Grp C/Grp A – "Tricks of the Trade" (Merged)

[stigette]

How about the Sierra that upon post race inspection was found to have an empty BCF extinguisher in the passenger footwell with a copper pipe running from it into the engine bay......I hear BCF is good for cooling intercoolers......

[Senna05]

Just another of the Turbo/Wastegate mysteries for us to share:

My dad used to work for Repco Machine Shops and did a little work with some the mitsubishi Starion guys.

The Starion has a button and a remote control for the rear demister. The driver could use the remote instead of the button on the dash, to operate the demister.

Apparently quite often the Mitsubishi guys would stand in the pits and use the remote when the car was going past to operate the "demister", that was actually also wired to a wastegate dump. This apparently got around the rule of "operating a wastegate dump from inside the cockpit".

Sneaky indeed!

[Axeman444]

Not sure if this has been done before, or if this thread will have any legs, but would people give quick rundowns on what was "allegedly" done by competitors in the Group C and A days to get an advantage and other such rumours, for the benefit of the youngsters who have never heard of it, and the oldies for a bit of reminiscing? Maybe even throw in a few modern-ish versions.

Eg Acid dipped parts, fuel in the roll cage tubing, Larry having a perve at Lowndes' undercarriage after the Calder rollover etc...

[Umai Naa]

There are a few well-documented rule interpretations that generated from the Gibson Motorsport facilities.

Things like switched with obvious markings, that did not-so-obvious things, cars they should or should have been in posession of in the first place, and whether the overseas model did in fact have a multi-link IRS setup...

[Scrut]

6 speed gearbox and 2" wider flares on Moff's RX7.

Ford Sierra team with a fire extingusher mounted in from of the intercooler with switch in the cockpit. We usefull for a few extra
horsepower down conrod straight.

[Mixer]

I think the fuel in the roll cage is a Nascar trick - Google Smokey Yunick if you want to read some CRACKING stories about creative rule interpretation in motorsport. From building a 3/4 scale car, to driving a car away from scrutineering that had no fuel tank in it, that guy was an evil genius.

Schnitzer, Eggenberger and Walkinshaw all got pulled up for "grey areas" which given the state of scrutineering in Europe were pretty wide.

Panels acid dipped to within an inch of its life, wheels significantly larger than allowed & bodywork to match, hot fuels. Not to mention manufacturers who flat out never made enough Evolution cars, but threatened to take their bat and ball and go home...

Of course when you get to a car as complicated as the GTR, how do you effectively scrutineer it?

[Umai Naa]

If my memory serves me correct, there was a Bluebird that may have used a fire extinguisher on the intercooler to score a pole position.

[db120176]

I remember the boot panels on the EB and EL Falcons being light

[Mixer]

Also with the GrpC days I don't think there was so much of an issue with people doing things they were not allowed to do, as being allowed to homologate stuff they probably shouldn't have, and perpetuating the imbalances.

I'm a bit too young to have "been there" but I've done a lot of reading and this is the impression I get.

[alfacors]

BMW M3s that placed 1st through 6th in the 1987 WTCC got disqualified for illegal panels (roof and bootlids I think?) handing victory to Moffatt and Harvey in the first of the Brock-built VL Group A Commodores.

[Scrut]

Originally Posted by db120176

I remember the boot panels on the EB and EL Falcons being light

Every panel was pressed using a lighter gauge steel.
I beleive the window glass was even thiner than standard.

[ford71]

Was it Larry that had a delay in the brakelight wiring?

[Razor]

Wasn't there a thread floating around in the recent past about this kind of stuff?

[coln72]

Apparently a proddy racer could adjust the rev limit via the radio tuner

[Rob Bailey]

TWR XJS door panels.
the odd alloy block was used in Clevlands .

[smokin'joe]

Originally Posted by alfacors

BMW M3s that placed 1st through 6th in the 1987 WTCC got disqualified for illegal panels (roof and bootlids I think?) handing victory to Moffatt and Harvey in the first of the Brock-built VL Group A Commodores.

i was told some of the BMWs that made it over here, were adjustable by radio/remote control making a mockery of the " no cockpit adjustmants to be made" rule

[Trevor]

Moffat droping the upper control arms 1 inch to fool scrutineers, but gave the car a great advantage on the track

One of Brocks car 'allegedly' had something in a roll cage, I also heard Moffat did as well.

Oh and Peter Brock ran a Polariser -

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by Big_Trev

Oh and Peter Brock ran a Polariser -

In the "Rise and Fall of Peter Brock" book, Mr Harvey recalls having a Polariser in his car too, til one day it loosened from its mounting bracket, and ended up under his feet. Duly flung out the window, the car's times got worse as a result

[Driver TBA]

Originally Posted by ford71

Was it Larry that had a delay in the brakelight wiring?

This.

From memory the Perkins cars were caught with this at the Albert Park GP in the late 90's. A resistor in the wiring that delayed the brakelights by a few tenths.

Absolutely ingenious idea!

[Woolley]

There were stories of an ETCC entrant who spent several days testing modifications to the rear wing in order to produce something that was undetectable by the scrutineers unless they went looking for it. After a tip off, one of the other manufacturers protested it after first qualifying. The team were forced to replace the dodgy wing with one taken from the road cars in the paddock, wherupon the cars went over ½ second quicker...

[one five five]

Weren't TWR notorious for homologating the Rovers & Jaguars with bits supposedly fitted to cars sold in Africa (wider wheel arches etc...), it led to them being referred to as "Third World Racing"

Wasn't there also a rumour that Gibson Motorsport had played with the fuel tank at Bathurst in 1995?

Originally Posted by Mixer

I think the fuel in the roll cage is a Nascar trick - Google Smokey Yunick if you want to read some CRACKING stories about creative rule interpretation in motorsport. From building a 3/4 scale car, to driving a car away from scrutineering that had no fuel tank in it, that guy was an evil genius.

In his book, Smokey refutes both these stories

[Umai Naa]

Fred Gibson apprently cleared up the whole fuel tank thing by saying that they had altered the mixtures off-throttle, and programmed in a rev limiter they could utilize under safety cars, etc.

The rev limiter was subsequently banned.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by Driver TBA

This.

From memory the Perkins cars were caught with this at the Albert Park GP in the late 90's. A resistor in the wiring that delayed the brakelights by a few tenths.

Absolutely ingenious idea!

Early noughties was when this happened. They were caught totally red handed by the onboard data monitor. At the time, Larry denied personal knowledge but accepted that the team had done it and copped the penalty.

Team member who did it later worked for Team Dynamik and ran a certain well-known test at Woomera.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by one five five

In his book, Smokey refutes both these stories

I take it that you mean the 'fuel in cage' and 'scale car' stories? He is widely quoted including on video on the story of driving the car away from technical inspection with no fuel tank in it. A l-o-n-g fuel line that could hold a gallon or so of fuel was how that worked.

[lshnz]

Some Sierras had a tyre valve fitted to inflate a bladder inside fuel tank to restrict capacity to 120 litres when scrutineered,rumor of one of Brock's Commodres with bigger motor init(1987 Bathurst)and broke a timing chain at the top of the mountain and still made it back to the pits hence did not finish-did not get check,,rumor back in Phase 3 days in qualifing would have a water tank on board to keep up to weight limit and would dump water on the way up the mountain once on the track????These last 2 are rumors I have heard from more than one source.