Chevron B16

[p261brm]

B16S-70-01 Ford FVC 1970 Gr.6 Chevron Cars (Redman) => Team Gunston ...=> Jo Siffert Automobiles Racing Ltd....=> Don Shead
This is not correct. The B16 spyder was stripped, the chassis returned to Arch refurbed and rebuilt as a 16/19 with a brand new body and sold to George Humble for his son Peter to race. This car was written off at Oulton Park. The chassis was cut up with a hacksaw at George's house Lupton Towers Kirkby Lonsdale. Some useable suspension items were sold to Peter Smith who used them to construct his 19. I can confirm this as will Peter Smith and Peter Humble. I cut it up

[driftwood]

p261 brm- you obviously worked in period on these cars and based near to Chevron had your finger on the puilse of things back then
can you clarify these points
1 The B16S car was it literally a B16 with roof cut off or
2 the car was modified or am i confused and your saying AFTER the B16S conversion the car was THEN stripped sent to Arch motors?
you mention B16/19 in waht way was it B16 and B19 was this B16 chassis and b19 bodywork- wa sthecar called a B19? with chassis plate?
Peter Smith- did he order new b19 from factory and utilsie your old suspension from the written off car? or did he buy chassis and build his car up in garden shed and ran with no official plate?

what date / race was the B16s cum 19 written off?

[driftwood]

Chevron B19 with a chassis number 70 S 10 any information would be a big help.
This car was up for sale in auction in March car did not sell what do you know about this car? was it a pukka B19 or the B16S muletta car
as far as i am aware all B19 chassis plates are B19-71-??
the car is here it was guid eprice £100-130 in the auction & i believe stopped at 88k
http://www.barons-auctions.com/detai...s/NotApply.htm

[p261brm]

1, The ex B16 spyder, was stripped, the alloy body retained by Chevron chassis refurbed by Arch and built as a B19, except for the upper rear suspension points which remained as per B16. The body was a standard Specialised Mouldings product. If I could work the system to post a photo I have a photo of this car in the paddock at Oulton just prior to being written off by Peter Humble in practice and subsquently cut up. If you send a message with your e-mail address I will send via that medium.
2, Peter Smith purchased from Chevron a B21 Chassis 01 and built his car on that chassis using some of the suspension from Humble's wreck.(Just confirmed by the man)

Cars were updated from earlier to later spec, were they re-numbered? who knows? One man only Paul Owens and he has the works chassis book, we have the 'Original' Chevron Car Company, Never was it was Derek Bennett Engineering and the Chevron Logo was a registered design, now in the hands of Vin Malkie as I understand.
Date of the race at Oulton, I have e-mailed Peter Humble, he is in India at the moment but September 1971 will be as near as damn is to swearing.

[p261brm]

Addendum, Rodney Bloor of Sports Motors Manchester a very early Chevron fanatic passed away yesterday 2/6/08

[p261brm]

Hi Driftwood, I have looked at the photo of the B19 at Barons, it would appear the rear wheels/tyres are contained inside the body work. When the Firestones/Slicks were first used the rears protruded outside of the body the FIA got all upset at this and all teams pop riveted strips of alloy round the wheel arch to appease the scrutineers. Later mouldings were modified.

[henk4]

Originally Posted by p261brm

Hi Driftwood, I have looked at the photo of the B19 at Barons, it would appear the rear wheels/tyres are contained inside the body work. When the Firestones/Slicks were first used the rears protruded outside of the body the FIA got all upset at this and all teams pop riveted strips of alloy round the wheel arch to appease the scrutineers. Later mouldings were modified.

http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/gallery.php?num=8543

in action in 2007, and yes the wheels are within the bodywork

[p261brm]

Originally Posted by henk4

http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/gallery.php?num=8543

in action in 2007, and yes the wheels are within the bodywork

Thank you then either the rear body section is B21 or top rear suspension mounting has not been modified for camber change or the car is on narrow wheels?

[henk4]

I don't know, Alan Timpany was racing the car, but he is not active this year, so I cannot ask. I'll look for more picture of the car with the bodywork off.

[phdm]

Originally Posted by henk4

I don't know, Alan Timpany was racing the car, but he is not active this year, so I cannot ask. I'll look for more picture of the car with the bodywork off.

Here are a few pictures of this car.

[henk4]

Originally Posted by phdm

Here are a few pictures of this car.

thanks Philippe, I was referring to my own archives, and I found this one..

http://img220.imageshack.us/my.php?i...mg71591ro3.jpg

[henk4]

for a comparison, here is a pci of a B19, shot during the 2005 Monterey Historics (celebrating Chevron 40th) of a B19, according to the programme Chassis #1, built 1970. I did not see a plate though. (at that time I did not know where to look for it

http://img71.imageshack.us/my.php?im...1197011wk8.jpg

[henk4]

Originally Posted by p261brm

B16S-70-01 Ford FVC 1970 Gr.6 Chevron Cars (Redman) => Team Gunston ...=> Jo Siffert Automobiles Racing Ltd....=> Don Shead
This is not correct. The B16 spyder was stripped, the chassis returned to Arch refurbed and rebuilt as a 16/19 with a brand new body and sold to George Humble for his son Peter to race. This car was written off at Oulton Park. The chassis was cut up with a hacksaw at George's house Lupton Towers Kirkby Lonsdale. Some useable suspension items were sold to Peter Smith who used them to construct his 19. I can confirm this as will Peter Smith and Peter Humble. I cut it up

well, a B16 Spyder ran at the 2005 Monterey Historics, this is what the plate to the car said:

http://img65.imageshack.us/my.php?im...p19702std4.jpg

[driftwood]

i thought the B16S was late 1970 debut so i have looked at the Chevron story and this inoi is evident
Redman needs open top car as B16 is beaten by Lola T210
He asks Derek B for a car and suggest they copy the porsche 908 body shape
so the heavy B16 body is removed including the round sills and square sills fitted with an ALLOY body -nothing else is done to the car and tested end of August
1st race is Nurburging 500km race and the car is heavily burnt in a fire during the race but is rebuilt for Spa 2 weeks later where it wins 20 sept 1970 the win gives Chevron the european 2 litre sports car title
Later Redman emigrates to ZA but races the B16S in the Sprigbok c/ship wiing all 5 2 litre races and in the 9 hours Kyalami race 5th overall & wins the 2 litre class with John Hine
looking at the photo of the results board the info is wrong in sugessting the B16S raced prior to Nurburgring 500 KM race !!!
The photos of the B16S shows the roll hoop as a simple single seater shape not the full width cockpit cage the B19 utilises
For 1971 Chevron "build" 35 B19 cars but some are B16 cars updated


Solar bought 3 B16 cars from Swiss agent Jo Siffert to make the 1970 film Le Man 1 car was Digby Martlands BMW powered car the other 2 where FVC powered cars

[henk4]

Originally Posted by driftwood

looking at the photo of the results board the info is wrong in sugessting the B16S raced prior to Nurburgring 500 KM race !!!

it is suggested that the car was converted "early" in the season, so what we need to find is what car Redman was driving for instance in Anderstorp....

[driftwood]

he would have been in the B16 Coupe OK it may well have been the same chassis nothing has been said to advise IF they took redmans car and cut it about Or took anoher car and took that body off
bottom line is the open top car is possibly only half the car that raced prior to Nurburgring
In principle it has a different chassis number/ or type designation but may well still be the same "gene" pool car
However the car in yiour photos doe snot have teh same dna- doe sit have the same gearbox or motor or chassis or body from the original Redman raced B16S?
as stated earlier the chassi was rebuilt as a b19 for Huimble to race then crashed and cut up suspension used on Smiths b19 car
Alloy body was at chevron factory and allegedly later went to Vin M so where di engine gearbox 4 uprights brakes etc go to?

[LoLola]

FYI Mark Leonard at Grand Prix Classics in La Jolla CA has one coming up for sale. I don't know the details but I am sure he would share them with you if interested.

Nick

[p261brm]

Originally Posted by henk4

well, a B16 Spyder ran at the 2005 Monterey Historics, this is what the plate to the car said:

http://img65.imageshack.us/my.php?im...p19702std4.jpg

All due respect comrade it says OXO on some London Transport Buses, and they are most certainly not made of it; this is the whole point of many disputes back it with facts not hear say, and I can back what I say to be correct with the evidence of others; Peter Humble who drove the car, owned the car, and wrote it off. Also Peter Smith another well known Chevron owner & in period driver who purchased some useful parts left over, and with a sworn affidavit by parties concerned if necesary. To my knowledge and having due respect for the person who imparted it to me; there are 2 of these cars in the USofA after all the Americans are pretty good at replica's they have produced enough Genuine Rolls Royce Merlins to power all the genuine Battle of Britain Spitfires around.

[henk4]

Originally Posted by p261brm

All due respect comrade it says OXO on some London Transport Buses, and they are most certainly not made of it; this is the whole point of many disputes back it with facts not hear say, and I can back what I say to be correct with the evidence of others; Peter Humble who drove the car, owned the car, and wrote it off. Also Peter Smith another well known Chevron owner & in period driver who purchased some useful parts left over, and with a sworn affidavit by parties concerned if necesary. To my knowledge and having due respect for the person who imparted it to me; there are 2 of these cars in the USofA after all the Americans are pretty good at replica's they have produced enough Genuine Rolls Royce Merlins to power all the genuine Battle of Britain Spitfires around.

just to clarify, when I post some "information" it does not mean that I believe it....(it is like a "quote", which you can make without agreeing to it)

[national8]

This should provoke some discussion
Check out the story on this website.
http://www.classiccar.co.nz/articles...hevron-b16-208

[henk4]

Originally Posted by national8

This should provoke some discussion
Check out the story on this website.
http://www.classiccar.co.nz/articles...hevron-b16-208

very nice story, puts things really in perspective. I got a bit worried when the owner says: The car is approved by Chevron so it has some heritage, but I don't think it will ever be advertised with "an uninterrupted 40 years racing history".
And for what it is worth, I only saw a B16 for the first time in 1987 during the Steigenberger Cup held at Zandvoort and I can fully understand the sentiments of the mechanic who conceived the idea of building one. (During the B16s racing days I was only reading French and German magazines, which hardly covered the 2-liter class)

[p261brm]

Originally Posted by national8

This should provoke some discussion
Check out the story on this website.
www.classiccar.co.nz/articles/rec-racer-chevron-b16-208

It does indeed; ? built to comply with appendix K and the FIA issue papers to that effect with a BMW engine when B16's were homologated with FVC engines. Also FVC's have to be 'freshened' every 4 hours running? I know we were good in those days but 'freshen' an engine in the middle of a 1000k race even Spa was 4hrs plus most 6hrs or more. Generaly an engine did a practice and a race. But after all the man has the car he wanted.

[p261brm]

Also from the article in Car & Classic;[Quote]By this time Roger Andreason had taken over what was left of Chevron after it folded in 1980, and was trading under the name Chevron Cars and not Derek Bennett Engineering, as had been the case in Chevron’s heyday.[Quote]
This Quote is as I understand the history, is only true in part, and as such is a contribution to the confusion; as to who owns what today, in particular reference to the registered design i.e. the badge/logo on the front of the cars. I always have understood Robin Smith et al bought the residue from the receiver, moving the whole to Scotland outbidding Bob Howlings. Derek Bennett engineering is; again as I understand to be, owned by Vin & Helen Malkie along with the registered design. Roger bought his invovlement from Robin Smith etal.

[driftwood]

I did not need to read the article to know who had the car and its story

Owner has, as P261BRM said, a car that he wanted but all the time I have a hole in my derrier it is NOT a Chevron to me; it is a replica and even the continuation cars are replicas thanks to baement Max, we have this farce of FIA papers where anyone can build a car to the same specs as the original car and get Fia papers to race. Next we will be making 6 wheel Tyrrells, Ferrari 312T4 replicas.

The B16 with its "chevron 2 input gives it a bit more credibility than a car made in a guy's shed but as the article said, only 23 cars were built in period and perhaps 6 exist (the rest, as we are discussing, are fake/ air/copy/ replica cars) all I can say is buyer beware when it comes to looking at a B16 for sale at £225-250k as is reported on the sale prices, I for one will not be buying a non original car as there are plenty of other real cars of different marques that you can buy for the money.

[national8]

Originally Posted by p261brm

It does indeed; ? built to comply with appendix K and the FIA issue papers to that effect with a BMW engine when B16's were homologated with FVC engines. Also FVC's have to be 'freshened' every 4 hours running? I know we were good in those days but 'freshen' an engine in the middle of a 1000k race even Spa was 4hrs plus most 6hrs or more. Generaly an engine did a practice and a race. But after all the man has the car he wanted.

You are correct with regard to engine homologation. However the 1970 sales brochure mentions "the car can also be adapted to accept the Chevron/BMW 2-litre racing engine. With regard to the relative merits of the two engines (Ford/BMW) I am sure a well put together FVC would be very suitable as a long distance race engine and indeed it seems to have been a better proposition in period given the published race results for the two engine types. The 10A Mazda proving at Le Mans that it was best.