FIA Homologation Papers & HTPs

[FISCracer]

Originally Posted by Duddha

As I say, some do cheat! But for papers, you need to use a period casting number or provide evidence that the engine block dimentionally and structurally complies with period. For GM/Corvette engines, it's known that some period blocks are no longer available but equivalent can be find through GM even though it is now sold for different application and with different casting numbers.

So Louis is a later 18V block acceptable in an MGB , TVR, Elva or only the earlier 18GA, GB, GG etc?

Thanks

[Duddha]

Originally Posted by FISCracer

So Louis is a later 18V block acceptable in an MGB , TVR, Elva or only the earlier 18GA, GB, GG etc?

Thanks

Nope, the engine block has to be period unless you prove that as an alternative it's in accordance with 3.6.7.1 which means dimensionally and structurally equal to the period one.

[Duddha]

Originally Posted by Oneball

Thanks, there was only one casting number used for the 69 to 70 iron block 427cu and 454cu Corvette and that was 3963512, these are difficult to get hold of especially this side of the Atlantic.

The tall deck blocks are only for trucks as they have a lower compression ratio.

So I could use a later block with a different casting number but I don't know of anyway to prove that these are exactly the same. If the FIA doesn't have a list I can't find a way to do this without building a car and applying for an HTP which could be pointless.

I've had my current historic race car for 25 years and it's becoming less and less fun, it just seems that nowadays there is a requirement to be stupidly rich so you can pay your specialist who knows someone and then you're able to run your McLaren with a modern Dart block or your Mini with a dog box.

Sorry for the rant but I've spent months chasing engine builders, not for advice, but to build me an engine but no one ever gets back to me, even after going to see them and I've just about given up on the idea. Same with other bits of Corvette. I've never come across a marque of car where the specialist are almost to a man completely unhelpful. I just don't get how people can turn down 10, 15 or 20 grands worth of work. Guess I should have got a Ford.

I would just say that relying on third parties to give an answer is not a way forward. If you buy the books and records of the GM castings, you will find your answer and possibly your needs.

The fact that an engine block is hard to find has never given a way around, which is different to total and proven non-availability.

[Oneball]

Originally Posted by Duddha

I would just say that relying on third parties to give an answer is not a way forward. If you buy the books and records of the GM castings, you will find your answer and possibly your needs.

The fact that an engine block is hard to find has never given a way around, which is different to total and proven non-availability.

I have the books and the casting numbers, I'm not relying on third parties, I've been researching this for months and have got nowhere close to a definitive answer. I hoped that maybe the FIA had a list of acceptable parts in the same as does for Lotus Elans for example.

I only signed up here as a last resort and was not just looking for an easy way out.

Thanks for your replies.

I will endeavour to source a period block, which I've also been trying to do all this time.

[zefarelly]

lotus elans are easy. . . . everythings available new . . . looks like original but just a bit better on the inside.

[PeterMorley]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

lotus elans are easy. . . . everythings available new . . . looks like original but just a bit better on the inside.

Presumably these parts have been identified by the FIA as being suitable, so there is a list of them?

In which case would it not be possible for the FIA to compile a list of original parts that are considered to be suitable - e.g. when an alternative casting number block is accepted for one car then it is added to the list?

I'm intrigued by how the process works/what research the FIA do, having been asked to prove the period use of rose joints on a car when there are other examples that already had FIA papers.

[Duddha]

Originally Posted by FISCracer

So Louis is a later 18V block acceptable in an MGB , TVR, Elva or only the earlier 18GA, GB, GG etc?

Thanks

You have to demonstrate non-availability.

For GM castings, you have to understand they are the same but other applications and from same period. Basically another plant, marine, etc.

People have tried for Alfa and other cars but couldn't demonstrate unavailability.

[Duddha]

A big update on HTP and for everybody to be aware.

A new template was released last week to all national clubs and followed by an FIA Seminar held in Paris on the Friday of Retromobile for ASN staff but also registrars and so on. In total, we had over 70 people attending and 23 different nationalities which was a very good point.

All in all, the document will be implemented in the first half of 2020 and be mandatory to use from July onwards. Also developped aside are the new HTP Guidelines which we invite anyone interested to complete an Application or to understand the template to go through.

Here is the link

Any question, please let me know. Nothing really changes, just a more user friendly document, new picture format and specific requirements aimed at saving time in the application procedure.

[S griffin]

Ok thanks for this. Got to keep regulations up to date. Looks like it’s been a very productive meeting and it’s right to give time so everyone can get ready when they can.

So which type of historics will be most affected by this? Hope you guys keep up the good work

[one-two]

Well done Louis - greatly appreciate the increased communication and openness. Robert Barrie

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Ok thanks for this. Got to keep regulations up to date. Looks like it’s been a very productive meeting and it’s right to give time so everyone can get ready when they can.

So which type of historics will be most affected by this? Hope you guys keep up the good work

Obviously will affect those cars needing a new HTP or renewal.....

Glad the new Historic Technical Passport application form meets with your approval. I have no doubt the FIA will be equally impressed......