2012 Road to Indy - Indy Lights, Star Mazda, USF2000

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by Flyin Ryan

This is where the lack of open information on this kind of stuff is a hindrance to the sport. Everyone else works for peanuts? We don't know what the 15th-best driver in Indycar now makes in comparison to his comparative number in 2002, 1992, 1982, 1972, etc. We don't know gate money is received like in boxing or MMA for example because promoters would never release them. We don't know what rent for a track is. In modern athlete terms it's probably peanuts but if you find who that driver was 30 years ago, I doubt that man was rich he probably had a working-class to middle-class living as a racecar driver, so that'd be something that's not changed.

NASCAR's having its struggles too at the moment. And I would never tell even a talented driver in the U.S. to move over and try F1. It's not worth it and a lot of people over there would be wanting you to fail.

You mention Conor Daly, I've talked to guys that raced against Daly, and they don't respect him because they knew they were better than him racing against him at lower levels. And this guy won a Star Mazda title, an Indy Lights race, and is now following around the F1 circuit in GP3.

The issue with that though is you're effectively Marty Roth then. That's part of what detracts from sportscars for me is versions of Marty Roth are half the fields it has sometimes seemed, Marty Roth in Indycar was vilified, Marty Roth in sportscars would be perfectly normal. I'll defend Roth before I defend the Milka Dunos and Hiro Matsushi+as of the world because leaving his talent or lack thereof out of it, he created his own ride, he did not buy anyone else's, but still you're not going to have a series people care about if people like him are a good portion of your grid.

In regards to pay, I know enough drivers from past and present or they are friends of friends and of what I know, drivers in CART did better financially than they do now, inflation adjusted dollars of course. There are very few in the irl that after expenses and insurance, make a decent packet of wages.

Therefore if you are looking to make a living as a driver, the irl is not a place you want to aim for, especially considering millions have to be spent getting you there. Not a good return on investment, which is why the irl is filled with wealthy ride buyers instead of quality American talent.

In regards to Conor Daly, fast only counts in results on the track, not trackside bench racing BS. You say your friends "knew" they were better, but that doesn't count for anything.

I only met Conor once years ago. We were running an event where a skippy race was on the menu also. We got talking to his dad and Conor came over when he wasn't racing to shag cones for us. Seemed like a nice kid, but focused and I felt had the right mindset to succeed for sure. Just the fact he is in GP3 says a lot, as they don't exactly roll out the welcome wagon for Americans in Europe. That is a much more intense environment. indy lights is amateur hour by comparison.

My point about creating wealth and then going racing is aimed at those without the resources or connections at a young age. If you are 18 and working a minimum wage job or are in college, you will not be racing open wheel formula cars unless daddy is writing big checks. Even if you save up for a 3 day school at Skippy, well after that what do you do? In my opinion to even get your name recognized at all or get decent start up experience you need at least $100k to get going. Haydenfan is a good example here. I remember when he ran in Skippy. He and dad blew a sizable chunk of change and to what end?

Yep there are people that by hook or crook have pulled it off, I've created some great opportunities for myself by just knocking on doors, but I think overall you are better off creating wealth for yourself and then going racing. Again I'm talking to those without rich dads.

Zak Brown is a great example. I remember when he was scraping around getting bottom of the barrel rides back in the early 1990's, going nowhere. He started his own motorsport marketing business and turned himself into a major multi millionaire and now he does whatever the hell he wants and has the clout and connections now to seek out alternative funding as well. Very smart guy.