Classic Fiat 500 racing competitively?

[pouch]

Hi all,

I am looking to develop a classic car for some club racing, we are both MSA license holders.

I have a 1965 Fiat 500 sitting waiting for a plan and I was wondering is anyone if campaigning these car at present?

Any suggestions for possible championship eligibility much appreciated.
Ideally two driver events.
Thanks
Martyn

[Al Weyman]

I thought they only raced the 600 didnt they, I really cannot imagine the two cylinder 500 ever being competitive.

[morninggents]

Speak to Tony Castle-Miller at Middle Barton garage in, I think, Somerton (recently moved from Middle Barton). He's the Fiat Abarth expert.

[morninggents]

Originally Posted by pouch

Hi all,
I have a 1965 Fiat 500 sitting waiting for a plan and I was wondering is anyone if campaigning these car at present?
Any suggestions for possible championship eligibility much appreciated.
Ideally two driver events.
Thanks
Martyn

HRSR/HSCC Historic Touring Cars has had Fiat Abarths racing over the years including John Barber's car currently. Good HSCC calendar with double headers and, hopefully, a two driver race this year.

[johngee]

Fiat Abarth 595's were raced in Italy, in period, but I've never seen one racing in the UK. I don't think it would be wildly competitive but it would be a fun addition to HSCC/HRSR grids.
I had a Fiat Abarth 850TC (based on the 600D) some years ago and Middle Barton Garage were certainly the people to speak to. Good luck with it.

[Mike Harte]

Louise Kennedy (LAK), a member on here, races a baby Fiat; she had an outing with it at Silverstone in April. She may be able to point you in the right direction.

[JasperClan]

A number of them run in the Abarth Coppa Mille in Germany. Not as slow as you would think. Masses of equipment available for them. Worth checking out the web site.

Pete Richards

[zefarelly]

As MIke said, LAK and others race with HRDC . . . they've been battling for class honours, and beating bigger fish in the wet, looks like great fun.

[Al Weyman]

Stick a Hyabusa in the back and have some real fun!

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

Stick a Hyabusa in the back and have some real fun!

Al, you'd need one Fiat 500 for each foot like a pair of roller skates

[pouch]

Hey guys, thank you for all the suggestions

Tony (middle barton) is rebuilding a gearbox for me (different car) at present, so will have a chat to him when I collect on Friday.
I know they had some history in period, but was surprised to find none in any of the grids.
Especially given there are actually quite a lot of them around these days.
I'll send LAK a message.

Staying with HTP passport or modifying is an interesting question.
We would be having the shell prepared, but it would be much nicer to be period, as long as we could be reasonably competitive.

[FISCracer]

Jasper Izaks runs a Fiat Abarth in the Dutch NKHTGT championship and slow it isn't. In a wet qualifying at Zandvoort 10 days ago it was top 15 in front of Mustangs, LCs, etc etc. Even in the dry (off the line especially) it's quick, however I think its 1000cc

[Al Weyman]

Not HTP'able then if 1000cc!! I bought one from an auction once (I used to trade) it was mint and had under a thousand miles on the clock, my sister in law was interested so I took it over to Chesham to show her but the thing struggled so much getting up the Chilton hills I just told her not to buy it as it was impractical transport for her. As for racing one, well it all depends what floats your boat but racing for me is to do something we can no longer do on the roads, i.e. GO FAST!!!

[pouch]

Its a 1000TC, great info, thanks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU2KFNMF-40

Slow? perhaps in outright speed, but having raced caterhams, I am used of not so much power and lots of liteness.

Interesting, I have found quite of lot of stuff in Italy, looks like they are still racing, just hard to find due to all the New 500 and 695ss versions making search's difficult.

Looks like fiat 500 is already eligible for the HSCC (on their list)

[Al Weyman]

That certainly aint no 500cc twin cylinder Fiat 500 engine in there! I thought thats what you were talking of using when you said you had a Fiat 500, if it was an Abarth 1000cc then sure its a differnt kettle of fish altogether.

[pouch]

I need to find out what appendix K limitations are.
Certainly 695, 700 & 750 raced in period

[Tel 911S]

Been looking at the Homologation , & the 500 only weighs 480 Kg , so it has weight on its side .
The Arbarth 695 is the same car with a 195 cc bigger 2 cylinder engine & has a lot of parts for it in the Gp 2 Homologation papers .
So it is possible that a 2 cylinder [ 695 cc ] 500 model could be fun .

[pouch]

Thanks for that, Where can I get a copy of the Gp 2 homologation papers?

I have just sent a email to the HSCC as they show a minimum weight for under 1000cc of 580kg.
Thats a lot of ballast,
Modifications to engine for 695 seems all very good for availability.
Also the regs for the championship look a reasonably good fit, apart from the front leaf spring!

[Tel 911S]

Originally Posted by pouch

Thanks for that, Where can I get a copy of the Gp 2 homologation papers?

I have just sent a email to the HSCC as they show a minimum weight for under 1000cc of 580kg.
Thats a lot of ballast,
Modifications to engine for 695 seems all very good for availability.
Also the regs for the championship look a reasonably good fit, apart from the front leaf spring!

Normally Homologation papers are available from the MSA for a fee.
Alternatively you could PM me with your Email . I have the Gp 1 Fiat 500 papers no. 5057 for the 1966 model & the Gp2 Abarth 695 papers no. 1469

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by pouch

Its a 1000TC, great info, thanks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU2KFNMF-40

Slow? perhaps in outright speed, but having raced caterhams, I am used of not so much power and lots of liteness.
........

that looks to be a complete hoot - but is either a bit of a hotrod or a later car altogether as it has a 5 speed box.

[morninggents]

The HSCC/HRSR Historic Touring Car championship caters for both App K spec cars (which must conform with FIA papers) and more modified spec cars running to HRSR Technical Regs.

I have a copy of homologation papers 1486 if you need a copy and I see the homologated weight for the 1000 Berlina is 583kg.

Class E of the HRSR series for cars up to 1150cc has a capacity break at 1000cc and cars up to 1000cc can run at 680 kg including driver. Obviously more mods are allowed to brakes and suspensions in the HRSR classes.

Great Zandvoort video, by the way!

[zefarelly]

great video .

one has to look carefully at power/weight reatio's with HRSR . . .it certainly favours a few cars, like imps, and Anglias . . . but whether it works for Fiats I don't know, certainly a homologated spec keeps your options open.

[LAK]

I'm here! Thanks for your email Ian. I'll respond with what I know.

I'm not an expert but looks like not many on here are either! Abarth homologated just about everything for the 850 and 1000TCs so yes, 5 speed gearboxes are okay and also 1000cc engines. Still this doesn't help with a 500 although I bet a lot was homologated so options will be wide. Forward thinking man that Mr Abarth!

Of course HRSR regs are different as are Julius Thurgoods HRDC which requires FIA spec but not necessarily papers although he gets to pick and choose what cars he would like on the grid so expects cars to be period.

As can be seen by the video (most excellent!) these little Fiats are great fun and can be competitive. The key as with any racing will be finding a race / class where you can have some fun with someone. We're lucky in HRDC in having Moggy Minors to play with but the car wouldn't be competitive in many other race series.

Great to see more small engined fanatic people around!

[LAK]

SorryI meant thanks for your email Martyn. Old or tired or both!

[pouch]

Thanks to all.
Plenty of work todo now to check the options out.
News to follow!