Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Baltic Touring Car Championship Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Saloon & Sportscar Racing > Touring Car Racing

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 13 Oct 2011, 22:05 (Ref:2970741)   #1926
crmalcolm
Subscriber
Veteran
 
crmalcolm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Nepal
Exactly where I need to be.
Posts: 12,292
crmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
Does T-O-C have a realistic chance of standing on the podium and taking away points from the regular championship contenders?

Airwaves are probably also looking at the independent title. Does Ollie Jackson stand a realistic chance of finishing ahead of Mat Jackson? Is it now going to be more difficult for Thompson to finish ahead of Nash?
crmalcolm is offline  
__________________
"When you’re just too socially awkward for real life, Ten-Tenths welcomes you with open arms. Everyone has me figured out, which makes it super easy for me."
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 06:23 (Ref:2970847)   #1927
Icebaby
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,087
Icebaby should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
There is nothing stopping Thompson running without the ballest in the races, he simply would be excluded for being underweight and as points are not important to him he could at least be right at the front to help Jackson. (not suggesting this is done of course)
Icebaby is offline  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 07:28 (Ref:2970874)   #1928
redshoes
Veteran
 
redshoes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 8,881
redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by crmalcolm View Post
Does T-O-C have a realistic chance of standing on the podium and taking away points from the regular championship contenders?
T-O-C carried late entry ballast for the first meeting when switched to the AON Focus.
redshoes is online now  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 07:30 (Ref:2970875)   #1929
redshoes
Veteran
 
redshoes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 8,881
redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icebaby View Post
There is nothing stopping Thompson running without the ballest in the races, he simply would be excluded for being underweight and as points are not important to him he could at least be right at the front to help Jackson. (not suggesting this is done of course)
Points are important. Thompson will help Jackson by finishing ahead of his rivals and taking points off them. Unless you are suggesting that Thompson is there to harpoon off Jackson's rivals?
redshoes is online now  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 09:44 (Ref:2970953)   #1930
davyboy
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 6,986
davyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
Quote:
Originally Posted by redshoes View Post
Points are important. Thompson will help Jackson by finishing ahead of his rivals and taking points off them. Unless you are suggesting that Thompson is there to harpoon off Jackson's rivals?
Exactly... Thompson needs to have a legitimate points finish in order for his presence in the team to be of any value at all. If he crosses the line in third place, ahead of the Hondas and Chevrolets, but is subsequently disqualified, the others will be promoted and his participation will have been futile [from Motorbase's perspective].
davyboy is offline  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 13:25 (Ref:2971098)   #1931
crmalcolm
Subscriber
Veteran
 
crmalcolm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Nepal
Exactly where I need to be.
Posts: 12,292
crmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
Quote:
Originally Posted by redshoes View Post
T-O-C carried late entry ballast for the first meeting when switched to the AON Focus.
So one team capable of regular podiums fields a 3rd car, and it has ballast for one meeting as per the sporting regs.
Another team capable of scoring highly in the independents substitutes their driver(s), and they don't have to carry ballast. As per the sporting regs.

Yet motorbase field a 3rd car, that is forced to carry ballast for more than one meeting because they substitute their driver.

I know people have said it's at Alan Gow's discretion, but it goes against the sporting regs and appears like favouritism. Why bother with the regs at all, if they are not going to be applied fairly across the board? At least the 'parity' measures have regulatory backing!
crmalcolm is offline  
__________________
"When you’re just too socially awkward for real life, Ten-Tenths welcomes you with open arms. Everyone has me figured out, which makes it super easy for me."
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 16:51 (Ref:2971217)   #1932
redshoes
Veteran
 
redshoes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 8,881
redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by crmalcolm View Post
I know people have said it's at Alan Gow's discretion, but it goes against the sporting regs and appears like favouritism. Why bother with the regs at all, if they are not going to be applied fairly across the board?
At this point let me refer you to Alan Gow's response to just such a point on his own forum

http://www.btcc.net/forum/showthread...-entry-ballast
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Gow
The amount of additional ballast is, quite correctly, applied according to the driver/circumstances.

It would appear you don't seem to appreciate that there is a huge difference between an inexperienced rookie getting in a car during the course of the season, compared to a driver of the very high calibre of James Thompson specifically being brought in by a team for the final round purely in order to help the team secure a championship win (e.g. Indepedents Team and Independents Driver Championships).

In those circumstances, we have always applied full ballast.
redshoes is online now  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 17:24 (Ref:2971230)   #1933
Icebaby
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,087
Icebaby should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I still don't see Alan Gows argument, how do you define an inexperienced rookie?,
Icebaby is offline  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 18:33 (Ref:2971259)   #1934
kezza7
Racer
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
England
Retford
Posts: 146
kezza7 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Team dynamics twitter:

"Wooah. Just arrived at the garage to find this. There will be some fireworks this weekend ... http://yfrog.com/j2k15iwj "

Hang on - what would a chevrolet WTCC driver be doing in a works Honda racing against his paymasters?

Last edited by kezza7; 14 Oct 2011 at 18:39.
kezza7 is offline  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 18:42 (Ref:2971266)   #1935
redshoes
Veteran
 
redshoes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 8,881
redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icebaby View Post
how do you define an inexperienced rookie?,
I would have thought that was pretty easy to define - a driver new to the series who doesn't have years of motorsports experience behind him. Pretty much a spot on description of Aron Smith and Ollie Jackson.

That said we don't NEED to define it, it means whatever Alan Gow says it means!

I don't understand why people are getting so worked up about this. The regulations allow for up to 45kg of late entry ballast at Gow's discretion, and that has been in effect for many years. They aren't doing anything here that isn't already in the regulations and they aren't doing anything that hasn't been done many times in previous seasons.
redshoes is online now  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 18:51 (Ref:2971270)   #1936
davyboy
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 6,986
davyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famedavyboy will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
Quote:
Originally Posted by kezza7 View Post
Team dynamics twitter:

"Wooah. Just arrived at the garage to find this. There will be some fireworks this weekend ... http://yfrog.com/j2k15iwj "

Hang on - what would a chevrolet WTCC driver be doing in a works Honda racing against his paymasters?
It's either a joke or it's another Muller... Jorg ?
davyboy is offline  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 18:56 (Ref:2971273)   #1937
crmalcolm
Subscriber
Veteran
 
crmalcolm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Nepal
Exactly where I need to be.
Posts: 12,292
crmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Famecrmalcolm will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
Quote:
Originally Posted by kezza7 View Post
Team dynamics twitter:

"Wooah. Just arrived at the garage to find this. There will be some fireworks this weekend ... http://yfrog.com/j2k15iwj "

Hang on - what would a chevrolet WTCC driver be doing in a works Honda racing against his paymasters?
Isn't Thompson doing pretty much the same?

I must admit, I don't know the full RML/silverline/chevy/BTCC/WTCC to know how obliged Muller would be to support the BTCC chevy team.

Awesome coup for Honda though, and could definitely produce big fireworks.

It does seem to be a regular theme now that plenty of drivers are willing to assist Plato's rvals? He doesn't seem to have drivers queuing up to help his cause though?
crmalcolm is offline  
__________________
"When you’re just too socially awkward for real life, Ten-Tenths welcomes you with open arms. Everyone has me figured out, which makes it super easy for me."
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 19:03 (Ref:2971278)   #1938
touring fan01
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,833
touring fan01 should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtouring fan01 should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtouring fan01 should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Wow its scary how gullible some people are.
touring fan01 is offline  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 19:03 (Ref:2971279)   #1939
Icebaby
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,087
Icebaby should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by redshoes View Post
I would have thought that was pretty easy to define - a driver new to the series who doesn't have years of motorsports experience behind him. Pretty much a spot on description of Aron Smith and Ollie Jackson.

That said we don't NEED to define it, it means whatever Alan Gow says it means!

I don't understand why people are getting so worked up about this. The regulations allow for up to 45kg of late entry ballast at Gow's discretion, and that has been in effect for many years. They aren't doing anything here that isn't already in the regulations and they aren't doing anything that hasn't been done many times in previous seasons.

If Herbert and Reid carried the 45kg ballest when they were brought in then fair enough but its still a stupid rule.
Icebaby is offline  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 19:07 (Ref:2971280)   #1940
Sodemo
Veteran
 
Sodemo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
United Kingdom
Solihull, West Mids, UK
Posts: 11,147
Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!
I imagine just a wind-up on Team Dynamics part. Quite funny though.
Sodemo is offline  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 19:36 (Ref:2971289)   #1941
Craner Curves
Veteran
 
Craner Curves's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
United Kingdom
Kelso
Posts: 4,383
Craner Curves should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridCraner Curves should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridCraner Curves should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridCraner Curves should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by touring fan01 View Post
Wow its scary how gullible some people are.
Exactly. It's fairly obvious that middle car is the 3-door Type R roadcar they've used for the past 5 seasons as a PR-mobile.

Nice joke though.
Craner Curves is offline  
__________________
Don't exacerbate things!
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 19:57 (Ref:2971297)   #1942
redshoes
Veteran
 
redshoes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 8,881
redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!redshoes is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icebaby View Post
If Herbert and Reid carried the 45kg ballest when they were brought in then fair enough but its still a stupid rule.
They did, as did Alain Menu and Tom Coronel in 2007. I seem to recall Thompson also had ballast when he was in the third SEAT in 2006.
redshoes is online now  
Quote
Old 14 Oct 2011, 23:52 (Ref:2971385)   #1943
medius
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
England
Media Office hiding from the rain
Posts: 1,808
medius should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridmedius should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Indeed, history has shown that 3rd cars brought in to bolster the squad for the final weekend haven't exactly fared well because of ballast/lack of practice/familiarity with the car.

http://www.touringcartimes.com/article.php?id=6866
medius is offline  
__________________
From redshoes: ''I have no idea who the second Team Hard driver is, and I suspect after the name is announced I'll be none the wiser.''
Quote
Old 15 Oct 2011, 10:16 (Ref:2971500)   #1944
KA
Veteran
 
KA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 5,402
KA has a real shot at the podium!KA has a real shot at the podium!KA has a real shot at the podium!KA has a real shot at the podium!KA has a real shot at the podium!
Yes, you do get the impression that TOCA try and discourage the practice by using 'late entry ballast' to make it more difficult for an extra car to have any meaningful effect on the outcome, without going as far as actually banning it....

Think one of the most extreme cases of it I can think of was back in the Supertouring days- IIRC it was the Italian series in the late 90's, when with the title battle coming down to Audi v BMW, both drafted in their German STW Cup teams to support the regular Italian entries at the last round- IIRC it ended up with each manufacturer fielding about half-a-dozen cars!
KA is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Oct 2011, 16:12 (Ref:2971583)   #1945
Tim Wilkinson
Veteran
 
Tim Wilkinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
England
Essex
Posts: 782
Tim Wilkinson should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
A solution would be to not allow an entry from any driver who hadn't raced at the penultimate round. That might solve a few problems..... (although unfortunate for the likes of Thorney, obviously).
Tim Wilkinson is offline  
__________________
If you want to get a hat, get a head.
Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
[BTCC] 2010 rumour mill Jamesy-18 Touring Car Racing 1437 2 Apr 2010 12:19
2009 Australian F3 - rumour mill/driver line up williamsf1 National & International Single Seaters 83 20 Mar 2009 10:46
Rumour mill reaches 20,000rpm! Logrence Formula One 19 2 Jun 2005 16:34
2004 Rumour Mill Latest: Montoya To Replace Schumacher At Ferrari!!!!!!!!! Knowlesy Formula One 11 4 Jun 2003 01:37
CART.com's Own Rumour Mill macdaddy ChampCar World Series 40 13 Jan 2003 01:33


All times are GMT. The time now is 16:20.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.