[LM24 Race] The 80th 24 Hours of Le Mans - Talk Thread

[JasonM3]

Although this particular part of the forum this thread is on is dedicated to this topic entirely, I would like to start a more generalized thread about the 80th 24 Hours of Le Mans. There are prediction threads, camping threads, and behind the scenes threads, but wouldn't it be easier if we sort of bring all our ideas together and chat about what the race will be like. Let's please stick to the official practice, qualifying, and race subjects and not about other, unrelated things unless it is prudent to the conversation.

I am new at this forum (just joined today) and wanted to start talking more readily about racing. By going on this forum, I open up my access to talking to equally or more educated racing fans than myself. So I hope some people respond and let's have a good old time predicting, talking, and posting the latest bits of news for this thread.

A note to the moderators - if this is too general, don't hesitate to delete it. Just please email me and tell me why; was it too general or did it not comply with the rules, etc. Feel free to move it to a different place if this isn't the right one, as well, though I feel like this is the best place to put this thread.

Let's start out by posing the question: what do you think will happen in GTE throughout the weekend. Also, I feel like FIA has been way too strict about Amateur drivers. Christoffer Nygaard, Allan Simonsen, Gianluca Roda, Christian Ried, Paolo Ruberti, Abdulaziz al Faisal... amateur?! And Roger Wills and Jonny Cocker... pro?!

People have been saying that Aston Martin is just too unreliable. Yeah, last year was, no doubt, a complete and utter , but what about 2005-2008 in GT1 and some good performances in the Vantages. I think it is a bit of a stereotype nowadays, not helped by AMR's woes in 2011. And what about the damn near flawless performance in Sebring this year, putting them 3rd in class? Granted, they had a rough go of things at Spa, but what about that pole? I've usually been a big Corvette fan, but I'd really like to see Aston Martin win this year. I wouldn't discount #99 AMR for GTE-Am, either, but I say #88 Porsche will win on that one.

What do you see as far as the future of GTE? I see a couple of things that could be possible.

1. Prospeed Competition getting a car for GTE Pro, with Goossens and someone like Maxime Soulet, Rene Rast, or Marc Hennerici.
2. Mike Parisy getting a ride at IMSA Performance Matmut and maybe having the #76 in it next year.
3. The #98 AMR race in 2013 after resigning from the reserves this year. I see Rob Bell, Tomas Enge, and Sean-Paul Breslin for that one.
4. Two of the vicious Dodge SRT Viper GTS-R's in 2013: #91 and #93, driven by Ryan Hunter-Reay, Kuno Wittmer, Goossens (if Prospeed Pro entry doesn't work out), Boris Said, Peter Kox, and Burt Longin. A host of other drivers could fullfil this spot.
5. Another JMW car with the likes of Sean-Paul Breslin, Tim Sugden, Xavier Maassen, Rob Bell, etc.
6. BMW coming back to Le Mans
7. Spyker Squadron returning
8. Alex Job #23 ALMS Lotus with Townsend Bell and a couple others.

For this year, I think we've got a battle between these 8 GTE Pros: #51 Ferrari, #97 Aston Martin, #73 Corvette, #74 Corvette, #59 Ferrari, #77 Porsche, #80 Porsche, and the #71 Ferrari. That's all of them but the JMW Ferrari, also known as the "moving construction zone".

I'm interested to see the pace of Toyota, but Audi have basically been spoon-fed the win. I think the Dome #17 will be pretty fast, but not reliable at all.

Anyway, quote, respond, discuss, and banter. And don't forget to enjoy! I may be working on a spotter guide and a general guide like Stephen.

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by JasonM3

Also, I feel like FIA has been way too strict about Amateur drivers. Christoffer Nygaard, Allan Simonsen, Gianluca Roda, Christian Ried, Paolo Ruberti, Abdulaziz al Faisal... amateur?! And Roger Wills and Jonny Cocker... pro?!

GTE-Am allows one "pro" (Gold or Platinum-rated) driver in the squad. Simonsen and Ruberti, for example, are the "pro" drivers in their own cars. Ried, Roda, al Faisal et al have been getting quicker and more consistent over the years, but they are still not fully professional drivers in terms of pace and consistency; besides this, al Faisal is bringing funding to the team, and Ried is the team manager as well as a driver. The only truly "illogical" driver classifications for drivers in GTE-Am, as far as I could see, are Matt Griffin and Markus Palttala: both classified as Silver, but both are damn quick drivers.

As for the JMW guys, Roger Wills is still an amateur driver, but GTE-Pro has no restrictions in terms of drivers. But... Jonny Cocker not a pro? Are you kidding me? Just look at some of his results in the ALMS in the Drayson Lola a couple of years ago.

Originally Posted by JasonM3

What do you see as far as the future of GTE? I see a couple of things that could be possible.

1. Prospeed Competition getting a car for GTE Pro, with Goossens and someone like Maxime Soulet, Rene Rast, or Marc Hennerici.
2. Mike Parisy getting a ride at IMSA Performance Matmut and maybe having the #76 in it next year.
3. The #98 AMR race in 2013 after resigning from the reserves this year. I see Rob Bell, Tomas Enge, and Sean-Paul Breslin for that one.
4. Two of the vicious Dodge SRT Viper GTS-R's in 2013: #91 and #93, driven by Ryan Hunter-Reay, Kuno Wittmer, Goossens (if Prospeed Pro entry doesn't work out), Boris Said, Peter Kox, and Burt Longin. A host of other drivers could fullfil this spot.
5. Another JMW car with the likes of Sean-Paul Breslin, Tim Sugden, Xavier Maassen, Rob Bell, etc.
6. BMW coming back to Le Mans
7. Spyker Squadron returning

1. Not likely, Prospeed are probably focusing more now on BES and other GT3 racing.
2. ???
3. Breslin is far too left-field. Rob Bell is a McLaren factory driver for the GT3 effort nowadays. We'll definitely see three Astons next year if the effort carries on though.
4. If the waiver for the enormous V10 is indeed an ACO waiver, no doubt about Vipers at Le Mans next year.
5. No.
6. Not likely at all, the M3 is dead at the end of this year and the Z4 GT3-to-GTE conversion is still a rumour.
7. Spyker is almost dead after the Saab debacle.

[JasonM3]

Okay, maybe I am a bit "off my hinges", but don't more powerful financial backings want to revive older models? For example, couldn't Pescarolo, in theory, use the Peugeot 908 Hybrid instead of the Dome? I know it is way too late for this year, but it is still a thought for next year.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Prospeed have two cars next year. Why would ANYONE prefer Blancpain over the WEC? It's, quite frankly, stupid. I can almost see a bunch of people flocking from BES to WEC, like Marc VDS. They've already had a Le Mans program.

I'm not saying Jonny Cocker is terrible, as he does have his moments of brilliance (ALMS Road America 2010 and British GT), but he, quite frankly, hasn't had a lot of overall success. Nobody wants to hire him, except JMW now.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Soheil Ayari in the Viper next year.

[Victor_RO]

I'm just providing some answers.

Originally Posted by JasonM3

Okay, maybe I am a bit "off my hinges", but don't more powerful financial backings want to revive older models? For example, couldn't Pescarolo, in theory, use the Peugeot 908 Hybrid instead of the Dome? I know it is way too late for this year, but it is still a thought for next year.

No. They'd still need some factory support to run the cars, and the endurance arm of Peugeot Sport has basically been disbanded, therefore there's nobody left to run the cars. The 908 hybrid will gather dust under covers, never to be raced unfortunately. There was a rumour very early in the year that Signatech would be running a semi-works 908 effort, but when the Peugeot pull-out was announced, they also said that there would be no possibility of giving the cars to another team to run.

Originally Posted by JasonM3

I wouldn't be surprised to see Prospeed have two cars next year. Why would ANYONE prefer Blancpain over the WEC? It's, quite frankly, stupid. I can almost see a bunch of people flocking from BES to WEC, like Marc VDS. They've already had a Le Mans program.

GT3 cars are "relatively" cheaper than GTE cars (good GTE cars are in the 500 thousand Euro bracket, GT3 cars are "catching up" but are still in the 350-400 thousand Euro ballpark) and they can be raced in a whole load of championships, not just Blancpain; there are a number of strong national GT3 series which have teams that also run Blancpain races, you could run a GT3 car in the VLN and at the Nurburgring 24h... pure GTE cars only have the WEC and the ALMS as places to run, as well as possibly GT Open.

Also, have a look at the size of the entries in WEC and in Blancpain. 22 GTE cars for Le Mans, and only about 12-13 are full-season WEC entries, while Blancpain has over 50 entries for each race, and for Spa they've actually had to turn a lot of entries away (90-odd entries applying for around 60-65 places on the grid); about 50% more than they had last year.

[JasonM3]

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

I'm just providing some answers.



No. They'd still need some factory support to run the cars, and the endurance arm of Peugeot Sport has basically been disbanded, therefore there's nobody left to run the cars. The 908 hybrid will gather dust under covers, never to be raced unfortunately. There was a rumour very early in the year that Signatech would be running a semi-works 908 effort, but when the Peugeot pull-out was announced, they also said that there would be no possibility of giving the cars to another team to run.



GT3 cars are "relatively" cheaper than GTE cars (good GTE cars are in the 500 thousand Euro bracket, GT3 cars are "catching up" but are still in the 350-400 thousand Euro ballpark) and they can be raced in a whole load of championships, not just Blancpain; there are a number of strong national GT3 series which have teams that also run Blancpain races, you could run a GT3 car in the VLN and at the Nurburgring 24h... pure GTE cars only have the WEC and the ALMS as places to run, as well as possibly GT Open.

Also, have a look at the size of the entries in WEC and in Blancpain. 22 GTE cars for Le Mans, and only about 12-13 are full-season WEC entries, while Blancpain has over 50 entries for each race, and for Spa they've actually had to turn a lot of entries away (90-odd entries applying for around 60-65 places on the grid); about 50% more than they had last year.

There is absolutely no doubt that there are more cars in the Blancpain Endurance Series than in the World Endurance Championship. Therefore, we will always be wanting, and not necessarily having, more GT in WEC.

Thinking in advance a little here, I can see these specific models in the 81st 24 hours of le mans, for sure.

1. Ferrari 458 GTC
2. Porsche 997 GT3-RSR
3. Aston Martin Vantage GTE
4. Chevrolet Corvette C6.R
5. Dodge SRT Viper GTS-R

Now, what about homologating these particular road models to GTE standards?

1. Lamborghini Gallardo LP 570-4
2. McLaren MP4-12C
3. Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG
4. Audi R8 GT
5. BMW Z4

We could have a much larger field.

BTW just noticed we both have MythBusters siggys.

[The Badger]

I reckon Goossens will be busy with Bill Reily and his Viper . If they do it properly , he will be busy as a development driver .

I think its a must to have some American drivers in the Viper ..... Said is brilliant , but possibily a little over the hill now . There is enough young American blood out there to have a couple of quick drivers in that car .

Goossens is part of it because he has a good relationship with Bill Riley since the Mk.3 days and is a damn fine driver too .

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by JasonM3

Okay, maybe I am a bit "off my hinges"

Thats a prerequsite to be on this forum , so you fit right in !!!

[JasonM3]

Originally Posted by The Badger

I reckon Goossens will be busy with Bill Reily and his Viper . If they do it properly , he will be busy as a development driver .

I think its a must to have some American drivers in the Viper ..... Said is brilliant , but possibily a little over the hill now . There is enough young American blood out there to have a couple of quick drivers in that car .

Goossens is part of it because he has a good relationship with Bill Riley since the Mk.3 days and is a damn fine driver too .

Indeed, and he's also just really good at what he does: GT racing. Same thing with Said. He's my hometown hero as I only live a hop, skip, and a jump from his area. He may be getting a little "old", but my faith is with him to be part of the Viper squad. He and Anthony Lazzaro were racing Ford GT's in the USA quite successfully so I see them both in the Viper.