[LM24] Le Mans 2023 - 10/11 June - Who Is Going? (Closed)

[GTfour]

What an unbelievable drama. If one thought the French couldn't make a bigger mess of things...

So, the only way to have any chance for campsite tickets, will be the 5th of December, starting at 10 in the morning?

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by GTfour

What an unbelievable drama. If one thought the French couldn't make a bigger mess of things...

So, the only way to have any chance for campsite tickets, will be the 5th of December, starting at 10 in the morning?

It seems that way. Another good example of the shambles is that there are still packages showing as for sale on the ticketing page, but when you click on them, they say they're sold out. Expo parking came up again when I looked out of curiosity this morning, but although it showed they were available, when you pressed the button, it said they weren't.

None of us really have any idea about next week, whether the ACO have held anything back for the general public nor what the agencies are getting. But it seems from the Just Tickets response that they are expecting to be significantly disappointed.

So what have the ACO done and what use are they making of the very large areas (e.g. all of bleu and blanc) that they have taken away? It has to be some kind of corporate provision. Over the last 10-15 years large areas have been taken away for the likes of Audi and Porsche and with manufacturers returning, I can only assume that they've told the ACO we'll give you big pots of euros but we want a lot of space from you. All the while, the real supporters of the race - for many of us over many, many years - get shafted.

[Hedley Verity]

Wonder how many tickets Peugeot are getting?

As many as they want would be my guess.

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by Hedley Verity

Wonder how many tickets Peugeot are getting?

As many as they want would be my guess.

Audi built a whole hotel a few years ago now, I wouldn't mind betting that blanc and bleu are destined for a similar use. Which probably means they'll never be available to us again....

[whitemr2]

If tickets sell out to members, than in my opinion there should be nothing available for general public, if so, I feel even more disapointed.

[Hedley Verity]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

Audi built a whole hotel a few years ago now, I wouldn't mind betting that blanc and bleu are destined for a similar use. Which probably means they'll never be available to us again....

And that’s even before the rest turn up in ‘24, Alpine will want whatever Peugeot have had

[RL17]

Originally Posted by whitemr2

A good walk..... BSJ is an awfull long walk from anything.

I still try to think I'm lucky to have a pitch AND full week.

ACO should come with a apology and explanation for people to understand the mess they created.

Positives for BSJ:

Security on gate has stepped up and onsite - haven't seen grass track, figure of 8s and donuts on site in last 4 years or so, nor heard empty gas cyclinders on BBQs. Thought Bleu Nord was noisier with more all night discos and fireworks a few years back.

Porsche curves viewing bank- inside track and great view over fences etc.

it's not far from Karting gate, and compared to walking around inside track etc its not too much extra - plus walking back after race is quicker than cars/buses

Drive through it alot to Lycian site- seems to be more facilities on main part of campsite (2/3rds or so on right). Campervans in field closest to Porsche curves viewing bank and limited toilets/showers next to viewing bank. Can walk in/out by path by next to allotments (comes out by track bridge over D92).

two fields next closest to Porsche curves normally much quieter - not sure on facilities. Campers in forest like hazard tape and very large pitches

quite a few buses from roundabout by entrance and little train thing going up & down to/from Techno park and tram entrance.

Bar near entrance roundabout and a few food vendors inside (400 m or so into site)

Farmers track access block does mean it's now (2022 and last few years) a U shaped site and road and foot access to Porsche curves bank goes down to bottom/south of site and back up through forest on track. Cars of campers close to track (dotted line) get very dusty and if you drive in and out a bit it can be a pain especially with a bit of rain as it's like a mile of rallycross each way. It can also be 1km or so walk to the entrance from southern end of site

they seem to show people on arrival where to go by leading them out on bikes after gate.

will try and post my mark up of site on satellite map.

[GT6]

i think people should not panic yet, due to the shambles of the aco sale and people worried about getting anything, i am sure people have bought what they can on the site and if they then get stuff from the agencies there should be many spares for sale once the dust has settled.

[Peter Mallett]

I believe this is the view from Porsche Curves TD to the BSJ area?

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by GT6

i think people should not panic yet, due to the shambles of the aco sale and people worried about getting anything, i am sure people have bought what they can on the site and if they then get stuff from the agencies there should be many spares for sale once the dust has settled.

Fingers crossed that the agencies are able to meet their orders....

[AstonGeoff]

Originally Posted by GTfour

What an unbelievable drama. If one thought the French couldn't make a bigger mess of things...

So, the only way to have any chance for campsite tickets, will be the 5th of December, starting at 10 in the morning?

Only if the ACO have kept some back from Members, If not then there won't be any on sale anyway. And if they have there will be some very annoyed members.

[Aysedasi]

Indeed so. When you decide to cut back on facilities for the paying spectators - seemingly quite dramatically - for the most eagerly awaited event for years, you must surely appreciate that you're going to create a lot of problems, and possibly drive people away from your event....

[whitemr2]

Originally Posted by RL17

Positives for BSJ:

Security on gate has stepped up and onsite - haven't seen grass track, figure of 8s and donuts on site in last 4 years or so, nor heard empty gas cyclinders on BBQs. Thought Bleu Nord was noisier with more all night discos and fireworks a few years back.

Porsche curves viewing bank- inside track and great view over fences etc.

it's not far from Karting gate, and compared to walking around inside track etc its not too much extra - plus walking back after race is quicker than cars/buses

Drive through it alot to Lycian site- seems to be more facilities on main part of campsite (2/3rds or so on right). Campervans in field closest to Porsche curves viewing bank and limited toilets/showers next to viewing bank. Can walk in/out by path by next to allotments (comes out by track bridge over D92).

two fields next closest to Porsche curves normally much quieter - not sure on facilities. Campers in forest like hazard tape and very large pitches

quite a few buses from roundabout by entrance and little train thing going up & down to/from Techno park and tram entrance.

Bar near entrance roundabout and a few food vendors inside (400 m or so into site)

Farmers track access block does mean it's now (2022 and last few years) a U shaped site and road and foot access to Porsche curves bank goes down to bottom/south of site and back up through forest on track. Cars of campers close to track (dotted line) get very dusty and if you drive in and out a bit it can be a pain especially with a bit of rain as it's like a mile of rallycross each way. It can also be 1km or so walk to the entrance from southern end of site

they seem to show people on arrival where to go by leading them out on bikes after gate.

will try and post my mark up of site on satellite map.

Thank you, sounds 'good'

[Simmi]

I guess the ACO did a cost per square metre analysis and figured it was better to remove the camping/parking and better to add in whatever they are adding in.

Thinking about it there isn't currently room for all manufacturers to activate at the level we've seen from Toyota/Audi in the current era. Even what Peugeot had this year was more modest but still takes up space. So I wonder if different areas will suddenly become display areas and obviously hosting space for VIPs.

[GT6]

I would not want to be the agents at the moment, how do you allocate the camping they have been given and how do you choose who gets nothing, likely to **** almost everyone off.

[AstonGeoff]

Originally Posted by Simmi

I guess the ACO did a cost per square metre analysis and figured it was better to remove the camping/parking and better to add in whatever they are adding in.

Thinking about it there isn't currently room for all manufacturers to activate at the level we've seen from Toyota/Audi in the current era. Even what Peugeot had this year was more modest but still takes up space. So I wonder if different areas will suddenly become display areas and obviously hosting space for VIPs.

ACO doing a cost analysis?

[Aysedasi]

I’ve got a question for the ACO members here, particularly those who have been a member for quite a few years. It comes after a conversation with a guy on FB who has been a member for 28 years. He tells me that as a long standing member, his allocation is automatically reserved by the ACO each year. This is kind of new to me as I’ve rarely needed to buy tickets direct myself (although I know that James always seemed to get much the same allocation for us each year) but having heard Pascal talk of being bumped parking-wise from Blanc and someone on CA having a place in Epinette confirmed before yesterday, I just wonder how this works and how many long-term members are effectively given ‘first dibs’ by the ACO - and indeed…. why? The guy maintains that he knows at least 20 people who have been treated the same by the ACO. I’m trying to work out in my mind whether I think this is fair or unfair….. It rewards loyalty, which is a good thing, but at a time when availability is far more limited than before is it right to do this while other ACO members are scrambling to try and buy tickets and in many instances, failing to do so.

[AstonGeoff]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

I’ve got a question for the ACO members here, particularly those who have been a member for quite a few years. It comes after a conversation with a guy on FB who has been a member for 28 years. He tells me that as a long standing member, his allocation is automatically reserved by the ACO each year. This is kind of new to me as I’ve rarely needed to buy tickets direct myself (although I know that James always seemed to get much the same allocation for us each year) but having heard Pascal talk of being bumped parking-wise from Blanc and someone on CA having a place in Epinette confirmed before yesterday, I just wonder how this works and how many long-term members are effectively given ‘first dibs’ by the ACO - and indeed…. why? The guy maintains that he knows at least 20 people who have been treated the same by the ACO. I’m trying to work out in my mind whether I think this is fair or unfair….. It rewards loyalty, which is a good thing, but at a time when availability is far more limited than before is it right to do this while other ACO members are scrambling to try and buy tickets and in many instances, failing to do so.

I have a couple of friends who get automatic allocation each year, again they are long term members, for one of them it's about having the same seats in the ACO grandstand every year.
Personally I'm not bothered either way, both friends would be going anyway so it's not like they are getting something they wouldn't want.
It obviously goes back a long way and is probably more obvious now that we can book directly via the website. Prior to that I used to just send an email asking for the usual and they would respond with an invoice.
From an ACO point of view it's an almost guaranteed income (and fewer annoyed Members) and from a Members point of view it saves the mad scramble these days.

I have no idea how they copy with it from an admin point of view, knowing the ACO it's probably an old book with handwritten details in it!

PS - I am an ACO Member

[whitemr2]

I know of one large private group getting a certain amount of pitches every year. It is big bucks with little work. Is it fair..... No.
Would I accept it, Yes.
I know I don't get it, only a member for 9 years. Would I be upset if it happened on large scale, Yes.
First come first serve is fair, it feels like getting tickets for a concert of the Rolling Stones.
Looking at the history of LM where having tickets are very often combined with camping it seems /stupid to have separate dates for that.

[RL17]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

I believe this is the view from Porsche Curves TD to the BSJ area?

yes looks like Arnage end of Porsche curves banking with the marquee of the Lycian site behind it (that is trackside but before the banking). BSJ motorhome area is leftside behind the banking

[RL17]

Can you only post images with url links? As struggling to post a phone photo of a printed map with marked up comments?

Good pictures of BSJ are on the 2022 Part 1 video from 27.55 to 28.15 mins when they get pictures from blimp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwpQgDLPV58

from Arnage end of bank you can see down to Porsche bridge and there's some reasonable light as enter Porsche curves

On video
Lycian site is bottom right (rows of uniform tents)

Motorhome bit pretty clear and most of rest of BSJ in shot at 28.12 behind that and top right - entrance top left and a bit more of BSJ off right is not shown (which unfortunately is way to curves)

allotments are behind track where the blue and yellow michelin barrier signage is

[dwh43scale]

ACO member depuis 1997. Never heard or seen of the automatic allocation but last camped on site since 1997 so that might be why - since then it has been Expo car park pretty much every year. Always booked direct with ACO after the first couple of years - even when we had to fax our requirements and credit card number to them (fax machine at work was so useful ...).

As noted above, Audi used to have their hotel at the back of Expo. Given the likely Euro per sqm I can see why they might prefer that sort of business especially for the centenary year, but we also know the manufacturers won't be back every year as we saw recently. Short term gain trumps long term loyalty ...

Perhaps worth remembering too (whether we like it or not), that what we see as a sport is a very serious and expensive business for some.

[RL17]

https://thumbsnap.com/tUXoNYw8

[Gingers4Justice]

At this rate, it genuinely looks like me and my party will be unable to go and camp. That essentially rules us out being able to go at all. How have the ACO managed to conjure up this situation?

[GT6]

i am sure things will get clearer. but then again i have always been too optimistic