F1 tv viewing set to plummet further

[bella]

but in indy it's (give or take minor details) a spec car... you can't compare that and f1 cars, where every team makes a different demand on the tyres...

[S griffin]

I’ve always found something that’s supposed to be ‘the pinnacle of technology’, producing sub standard tyres for the sake of racing

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by bella

but in indy it's (give or take minor details) a spec car... you can't compare that and f1 cars, where every team makes a different demand on the tyres...

It is spec but for the last three years, IndyCar was running bespoke aero-kits for Chevy and Honda, each with their own peculiarities. The cars still have to be set up, with each team making different demands on tyres, according to the driver and aero-kit/engine combinations.

This year will be different, as they are using a universal kit but from reading the reports from Phoenix, the car's characteristics are completely different from last year and that will be a major factor regarding tyres.

[bella]

yup. meanwhile, pirelli have already covered any variations in tyre demands that the new cars produce by having multiple compounds. they can't really change it for australia and maybe the next race without huge cost (ie flying stock out to replace the containers already en route) but they will have made conservative allowances anyway.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by bella

yup. meanwhile, pirelli have already covered any variations in tyre demands that the new cars produce by having multiple compounds. they can't really change it for australia and maybe the next race without huge cost (ie flying stock out to replace the containers already en route) but they will have made conservative allowances anyway.

But will the racing be any better? Wouldn't it be so much simpler and less costly, with just one prime and one option tyre? If they can find a way to complicate things, F1 will. Anyway, Let's see what happens in Melbourne, we might be in for a televisual feast of racing. Not too long to go.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

But will the racing be any better? Wouldn't it be so much simpler and less costly, with just one prime and one option tyre? If they can find a way to complicate things, F1 will. Anyway, Let's see what happens in Melbourne, we might be in for a televisual feast of racing. Not too long to go.

The tyre solution would be excellent, too hard and too soft plus wets.

They can cut their own inters on the day at the track.


If good racing breaks out in Australia this year we will see a porcine squadron flying across the setting sun in formation.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by wnut

The tyre solution would be excellent, too hard and too soft plus wets.

They can cut their own inters on the day at the track.


If good racing breaks out in Australia this year we will see a porcine squadron flying across the setting sun in formation.

I look forward to seeing that but such a spectacle might cast a very long shadow over Melbourne, especially as the sun is setting.

[E.B]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

I look forward to seeing that but such a spectacle might cast a very long shadow over Melbourne, especially as the sun is setting.

I dont see me eating Pig Wings at my GP Barbecue....

[pole2pole]

Can we not have skinny tyres and whip off some downforce and give us our bloody racing back!!!! Who knows maybe more racing fans will tune in.

[S griffin]

No we need big tyres and less aero, that's what will make the racing better, but the powers that be seem to know something no one else does

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by pole2pole

Can we not have skinny tyres and whip off some downforce and give us our bloody racing back!!!! Who knows maybe more racing fans will tune in.

But then the faster every year fans take over. You can't have less grip, more sliding and closer racing combined with faster and faster every year. We have passed that point decades ago, the improvements now are in the microscopic improvement in aero which often means qualifying or clean-air laps are the only ways to get faster every season.

[djinvicta]

Yes, and look where that has got us? Boring races or "processions".

[broadrun96]

I'll be the last to argue we must be faster every year, I personally like the direction Indy is going with MUCH less wing and grip on ovals, it will test the driver but I've always viewed Indy and even Champcar with less team and tech and more driver. F1 to me has always been that technical achievement series, often with the designers and engineers as well known as the drivers. But I fear that time has come and gone, and F1 must adapt. Or start over with a clean sheet and reset everything by stripping bits off the car sacrificing lap time for an exercise in redesigning a faster mousetrap within heavy restricted rules. The areas and allowances not the specs, ie no wings, flaps, etc outside of X by Y, Z distance from the centerline. I'll bow out beyond that for technical definitions of where bits should be allowed.

[Richard C]

Can we rename this thread... "An unabridged list of what is wrong with F1"



Richard

[S griffin]

Yes I like the sound of that

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by bella

you realise they can discuss and develop more than one plan at once, right?

Fixing the off-track show is very easy. Bernie didn't bother to move a finger about it. Liberty is pushing hard to fix it, and will be succesful.

Of course that the on-track show is terrible, but it's much more difficult to fix, as the top teams don't want to lose their status.

[pole2pole]

Originally Posted by broadrun96

I'll be the last to argue we must be faster every year, I personally like the direction Indy is going with MUCH less wing and grip on ovals, it will test the driver but I've always viewed Indy and even Champcar with less team and tech and more driver. F1 to me has always been that technical achievement series, often with the designers and engineers as well known as the drivers. But I fear that time has come and gone, and F1 must adapt. Or start over with a clean sheet and reset everything by stripping bits off the car sacrificing lap time for an exercise in redesigning a faster mousetrap within heavy restricted rules. The areas and allowances not the specs, ie no wings, flaps, etc outside of X by Y, Z distance from the centerline. I'll bow out beyond that for technical definitions of where bits should be allowed.

I agree with you 100% about the direction Indy Car is heading. I read an interview with JP Montoya who was one of the drivers who helped develop the 2018 IndyCar and he said it is a pure drivers car that promotes passing. IndyCar is all about racing and putting a show on for the fans. F1 is more to do with engineering. I watched the Nascar clash race from Daytona on Sunday evening and once again it's looks like the new 2018 Nascar is all about super close racing. It's race series like this prove how non exciting the the race side of F1 actually is.

[Sodemo]

Originally Posted by pole2pole

I agree with you 100% about the direction Indy Car is heading. I read an interview with JP Montoya who was one of the drivers who helped develop the 2018 IndyCar and he said it is a pure drivers car that promotes passing. IndyCar is all about racing and putting a show on for the fans. F1 is more to do with engineering. I watched the Nascar clash race from Daytona on Sunday evening and once again it's looks like the new 2018 Nascar is all about super close racing. It's race series like this prove how non exciting the the race side of F1 actually is.

You could have both, an engineering challenge and also an exciting race series. F1 just has to lose its total reliance on aero, or rather the current way it uses aero.

[S griffin]

Hopefully by 2020 Liberty will have done something to make it more exciting, just a shame we have to wait a while

[wnut]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

You could have both, an engineering challenge and also an exciting race series. F1 just has to lose its total reliance on aero, or rather the current way it uses aero.

In order to get racing you would also have to dump the over complicated and restrictive engine regulations that Mercedes and their stooges wrote.

There is only one PU in F1 currently and it is in the back of the works Mercedes.

Have the FIA implemented the one engine spec with one type of software mapping regulation yet, or was changing this back to the originally drafted regulations deemed too hard?

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Hopefully by 2020 Liberty will have done something to make it more exciting, just a shame we have to wait a while

By which time it'll be behind a paywall here in the UK and so, no longer of interest to me.

[mikestow]

No one seems to remember or even realise that Ferrari ,during the Schumacher ascendance ran most ,if not all the Bridgestone Tyre Testing,often on its own Track.Result hardly surprising that the Ferrari was better set up on the current Bridgestones than any other Team.The rest of the Grid had to cope with what Bridgestone gave them,with their own setting up after the fact that Ferrari was already ahead of the game!?

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by mikestow

No one seems to remember or even realise that Ferrari ,during the Schumacher ascendance ran most ,if not all the Bridgestone Tyre Testing,often on its own Track.Result hardly surprising that the Ferrari was better set up on the current Bridgestones than any other Team.The rest of the Grid had to cope with what Bridgestone gave them,with their own setting up after the fact that Ferrari was already ahead of the game!?

But that has occurred in other racing series as well. Michelin has had teams complain the GT tires were developed for X car, as they were testing with that chassis. A few years ago Porsche has by far the best success with the rain tires over everyone else in the GT field, course the rear engine helps in the rain too. Last season Conti used WTR to test the DPi tires and they were head and shoulders above everyone else for half the season. It's tough to make a tire across chassis that work in slightly differing ways when testing with 1 or 2 cars.


As much as I will be called a terrible human for this opinion, I think some of what keeps me watching Indy on road/street courses is the required mechanical grip levels. So many of the hard or square corners requiring hard long braking and gives drivers those chances to attack and be brave. And yes, the time-limited push-2-pass with the ability to use in defense and offense helps as well. Not a fan of the DRS style, without the ability of the leading car to do the same in response, but a X timed over-boost allows drivers to use it at their discretion and if they run out being aggressive early, well he who saves gets the last laugh.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by VIVA GT

By which time it'll be behind a paywall here in the UK and so, no longer of interest to me.

If it will no longer be of interest to you, what about the casual UK fan, who might just like to see Lulu win the British GP, again? They need to rethink the paywall.

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

If it will no longer be of interest to you, what about the casual UK fan, who might just like to see Lulu win the British GP, again? They need to rethink the paywall.

Exactly bjs, something needs to be done...