Wakefield Park Issues

[GreenMachine]

Doubt police would be interested, they have quite a complex on Taralga Rd, on the edge of town, including, what appears to be a sealed 'racetrack' type facility. WP would be overkill, and wouldn't offer them the skidpan and what I am guessing is a section of track that can be watered by sprinklers. It is much handier to their Academy than WP too.

[Casper]

If that is so why do they use it at all?

[GreenMachine]

Originally Posted by Casper

If that is so why do they use it at all?

Do or did? How much use do/did they make of it - an occasional hire, or is it an integral, necessary, and important part of their driver training syllabus?

I can see them using it for variety, maybe it offers higher speeds, but not being privy to the inner workings of police driver training I can't pontificate with certainty.

[275 GTB-4]

22 AUG 22

Mayor Peter Walker on Radio this morn:

Mayor says Not Gone! Prefers the word "Suspended"...However, redundancy's have been issued to staff

Council meeting this week with local noise complainers...Why? who knows? (check council live stream)

Glbn Shop keepers are fuming

LEC Commissioner says that for example, a 4 day bike meeting is FOUR events and therefore no events for days after that...can this ruling be changed? very hard now that precedent set...

Mayor is trying to work thru issues

Mayor was asked: can WP come back? or another company say with a different approach? Mayor says difficult now that legal ruling has been set. Maybe a new DA but risk is that could be dragged back to original 1993 conditions

Mayor reiterated that there are lots of angry people out there!

2GN stream https://www.radio-australia.org/2gn

[275 GTB-4]

Originally Posted by Kingair

Welcome to Wakefield Park Housing Estate, a lovely rural setting on the outskirts of Goulburn.

We have land now available in Holden Drive, Falcon Close, Porsche View, Datsun Place, Honda Avenue and Nissan Parade.

330kV Electrical Easement will limit any housing proposal, also contravenes the land use designation...

[275 GTB-4]

Originally Posted by GreenMachine

I can see them using it for variety, maybe it offers higher speeds, but not being privy to the inner workings of police driver training I can't pontificate with certainty.

Hee heee...the M31/Ho Hum Hwy is just a hop, step and jump away from the Police Academy...AND has the advantage of plenty of bushes/scrub/side tracks to hide in!

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 275 GTB-4

Mayor reiterated that there are lots of angry people out there!

2GN stream https://www.radio-australia.org/2gn

By that he means what? How many council members have stood up and supported the mayor in his attempts to keep WP open? It sounds like he is just repeating and reinforcing the party line of WP management. GTB, do you still support the illegal activity of WP? It seems from the way you respond to this thread that you do and did. If the unhappy hordes in motorsport which have totally different view to the unhappy hordes in Goulburn were able to start a new re-zoning application part of which was new operating limits it could go on for years back and forth through the courts and someone has to stump up the money to do that. Wishful thinking comes to mind, even the mayor acknowledges that. Where is that dead horse emoji?

[GreenMachine]

Originally Posted by 275 GTB-4

22 AUG 22

Mayor Peter Walker on Radio this morn:

Mayor says Not Gone! Prefers the word "Suspended"...However, redundancy's have been issued to staff

Council meeting this week with local noise complainers...Why? who knows? (check council live stream)

Glbn Shop keepers are fuming

LEC Commissioner says that for example, a 4 day bike meeting is FOUR events and therefore no events for days after that...can this ruling be changed? very hard now that precedent set...

Mayor is trying to work thru issues

Mayor was asked: can WP come back? or another company say with a different approach? Mayor says difficult now that legal ruling has been set. Maybe a new DA but risk is that could be dragged back to original 1993 conditions

Mayor reiterated that there are lots of angry people out there!

2GN stream https://www.radio-australia.org/2gn

The horse has bolted, and even if it can be found, it will be pretty unhealthy, an invalid even. The town, and motorsport, better get used to it.

Maybe the special precinct will happen, but how much difference it will make I don't know. I do know I will not be betting my house on it enabling the circuit to roar back to life (much as I would like that).

The only currently feasible way forward that I can see is to revert to the model the original owners used, which I presume was compliant with the DA. That implies a massive revaluation of the asset - downwards. I can't see BAC wanting to take that on, so either the circuit will simply lie unused into the future, or it will be sold. The latter will crystallise the capital loss for BAC but they will get some cash for an asset that is otherwise a drag on their Winton revenues.

Building on that model, maybe a new model is possible, one where the owners use the circuit for enjoyment (ie motorsport), in which participation is restricted to owners only. That would depend on the LEC (and DA) definition of 'events' being events open to the public (ie other than the owners) to enter. Thus motorsport people could become shareholders in the company owning the circuit.

[GreenMachine]

Went down to WP today, had a RV with a mate to drop the last bits from my parted-out racecar. Paddock was full, lots of spillover from the garages and carports, not a lot of speccies though. They certainly seemed to be pushing the events through quickly.

Might be my imagination, but I detected a bit a flavour of 'going out with a bang'.

I think there is some sort of 'drive to support WP' on tomorrow?

[275 GTB-4]

Originally Posted by GreenMachine

Went down to WP today, had a RV with a mate to drop the last bits from my parted-out racecar. Paddock was full, lots of spillover from the garages and carports, not a lot of speccies though. They certainly seemed to be pushing the events through quickly.

Might be my imagination, but I detected a bit a flavour of 'going out with a bang'.

I think there is some sort of 'drive to support WP' on tomorrow?

MRA meeting...and some sort of "cruise" commencing 1100 28th AUG 22 at Glbn Showgrounds and then a drive to WP @ 1300...hope they don't disrupt the meeting and people having their last roll of the dice...constabulary will no doubt be present...

[275 GTB-4]

I rocked up...3-400 cars circulating around Glbn. 25% were Ford Falcons (Mustang badged). Small number of race cars on trailers...plus a bunch of big bikes...Don't know if it will do much of anything but good to see...

[GreenMachine]

It won't. But some people will feel good.

The time for that sort of thing is when there is a decision in the offing, and the people making the decision will be influenced by a show of support. They hope! But it is a rare case where that actually makes a difference.

[275 GTB-4]

PM Sent :-)

[Casper]

So all those who went cruisin' support the past illegal operations @ WP. That should go down well I don't think. The funny bit is they expect WP to return to that illegal behaviour or attempt to modify the DA so it returns the previous operating mode and that should go down like a lead balloon locally. I bet BAC don't have enough money to push forward with the legal costs including the costs already incurred to go back to the L&E court and then fight the appeals and problems if they are successful. I'll repeat what I wrote before, WP have screwed motorsport in NSW by their bull headed approach to the whole thing.

[275 GTB-4]

2GN stream https://www.radio-australia.org/2gn (around 0800 each day)

BAC VP Bruce Robinson sound bite on the closure 01 SEPT. Says he is optimistic track will re-open BECAUSE of Dept of Defence and Police needs and "support"! Good luck with that narrow, wishfull thinking approach buddy!

[GreenMachine]

Nothing changes. I would suspect there is a mutiny brewing in BAC, the members can't be happy about the situation.

If I was their bank manager, I would be looking very closely at their financial statements, and what the loss of WP income was going to do to liquidity and debt servicing.

There has to be a window for the BAC to reopen the circuit, unless Winton is so profitable it can support both circuits even though one of them is generating no revenue. Even in this unlikely event, a discrete asset that is making no contribution to BAC's business, or otherwise to BAC's activities/mission, has to be facing the chopping block.

However it seems that BAC is looking to other people to rescue them - earlier it was the State Government, now it is the police and DoD.

Have we heard anything about a move to the ACT, which was mooted earlier? Just what that would do for their investment in WP I don't know, the market for distressed circuits is bad enough without opening a competitor nearby.

[275 GTB-4]

Originally Posted by GreenMachine

Nothing changes. I would suspect there is a mutiny brewing in BAC, the members can't be happy about the situation.

If I was their bank manager, I would be looking very closely at their financial statements, and what the loss of WP income was going to do to liquidity and debt servicing.

There has to be a window for the BAC to reopen the circuit, unless Winton is so profitable it can support both circuits even though one of them is generating no revenue. Even in this unlikely event, a discrete asset that is making no contribution to BAC's business, or otherwise to BAC's activities/mission, has to be facing the chopping block.

However it seems that BAC is looking to other people to rescue them - earlier it was the State Government, now it is the police and DoD.

Have we heard anything about a move to the ACT, which was mooted earlier? Just what that would do for their investment in WP I don't know, the market for distressed circuits is bad enough without opening a competitor nearby.

Bean-counter Talk!!

2GN stream https://www.radio-australia.org/2gn (around 0800 each day)
BAC VP Bruce Robertson on the radio again...he may not have done his homework re the Police, gibbering on about them having a circuit with all the "safety features" when they already have their own driver training facility.

BAC 500 members times annual dues might not be an insubstantial amount...plus Winton may also get hired out for other than race meetings (which generates bags of gold as well)...

Devils Advocate Thought: Wakefield may still be able to be leased for other purposes whilst BAC maintains ownership (wind-up mouse off and running!)

Move to Canberra was probably just a strategy and highly unlikely in the nanny state of the ACT...I heard that BAC tried that ploy with Winton and Hume Weir way back when...

[Casper]

It seems that BAC have been lobbying the SMH Drive team who I know have used WP in the past for testing and photo shoots. There was an article available to read in the Sydney Morning Herald at about 10am this morning but it has now been pulled (thus no link possible) about two hours later and in it BAC was saying that the only way it could be re-opened was if the NSW government got involved. Seriously, what sort of drugs are these guys on, they blew it due to inept management and now think that everyone but themselves should be blamed and that the government should bail them out. I think they must have been reading this thread as they advanced the same thinking as I did when I proposed that the police or someone else might buy it because the dept. of defense is quoted as a user as well. The NSW govt is in enough trouble at the moment and pulling out of some capital projects and getting involved with this problem is the last thing they need.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by Casper

It seems that BAC have been lobbying the SMH Drive team who I know have used WP in the past for testing and photo shoots. There was an article available to read in the Sydney Morning Herald at about 10am this morning but it has now been pulled (thus no link possible) about two hours later and in it BAC was saying that the only way it could be re-opened was if the NSW government got involved.

Think that this article is the one you're looking for. Some of the comments on the article are interesting.

Personally, I think it's a great shame that Wakefield is stopping. You'd think that a circuit built near a medium sized town but out in farmland and within a 2 hour drive of a major city and a 1 hour drive of an almost major city would be in a good position to avoid noise problems, interact with the local community and provide benefit and be able to draw on two cities for participants - on the face of it, a really strong proposition.

I know that there's been a number of views expressed here about where it all went wrong and who or what is to blame and I don't know where the truth really lies but I do hope that the truth comes out fully somehow and hopefully not too long from now. If nothing else, it could be a VERY important lesson on what pitfalls to avoid or of what not to do.

[Casper]

I absolutely agree agree, given a bit of forethought and some discussion with all involved the problem could have been mitigated if not entirely avoided. Unfortunately Abusing the DA conditions for years most probably made negotiation with those involved a bridge too far. Full disclosure, I contributed to the problem hundreds of times over many years.

[275 GTB-4]

Originally Posted by Tourer

I know that there's been a number of views expressed here about where it all went wrong and who or what is to blame and I don't know where the truth really lies but I do hope that the truth comes out fully somehow and hopefully not too long from now. If nothing else, it could be a VERY important lesson on what pitfalls to avoid or of what not to do.

So, kinda one step forward, two steps back? A little like Albo looking backward and going after his opponents instead of driving the country forward?

The less publicity the LEC precedent gets the better it will be for other venues...

I'm hopeful a solution can be found eventually and that Wakefield can operate once again...

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by 275 GTB-4

So, kinda one step forward, two steps back? A little like Albo looking backward and going after his opponents instead of driving the country forward?

The less publicity the LEC precedent gets the better it will be for other venues...

I'm hopeful a solution can be found eventually and that Wakefield can operate once again...

Agree with your last point.

Not looking backwards - more needing to understand (or at least those that need to see it) how this ran off the rails and looking for some lessons to avoid something similar in the future - both for this facility and in general for other facilities.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 275 GTB-4

I'm hopeful a solution can be found eventually and that Wakefield can operate once again...

Hope springs eternal and we all live in hope that it can return to some sort of feasible operation but the way BAC have gone about things has gone about trying to avoid any responsibility and blaming everyone else for the present state of affairs will make that difficult. In all my many years of using the track the only thing we were told was a curfew was in operation and we had to stop track use by 4:30pm IIRC. Judging by what has occurred I wonder if BAC even knew about the DA conditions when they purchased.

[GreenMachine]

That article first appeared a week ago (27/8). I haven't seen anything else more recently, there was an article about the sale of an 'iconic circuit', but it was an Ipswich speedway iirc.

As previously stated Casper , I think that is a real question for the BAC membership - ie what 'due diligence did the Club do before purchase of WP. If I was a member I'd also be asking whether Winton was fully compliant with any and all DA-type conditions it may be subject to.

[Casper]

I would be willing to bet real money that the fat lady is no where near getting to the end of her song. I wonder when the next general meeting of the BAC membership is going to be held, it would almost be worth a trip to see what happens. I just looked at the website and it seems the application for membership page has been taken down.