HANS devices in historic racing

[midgetman]

Originally Posted by Tim Falce

It's impossible for me to alter my belt angle, they fit over my shoulders and do up round my waste much the same as most harnesses. It sounds like you may have a dodgy setup as there are instructions on the angle the belt has to follow when you buy them.

Yes, the correct belt angle for safety is also the correct belt angle for HANS. I've never worn one, but my co-driver in the 360 had one and he got on perfectly well in the 924, and that doesn't have a special seat or even the narrow belts. The harness has a nice low angle, coming off the rear luggage deck.

I must admit the belts in the 924 are much more comfortable than the Midget's were as they don't come over my shoulders at such an acute angle. I suggest you try re-siting them anyway Al, there's lots of benefits.

I wouldn't take too much notice of the FIA articles, from what I can see they're written by people with vested interests so "they would say that, wouldn't they?" Just use them as part of your own personal risk assessment.

[Al Weyman]

The belts have been like it since 1988 when I built the car and pick up on the original anchoridge point and that would be far stronger than sat running them from the rear parcel shelf to get the HANS specified angle. The belts feel fine and comfortable on when strapped in. Personally I would have thought in a roll over incident a more acute angle would be safer.

[midgetman]

I've come to think not, Al. The belts are designed to hold a rigid part of you (your torso) rigid against something rigid (your seat). By pulling DOWNWARDS you're pulling against a collapsible part of your body - when you go upisde down your @r5e tries to escape through your neck, and then you are loose within the belts.

However, if you are pulled BACK against the seat, you're held in place and your body can't jacknife. That's the way I see it anyway.

It's like trying to hang things onto a solid wall using zip ties. Pull 'em back tight enough and you don't need supports underneath, just the ties. It's not just for HANS, it's for safety in head on and roll over accidents. One of the reasons I sold the MG was that I am too tall to get the belt angles right, and getting to an age where I worry about these things!

[Al Weyman]

Erm as an aside thats an interesting comment, why is it the young with their whole lifes ahead of them have a more cavalier attitude to safety. I will have a look at the belt scenario again maybe easier in the black car as its a hatchback.

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

why is it the young with their whole lifes ahead of them have a more cavalier attitude to safety.

Because when you're young bad things only happen to other people, when you're old you know it can happen to you as well.

[terence]

And also because they havn't yet discovered the "What If" factor. IE,What If there's a car just over that blind brow?. Does tend to slow some people down.

[midgetman]

And us Oldies are just as bad. "It was perfectly all right without X thirty years ago, why do I need X now?"

The world changes and we don't keep up.

[Peter Mallett]

The solution I used was to have a bar installed in the rollcage over which the belts were looped. My new Capri cage has this bar as part of the original structure.

You only have to look at the connection points on a single seater, these are usually just at the level of the driver's shoulders.