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Old 13 Oct 2003, 13:25 (Ref:749565)   #51
Rulekeeper
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Originally posted by webberisgod
but they wernt the ppl in the hot seat at the time, everything is fine with 20/20 hindsight and everyone knows they could do a better job. only problem is that they are not the ppl doing the job.
What I'm trying to point out is that everyone seems to be blaming
1. The Stewards
2. FPR for making a complaint
3. Bowe for having Skaife turn in on him
4. Any other reason that comes to mind for a Holden supporter.
All I'm suggesting is that HRT is supposed to be the most pro. team in this series and didn't realize they were going to lose out one way or the other and tossed the coin-bad luck, tails, you lose.
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Old 13 Oct 2003, 14:13 (Ref:749652)   #52
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Lets try again - the fault lies firmly with Race Control and the Race Director - the stewards had NOTHING whatsoever to do (officially that is) with this cock up
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Old 13 Oct 2003, 21:16 (Ref:750217)   #53
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Originally posted by Rhys_00
Sounds ridiculous to me Deano, I really don't think there would be too many out there that would race so dirty for 1 position (3 points is it?), and I think its a bit unfair of you to make such claims.
Rhys_00

You're right, it was unfair. It's just the "conspiratory theorist" coming out in me. Guess I've been watching a bit too much NASCAR recently. Those guys will do anything.

Apologies to Andrew Jones, John Cleland and BJR. A stupid post.
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Old 13 Oct 2003, 23:36 (Ref:750332)   #54
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Just a small point of clarification, It is not the decsion of the "stewards" to black flag anyone for a safety issue, This decision is the final call of the Clerk of Course, not even the Race Director (Tim Schenken) can make it, he can advise only. The Clerk of Course has the ultimate responsibility for safety at race meetings, so it would have been their call to bring the car in for safety reasons. Also remember that the Clerk of Course does not operate on their own, at big race meetings they have several Assistants.

The stewards role is to give fair and unbiased decisions when rules have allegedly been broken. The incident with Car 1's door was a safety issue not a driving/driver infringement issue, so it has nothing to do with stewards.

There has been reference to race officials sitting watching the TV and making decisions, one question, how in hells name are you supposed to do it any other way at Bathurst. They can't possibly see the whole track from any one point on the track. There are only a very few tracks that you can see most of the track from race control. I have worked in Race Control, and it ain't easy.

Anyway, for what it is worth, IMHO, I reckon this whole topic has been done to death. Arguing about on here ain't gonna change the results, all it is doing is getting everybody's dander up, and didn't you know that stress is a killer.

Racetime, I have tried to help you here, I posted this on V8 Central as well.
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Old 13 Oct 2003, 23:43 (Ref:750338)   #55
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Agree with what you have sdaid except the role of Race Director - whilst he is (ultimately) responsible to the CofC, we both know this is not how Tim likes or wants to operate - when he enters race control it is with an air of 'I am boss - this is what you will do...'

And yes - nothing will change what has happened - but if enough pressure is kept on key people, stuff ups like this should (and could) be prevented from happening again. If that pressure isn't kept up, it will happen again, and again, and again...

Actually - at two of the best tracks in the country you CAN see almost 99% of the track from race control - funny how both tracks start with a W
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Old 13 Oct 2003, 23:46 (Ref:750344)   #56
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You can probably tell by my "from" info which W I work at.
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Old 14 Oct 2003, 00:04 (Ref:750354)   #57
RaceTime
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Wanneroo? - I knew...and still maintian Wakefield and Winton are probably the best two circuits around for visibility (OK Crash - QLD Raceway is also good - for a paper clip )
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Old 14 Oct 2003, 04:42 (Ref:750458)   #58
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Crash Test should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridCrash Test should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Pfftttt... at least at QR you get cars overtaking one another
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Old 14 Oct 2003, 04:48 (Ref:750460)   #59
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Still not what I would call a RACE track - a track maybe....
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Old 15 Oct 2003, 23:17 (Ref:752759)   #60
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There is more retards posting here than there is in race control
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Old 15 Oct 2003, 23:27 (Ref:752764)   #61
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CAre to put names to your comment - and maybe some idea of your experience would help distinguish you from them as well...
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Old 15 Oct 2003, 23:44 (Ref:752769)   #62
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4 posts old and the boy/girl thinx they're better than the place.

Why'd you sign up Expert05 if you don't want to play nice (or has Tricky got yet another new username)?????? :confused:
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Old 16 Oct 2003, 00:49 (Ref:752805)   #63
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Crash Test should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridCrash Test should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Q. If whatever Ford teams put in a protest, would they not be protesting to the stewards, who in turn make a decision? If there was a protest, what should the protocol be, and was the line of command broken?
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Old 16 Oct 2003, 01:30 (Ref:752816)   #64
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RaceTime should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Crash - correct - if a protest is submitted, it goes to the Stewards.

However, the stewards have a responsibility to investigate before making a decision.

As has already been pointed out - the Steward made a decision on this protest (as also reported in the Stewards Findings from Bathurst), AGAINST the evidence and advice of the CofC, Race Director and Category Technical Manager.

Now - who should know better than the Category Technical Manager how a Holden door is going to react under these condition better than a Ford team?

Was the line of command broken - to the extent that the Steward either dismissed or ignored the Technical evidence provided to him.
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Old 16 Oct 2003, 03:30 (Ref:752862)   #65
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The word 'Retard' should not be used to start a discussion forum.
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Old 16 Oct 2003, 03:48 (Ref:752866)   #66
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Originally posted by vortexo
I believe Pretty is a bit sick and sore from the hit. He was taken to hospital = I hope he is ok.
Rest easy, Vortex ... he was pretty sore afterwards but it didn't stop him from getting to the pub that night to have a drink (non-alcoholic) with Murph. You'd have to whack that boy upside the head with a spade to keep him away from a party ...
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Old 16 Oct 2003, 05:02 (Ref:752881)   #67
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The word 'Retard' should not be used to start a discussion forum.
Exactly
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Old 16 Oct 2003, 05:27 (Ref:752889)   #68
RaceTime
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RaceTime should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
So address it to the person that started the thread.

But I notice it dodn't stop you from reading and joining in the thread...
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Old 16 Oct 2003, 07:59 (Ref:752964)   #69
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Vee8 there was not one non alcoholic drink at the leagues club.
As for the rest of this thread, I am not saying a bloody word.
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Old 18 Oct 2003, 07:43 (Ref:754940)   #70
Roy Slaven
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Originally posted by RaceTime
So address it to the person that started the thread.

But I notice it dodn't stop you from reading and joining in the thread...
What are you going on about
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Old 18 Oct 2003, 08:05 (Ref:754948)   #71
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GTRMagic will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameGTRMagic will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameGTRMagic will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameGTRMagic will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameGTRMagic will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameGTRMagic will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameGTRMagic will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameGTRMagic will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
Perhaps it was a term of endearment?
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Old 18 Oct 2003, 11:44 (Ref:755025)   #72
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What are you going on about
Of the retention span is that short then I obviously don;t need to continue, do I?

Address your concern about the thread title to the person that started it - not to everyone else - or simply don;t take part.
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Old 21 Oct 2003, 23:17 (Ref:758857)   #73
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Interesting that AA reports that Mr (IM)Polites claims no knowledge of the high mobile phone bill Mr Kruk ran up on the weekend trying to get Ford teams to protest.....

In the words of Sgt Schultz... "I know nuthing... I know nuthhhinngggg!!"
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