CPR Control Arm Irregularity

[deeks6]

Well, it seem Mr Perkins has been called to explain an irregularity with control arms on none other than Steven Richards car at Winton...something like 20mm.

Gee, I havent heard Larry (or BPB) calling for Richards points to be docked yet - we'll have to wait and see, I guess.

And I'll bet you a lifetime supply of beer that the Stone Brothers don't either ... it's called class.

And let's have a comment from all the Holden fans who reckon Ambrose would be an "unworthy" winner.

[Wrighty05]

Well, it's hard to comment when so little is known... But, if found guilty, they should cop a pretty severe penalty (points and fine).

I dare say this could be performance enhancing. (There are people out there who would know far more about that than me).

Does not escape the fact that the same thing should've happened to Ambrose.

And if Larry is found not guilty, well he can still stand by his comments of a copuple of weeks ago.

[retro]

I have this in the Larry thread as well - it's to do with the clearance in the top and bottom control arms - click here

[Techo]

Dunno about clearance.
But the pick up points for the Upper & Lower control arms are to be within 20mm of the TEGA blue print points.
So my bet is it could be here that lies the problem..by 1mm ?

Maybe someone could right a letter saying larry's an expert in this field and that if anyone had the Knowledge to tapper with such things it would be LP.
Everyone runs the Larry bar across the front window once LP got away with it !!

[retro]

Originally posted by Techo
Dunno about clearance.
But the pick up points for the Upper & Lower control arms are to be within 20mm of the TEGA blue print points.
So my bet is it could be here that lies the problem..by 1mm ?

Maybe someone could right a letter saying larry's an expert in this field and that if anyone had the Knowledge to tapper with such things it would be LP.
Everyone runs the Larry bar across the front window once LP got away with it !!

Tech - thats correct - they are 1mm out.

[Techo]

OK, that sounds about right.
There is a TEGA jig that when the arms are removed it is surposed to fit in the pick up points in the body(top) and x-member(bottom)...
So it's 5% out of the 20mm range !!

[retro]

Originally posted by Techo
OK, that sounds about right.
There is a TEGA jig that when the arms are removed it is surposed to fit in the pick up points in the body(top) and x-member(bottom)...
So it's 5% out of the 20mm range !!

Well the noise is that you can be out as long as you are with-in the 20mm - Richo's car is 1 OR 2mm outside the 20mm.

[Onlooker]

Well I am sure that Larry will be dissapointed if the Stewards are lax and don't deal with this in an approriate manner and send a message to others that this sort of thing is not on

[deeks6]

I believe the allowable tolerance is 1mm and their's is OUT by 20mm...

Not really close if thats the case.

Reminds me of NASCAR interview with pit crew - "Its our job to cheat, it's their job to catch us."

[Onlooker]

From what they said on the panelbeaters I think you are right there deeks6. It used to be 20mm now it is 1mm.
if this is correct it is a huge amount to be out by and these sorts of things detirmine anti-squat etc in the rear end and can not be a non performance item.It would effect the ability of the car to hook up out of the corner thus add to lap times

[Sandgroper]

I guess its lucky Richo didnt actually win the race. If so you could hear the out-cries now.

[Onlooker]

Control arm position is one of the things that has a huge effect on the performance of the car,it is also something that is recorded on most setup sheets,you don't just put them in the wrong hole,correct me if I am wrong(I have complete faith someone will if I am )but Richo was in more strife than a Werribee duck in practice etc at winton and well off the pace,were these changes made to get a short term gain and try to bump him up the grid?If so then the choice was made by his engineers to go beyond the rule book to fine some drive.Larry may well have been completely unaware that the car was illegal.
Look for the blame to fall on a mechanic who is "no longer with us"

[stmorri]

Originally posted by Onlooker
Control arm position is one of the things that has a huge effect on the performance of the car,it is also something that is recorded on most setup sheets,you don't just put them in the wrong hole,correct me if I am wrong(I have complete faith someone will if I am )but Richo was in more strife than a Werribee duck in practice etc at winton and well off the pace,were these changes made to get a short term gain and try to bump him up the grid?If so then the choice was made by his engineers to go beyond the rule book to fine some drive.Larry may well have been completely unaware that the car was illegal.
Look for the blame to fall on a mechanic who is "no longer with us"

Has Larry killed him already?!!!

[Onlooker]

Who knows but that is what usually is said,be it F1,CART,NASCAR etc.
Remeber the dougnuts in the EC carpark,that was some junior member of the team who has since left.

[Bigguy]

Maybe someone in the team took the race car for a flog up the highway?

[johnh875]

I heard the same on Panelbeaters Onlooker. It's a bit disappointing that the CPR website has no mention of the issue, I suppose it hasn't got very far yet but they seem to be very quiet.

Given that the control arm pickup would be set when the car was constructed, does that mean Steven Richards has been running an illegal car all year? Or am I reading too much into it? (PS, a genuine question, not trying to stir trouble for what it's worth)

[Onlooker]

Originally posted by johnh875

Given that the control arm pickup would be set when the car was constructed, does that mean Steven Richards has been running an illegal car all year? Or am I reading too much into it? (PS, a genuine question, not trying to stir trouble for what it's worth)

Not at all, if the cars were allowed the 20mm last year then all the holes would be there and it is simply a matter of moving the arms up or down to the desired hole.It could even be on the diff housing itself, i don't know enough about the construction of the cars to say one way or another but it is quite possible the holes are from last year and by some means the arms have been put in the illegal holes,it may have been a mistake but it is highly unlikely given the effect that this has on the cars rear grip level.
That said it may well have run for a few rounds undetected and his results may be better than they should be,I wonder if CAMS are smart enough to have seized all set up sheets from the team to establish when it was moved,yeah right

[johnh875]

That's fair enough, I was thinking of a car constructed to the new regs. I assume that SR has not had a new car built since the rule was changed?

[Grimace]

Originally posted by Onlooker
Well I am sure that Larry will be dissapointed if the Stewards are lax and don't deal with this in an approriate manner and send a message to others that this sort of thing is not on

"OL Bathurst Crashem LP" might get his now-

Ill bet Jimmy and Ross are bent over double with laughter!

[stmorri]

All the Holden supporters will be furious (after the SBR/Ambrose result) but I have been told that Richo is being disqualified and that any appeal is likely to fail......don't shoot me, I'm only the messenger!

[kerrystevens]

Originally posted by stmorri
All the Holden supporters will be furious (after the SBR/Ambrose result) but I have been told that Richo is being disqualified and that any appeal is likely to fail......don't shoot me, I'm only the messenger!

Not really, big difference. SBR's little indescretion was not performance enhancing, as has been stated by the powers that be. #11 on the other hand........is innocent until proven guilty......

[kerrystevens]

OH, and don't forget what GTR said in another thread..

"The car was underweight.... 3.1.1 says a car has to weigh 1355kg.. obviously Mr Taylor (is he still in charge?) found the car lighter than that at technical inspection after the race...".

If GTR is correct(and most members here believe he is 99% of the time) PMS(Perkins Motor Sport) are in a lot of trouble.