anglia or the 998 Mini Cooper?

They are both a bit 'souped up', Peter. Disc brakes? Certainly not!

[kkj]

Where can I find info about HRDC? Cars, driver, etc. The HRDC website has very little.

[zefarelly]

KJ read my post . . . . JT is issueing regs to those making serious enquiries, drop him a line.

WHen Julius ran Top Hat he tried a 1L class but the response was underwhelming, dissapointing as I think it'd be briliant, there's a similar series in France which was a bumper grid at Dijon a few years back.

the CTCRC is the only place that has 60's smaller tin tops now, although if you wanted gp5 Broadspeed type stuff then the HRSR caters in spades

[Peter Mallett]

Not Gp5 but the 997 cosworth engined cars from early 60s.

Edit: Just looked at the website: http://www.hrdc.eu/calendar.html

Seems the GTs can go to 1965 (witness the Lenham GTs) but the Touiring cars are limited to pre 60.

[kkj]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

KJ read my post . . .

Done........I have to send a mail and see what happens.
I just want to open a website and read instantly