2021 Rallying

[hoffman66]

My theory is to get rid of the top class, have a sort of R5+ for the manufacturers, allow hybrid maybe to push power up.

But if you did this, capped the cost of an R5, you would be getting massive entries for WRC rounds, as it is the entry is extortionate, most drivers seem happy to do the odd round like Monte or Finland, without committing.

Lower classes are fine as they are, but top class needs to go, it is too pricey as WRC was and GpA was allowed to get. AS usual.

[S griffin]

The series has become more competitive in this post Loeb era. Although Ogier has won plenty, there are plenty of others winning

[NaBUru38]

Ford's last wins were in 2018. Citroën left at the end of 2019.


Toyota and Hyundai have won the last 18 races.

[S griffin]

We’ve had a smaller calendar this year and last, so you can’t really compare. The fact is we’ve had plenty of different winners the past ten years, in various different makes

[hoffman66]

There are others winning, but there are three manufacturers and only really two of those win, Ford win nothing unless then can afford a decent driver, which they only did coz VW paid for him when they pulled out!

The top class is too dear, it could be made a lot cheaper to encourage people like Skoda, or maybe Citroen or Peugeot back in.

[S griffin]

We could do with a couple more makes, so hopefully future rules will encourage them to enter. But for the moment the series is still competitive enough to survive

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by hoffman66

The top class is too dear, it could be made a lot cheaper to encourage people like Skoda, or maybe Citroen or Peugeot back in.

Originally Posted by S griffin

We could do with a couple more makes, so hopefully future rules will encourage them to enter. But for the moment the series is still competitive enough to survive

If they just ran the R5 cars as the top class the entries would immediately be bigger and more varied (all of the makes mentioned above have R5 cars). Would there be any loss of spectacle? Maybe, but I think the added depth and variety would more than make up for it.

[S griffin]

Rallying is usually spectacular enough anyway, so I don’t think it would make too much of a difference to the spectator

[Alex Langheck]

Originally Posted by S griffin

We could do with a couple more makes, so hopefully future rules will encourage them to enter. But for the moment the series is still competitive enough to survive

Competitive is being kind....

Next year sees new rules; no new manufacturers have signed up, and there are no strong rumours about any interested ones. Where are they all?

Answer - they're not interested....nobody wants to address this, especially the WRC media.

All the while the WEC is attracting manufacturers.....

[Anyopenroad]

Originally Posted by Alex Langheck

All the while the WEC is attracting manufacturers.....

True, but to a cost-limited, BOP’d class based on existing off-the-shelf chassis. There are no true big manufacturer-constructor prototypes anymore. Indeed, arguably F1 is the world’s only true constructor formula and even there the ruleset is restrictive enough to raise accusations of it becoming a spec series.

The future of motorsport is BOP and customer racing, with manufacturer-badged low-cost common platforms, or one-make/spec series. I see no reason Rallying would be any different.

[hoffman66]

the big issue here, as it is with any series, rights holders and manufacturers.

Rights holders want manufacturers, they spend big money, meaning rights can push selling into countries, and push countries into buying an "elite" event due to manufacturers.

Manufacturers want to win, and will outspend each other relentlessly to do so, hence the situation you have now, with silly top class cars, aero, huge budgets, multi car teams to try and make a dead series look competitive, it happened in DTM, BTCC, GT racing, just about any big series where manufacturers are involved becomes great for a short time, then dies and the rights holder will try and try as hard as possible to keep these teams involved.

It is obvious to anyone with a brain that R5 is the way to go with WRC, it has been for 5 years now, the cars are built to a budget, fairly cheap to run, strong, and can be easily improved within a decent budget. And in just about every country in the world there are a crap ton of them rallying at all levels. Just like a Mk2 Escort, Kadett, Mini, Ascona, Golf etc etc.

You have a good class structure with R2 as a base beginner class, then the novelty Alpines, Fiats, 911's etc, R5 and I would advocate an R5+ class for the big teams like Hyundai, Ford and Toyota, a bit like the old WRC class but far more cost restricted.

i think an R5 has to be bought for is it 120K, Why not make R5+ 170K Bit more power, bit of aero, cost cap means teams can't go crazy?

Let's be honest the stuff you see in WRC over the years never makes it anywhere near road cars, Citroen or VW did very little marketing to link their success to road cars unlike Ford, Renault. Could you buy a Xsara or C4 or even DS3 that was in any way linked to WRC dominance not really.

Even in the WRC era, teams like Hyundai only ever sold a 1.3 Accent in the UK, and wondered why their program failed, Peugeot spent a fortune with the 206, yet a hot version of that car was never really sold, only SEAT, Skoda, perhaps Ford and obviously Subaru and Mitsi really capitalised on their WRC running with a line-up of cars fans wanted that sold in numbers. the rest were just wanting to be associated.

Obvious really why they all quit!!

[NaBUru38]

The Seat León a plugin hybrid has a 150 hp gasoline engine, a 75 kW electric engine and a 13 kWh battery. It costs 32k euros in Spain.

If a hybrid rally car costs a million dollars or whatever, it's because the current manufacturers agree to spend that much.

[Anyopenroad]

It's hard to imagine a more beautiful or spectacular event in world motorsport than the 1000 Lakes rally.


(image courtesy of Goodwood)

[tbtstt]

Originally Posted by Anyopenroad

It's hard to imagine a more beautiful or spectacular event in world motorsport than the 1000 Lakes rally.

Finland looks incredible anyway, but some of the shots from this autumn running have been fantastic.

Brilliant drive (arguably a career best?) from Evans and a superb performance from Breen.

[S griffin]

The 1000 lakes has always been a great event and really suits being a summer/early Autumn event.

Evans did well in that one, he probably won’t get near a title again, but he certainly will always be a winner on his day. Breen looked good, he’s certainly always been very consistent

[SnoodyMcFlude]

Craig Breen is doing his career prospects no harm, last 3 rallies he's done have all been podiums and very solid. I really like Craig, not only his driving style but how grateful he is to be driving a WRC car and how much he openly enjoys it. Compared to some of the other drivers he's a real breath of fresh air.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by Anyopenroad

It's hard to imagine a more beautiful or spectacular event in world motorsport than the 1000 Lakes rally.


(image courtesy of Goodwood)

There have been some stunning images from the WRC this year - the Safari and Finland are two highlights. The autumn colours made Finland even more spectacular this year and running through the forests in darkness was a nice addition too.

Originally Posted by SnoodyMcFlude

Craig Breen is doing his career prospects no harm, last 3 rallies he's done have all been podiums and very solid. I really like Craig, not only his driving style but how grateful he is to be driving a WRC car and how much he openly enjoys it. Compared to some of the other drivers he's a real breath of fresh air.

There was a rumour floating around that Breen will have a full time drive for M-Sport next season (and the following year) as part of a 3 car lineup. I've not seen anything confirmed but you'd have to think Breen has done enough for a drive somewhere.

[Anyopenroad]

Breen’s post-stage interviews in Finland were wonderful. He was just having the best time ever and didn’t care who knew it! Brought a smile to my face every time

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by Anyopenroad

Breen’s post-stage interviews in Finland were wonderful. He was just having the best time ever and didn’t care who knew it! Brought a smile to my face every time

Agreed - he always gives the impression that he's having fun out there. Some of the others are very downbeat in comparison, it's hard not to like Breen just based on the joy he clearly takes from competing.

[Anyopenroad]

Craig Breen has indeed secured a full-time WRC drive:

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/b...-ford/6681656/

[SnoodyMcFlude]

And Oliver Solberg picks up the shared seat at Hyundai which Craig has vacated.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by Anyopenroad

Craig Breen has indeed secured a full-time WRC drive:

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/b...-ford/6681656/

Great news - that article also seems to confirm the 3 car lineup (Formaux likely in the 2nd car, Greensmith the 3rd). Does this mean M-Sport have got some money from Ford? They've been close to pulling out recently due to financial pressures so to confirm Breen for 2 years and expand to a 3 car lineup suggests more money coming in from somewhere.

[SnoodyMcFlude]

I think the hybrid thing has brought a bit more investment from Ford, they were talking about it at the FoS about the advantages of Ford supporting them. Hopefully will mean that the car will actually be competitive again.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by SnoodyMcFlude

I think the hybrid thing has brought a bit more investment from Ford, they were talking about it at the FoS about the advantages of Ford supporting them. Hopefully will mean that the car will actually be competitive again.

Ah - I guess that would make sense. I wonder if it was Ford's choice to go with the Puma instead of the Fiesta?

[S griffin]

I can't wait to see the Puma out. Definitely seems to have the potential