Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Racing Talk > Racing Technology

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12 Apr 2012, 13:02 (Ref:3057811)   #1
Fisher
Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 7
Fisher should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Fabricating ARB

I have done some maths and I now need to find a way of forming 28mm EN24.

What kind of machine/process is best?
Fisher is offline  
Quote
Old 12 Apr 2012, 19:13 (Ref:3057977)   #2
Icarus_nz
Racer
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
New Zealand
Paradise
Posts: 498
Icarus_nz should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridIcarus_nz should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
How about you put up a picture of drawing of what you're trying to do?
Icarus_nz is offline  
Quote
Old 16 Apr 2012, 17:29 (Ref:3060383)   #3
Casper
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 3,211
Casper should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridCasper should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Before you go to all the trouble of using an alloy steel make it out of mild steel and see what happens. It won't have a long life but it will be cheaper than bending up some expensive material and finding you are a bit off with the calcs.
Casper is offline  
Quote
Old 16 Apr 2012, 21:39 (Ref:3060513)   #4
phoenix
Veteran
 
phoenix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
European Union
Posts: 1,981
phoenix should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridphoenix should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Forming, by which I assume you mean bending to shape, any alloy of steel 28mm diameter is going to need a great deal of force and be very, very difficult to achieve with any great accuracy.

I would suggest (from experience) that you design the bar and it's location, if at all possible, such that a straight section of 28mm can be accommodated, with arms/levers fitted by means of a square section machined on the ends of the 'cross bar' section (which is what Porsche used on the 911 etc) or if you wish to be more elaborate/sophisticated - splines. The ultimate simple solution is to fit the arms/levers to the 'cross bar' by welding each arm to a tubular section with an ID of 28mm and then cross-drilling and pinning - or running a high tensile bolts through with a nut on the end of each.


Note: depending on the stress the bar will see in action, it may or may not be necessary to have the bar heat treated to ensure that it has sufficient tensile strength to return to it's original shape after bending. If it requires heat treatment, then low carbon steel will not be any good, whatever the diameter. The material you choose for a consistent and reliable 'rate' will depend entirely on whether the bar can peform it's duty without becoming over-stressed which would lead to permanent deformation. Imagine you anti-roll bar as a straightened-out coil spring - because that is what it is: Can you imagine what would happen to a mild-steel coil spring in use? It would simply crush over time. Coil springs - and anti-roll bars in MOST applications - need to be made from steel with enough carbon content such that they can be heat treated to perform like a spring.

Just to note, EN8 (C=0.4%) E19 (C=0.4%) and EN9 (C=0.5%) all have sufficient carbon to be heat treated and are probably cheaper to buy than EN24 (C=0.4%)

Last edited by phoenix; 16 Apr 2012 at 21:55.
phoenix is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Apr 2012, 00:21 (Ref:3060599)   #5
Notso Swift
Veteran
 
Notso Swift's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
United Nations
37deg 46'52.36" S 144deg 59' 01.83"E
Posts: 1,908
Notso Swift should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
As Phoenix says, if you are doing your own use a blade type

Cold forming spring steel isn't easy or, just as important, easily repeatable
Notso Swift is offline  
__________________
Contrary to popular opinion, I do have mechanical sympathy, I always feel sorry for the cars I drive.
Quote
Old 17 Apr 2012, 02:46 (Ref:3060657)   #6
Casper
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 3,211
Casper should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridCasper should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenix View Post
Imagine you anti-roll bar as a straightened-out coil spring - because that is what it is: Can you imagine what would happen to a mild-steel coil spring in use? It would simply crush over time. Coil springs - and anti-roll bars in MOST applications - need to be made from steel with enough carbon content such that they can be heat treated to perform like a spring.
Mild steel for limited testing purposes will work and for someone with limited resources is a good way to assess whether the car will react well to the bar or not and also to figure out how to make it fit. What can be an advantage is make it in MS and if the result is good hand it to a fabricator and get them to copy it for a guaranteed fit. 28mm is a big ARB, what is it going on?
Casper is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Apr 2012, 08:02 (Ref:3060730)   #7
cheapracer
Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
China
Posts: 19
cheapracer should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
A little more info on the type of application, use and general design may be of assistance to people to assist you.
cheapracer is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Apr 2012, 16:47 (Ref:3061035)   #8
phoenix
Veteran
 
phoenix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
European Union
Posts: 1,981
phoenix should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridphoenix should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Casper View Post
Mild steel for limited testing purposes will work and for someone with limited resources is a good way to assess whether the car will react well to the bar or not and also to figure out how to make it fit. What can be an advantage is make it in MS and if the result is good hand it to a fabricator and get them to copy it for a guaranteed fit. 28mm is a big ARB, what is it going on?
MS will only work if you can be certain it won't be loaded in use beyond it's yield point. This can be calculated of course and a suitable material selected based on the results of the calculations.
phoenix is offline  
Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Saddles for double ARB mounting SAMD Historic Racing Today 15 7 Dec 2011 18:06
ARB Blade's johnny99 Racing Technology 2 28 May 2010 10:06
Rear ARB and springs FlyInMySoup Racing Technology 4 20 Nov 2009 10:31
Front Spring rate /ARB ratios zefarelly Racing Technology 13 26 Jul 2006 12:10


All times are GMT. The time now is 20:56.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.