Bell's Banter 2021

[Mike Harte]

In some respects, I am in a lucky position in that since the end of 2019 I have not been officially discharged from the hospital, and am on their systems as a virtual inpatient which means that my primary care, which would normally be the responsibility of the local medical practice, is being undertaken by members of the MDT who keep in regular touch with me.

Currently, all I need my health centre to do is follow medication instructions passed to them from the consultants, but even that seems to be too difficult for them to do properly. It's proven to be quicker and less hassle to get the hospital to sometimes dispense stuff, and they send it to me in a taxi which I pay for when they deliver it to me.

[grantp]

Recently a copy of the Official Programme (50p) for the 1977 Donington F2 meeting has come into my possession.

Somewhat interesting to note that it was run right at the end of October.

I have no idea what the entrance fee was but, given by the end of October the European driver dominated F2 crown had been won by Rene Arnoux, I assume the primary motivation for any spectators would have been to see potential future stars in action.

Also noteworthy would be that there were cash prizes - albeit not huge ones - for the support races.

Anyway, in terms of entertainment value for the cost of entrance, the time table on the programme shows the Saturday event starting at 9:00 with an hour of F2 Practice.



10:10 with Practice for the BRSCC Star of Tomorrow Formula Fords (who then race at 13:00)

Then BRSCC FF1600 for 20 mins (race at 13:00)

Leyland Mini 1000 for 20 mins (Rcae at 13:30)

Production Sports at 11:10 for 20 mins (Racing Sunday)

Historic Sportcars for 20 mins (Racing Sunday)

Then a 2 hour gap followed by the F2 cars again for an hour and a half.

All over by 15:30.


On the Sunday things start with the another FF 1600 series (some drivers in both Saturday and Sunday) at 10.00 for half an hour (Race at 12:00)

Next a half hour F2 untimed practice.

The Production Sports race at 11:30 for 10 laps.

Demos, etc. from 12:30 to 13:30

The F2 race at 13:30 for 65 laps.

And then 10 laps for the Historic Sports cars at 15.15.

The programme has 2 pages of 1977 lap records listed from which we can see that the Group 8 outright Lap record was, at the time, 1:05:0 (Surtees TS19).

Formula Libre (Chevron B35D) was 1.08.7 (Kim Mather, who was entered for the this F2 race in a Chevron B35) and F3 (Ralt RT1 Toyota) was 1:10.72

So I guess the F2 would have averaged around the 1:10 or better figure giving a 65 lap race a time of about and hour and 15 minutes assuming it was dry.

Given it was the end of October, does that look like good spectator value for whatever the entrance fee might have been?

I suppose it would have been similar to what one might expect at a GP at the time and possibly a little constrained if Donington was restricted, as I vaguely recall it might have been, by a 10:00 start time.

[GCCheddaris]

I attended the Easter Monday Formula 2 meeting at Thruxton from 1976 to 1984 and can confirm that the programme on race day was very similar to Donington Park's.

The 1977 meeting saw the first of two Formula Three practise sessions begin at 9.00 am. Formula Two also had two sessions while the other four support races had one session, the last session, for Touring Cars, beginning at 4.45 pm.

Race day began at 11.30 am with a Skydiving display followed at 12.00 noon by the Formula Two warm up which lasted for 20 minutes. Racing began at 12.40 pm with the Philips Car Radio Formula Ford race followed by a Thoroughbred Sportscar race, then a round of the BP Formula Three championship, a round of the Tricentrol Touring car championship, the European Formula Two race at 3.35 pm with the final race for a selection of Ferraris and Porsches beginning at 5.30 pm.

Grant mentioned prize money and bear in mind that the average wage in 1977 was about £70 a week, a win in the Formula Ford race earned £54, the Formula Three race win netted £360, the Touring car winner £110, Formula Two paid out the winner in Swiss Francs, 10,000 of them and even the Ferrari/Porsche race winner picked up £40 and a Philips RN351 car radio and trophy !

Did spectators think they had good value for money ? Put it this way Thruxton was packed for every Easter Monday Formula Two meeting. Okay there wasn't racing from early morning until early evening with a dozen or more often dreary and monotonous one make races (I speak as a spectator and not a competitor) but the quality of the entertainment on offer more than made up for it.


The Formula Two race provided not just drivers who in many cases would go on to stardom at the highest level but also a large grid of cars which were fast, spectacular and loud, the opening laps when the cars came past being one long blare of sound. The supporting Formula Three, Formula Ford and Touring Car races also provided spectacular action (albeit somewhat quieter !) and the single seater races a chance to see future stars, the runner up in that years Formula Ford race being Nigel Mansell.

Browsing through my old programmes from those days brings back many happy memories as it probably does those who were at Donington that day.

[Peter Mallett]

I remember those meetings and one year they had an all Ferrari race which is the first time I saw the Breadvan. That may have been 1977.

[John Elwin]

I recall Donington was a good meeting.

Does anyone else remember the Irish race meeting in the early days at Donington? It nearly didn't happen as they all drove to the wrong Donington! And that was before the days of sat nav...

[GCCheddaris]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

I remember those meetings and one year they had an all Ferrari race which is the first time I saw the Breadvan. That may have been 1977.

The Ferrari Breadvan finished fourth in the hands of John Harper in the all Ferrari race in 1976 but although entered doesn't appear to have started the Ferrari/Porsche race in 1977.

Admission to the 1976 F2 meeting at Thruxton was £2.00 with 25% discount if you booked in advance ! (Stands and Paddock admission £2.00 extra each)

[Peter Mallett]

Hmm, I was a barman at that time (1976), I recall pulling a sicky so I could attend. Crown and Cushion Minley. Not far from a difficult rally stage.

[Gerard C]

Looking for a company able to machine a pair of aluminium heads for a V6, two valves per cylinder, displacement circa three litre, not really an Essex unit, Ric/ CNC dont answer our demand. We still have one in hands. Help appreciated.

[Gerard C]

Please feel free to move this question to Motorsport History if not relevant here. We're looking for info aout a Triumph Spitfire "6" during the Tenth Rand Daily Mail nine hour endurance race, 4th Nov 1967, race # 15, drivers David Edwards and Isaac Caudron. Displacement was announced as 1998 cc and three carbs fitted. Any help or, better, pictures and details would be greatly appreciated.

[E.B]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

Please feel free to move this question to Motorsport History if not relevant here. We're looking for info aout a Triumph Spitfire "6" during the Tenth Rand Daily Mail nine hour endurance race, 4th Nov 1967, race # 15, drivers David Edwards and Isaac Caudron. Displacement was announced as 1998 cc and three carbs fitted. Any help or, better, pictures and details would be greatly appreciated.

Pic of it on Racing Sports Cars. Only it isnt the right car! Its labelled Spitfire 6 with those drivers but it is like no Spitfire /GT6 I have seen and looks like it has a #16 on it. Looks like a Porsche 906 to me!

Not much help.
Link to pic: https://www.racingsportscars.com/pho...-11-04-015.jpg

[Gerard C]

Of course it helps, everything's fine but the picture showing as you say a Carrera 6! Lap time was 1'44"026 and those two gents are registered as brits coming from salisbury. We suspect the car was a roadster and not a GT6 but nobody can say for sure atm. Or was it a Le Mans replica?

[Gerard C]

I think the 906 was pedaled by Tony Dean (GB) and Basil van Rooyen, finishing 4th and 1st in class. Did you see the number of spectators: 80 000 ??

[grantp]

A short amateur video of aspects of the Kyalami event in '67

https://youtu.be/ibzWgGI7Xz8

I think I spotted 2 red Spitfire like cars. One looked like a hardtop, the other a soft top.

Either might be something else.

#14 was Ferrari, #16 was a Porsche.

So #15 would have been in good company.

The Photographer credit on the RSC web site allows registered users to see contact details. It might be worth trying to contact them to see if they have anything else that might be of use? Or know of any other sources to try.

[Gerard C]

Merci beaucoup, grantp, who could imagine finding a film from this meeting? And certainly not on Youtube!

[grantp]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

Merci beaucoup, grantp, who could imagine finding a film from this meeting? And certainly not on Youtube!

Indeed.

It's quite remarkable what turns up on YouTube. Just a pity the converted 8mm film does not look like modern 4k video!

That said at least the colours look as vivid as they probably should.

I assume the race ran well into the night. Seeing the kerbs, the open pits and the mix of cars racing I think people must have been slightly mad back then. Especially the big teams on the international stage.

Well, either that or we are somewhat mad in different ways today.

I also stumbled across a South Africa Triumph owners club web site. Not very active I suspect but this page may be of interest for background info.


http://triumphclubsa.com/wp-content/...fire-in-SA.pdf

There might be more to be found on the site with a little more digging for specific information.

[grantp]

Re The Spitfire at Kyalami

The entry list only has one Spitfire. There are a couple of other entries listed that could be taken for a Spitfire given the 8mm film conversion. An Elan for example.

The drivers are apparently Rhodesian rather than South African.

The car (or at least a Spitfire with the same drivers listed) was also entered for 1966 entered but not raced. A different entrant for that year. (See Racing Sportscars site)

Pictures of a couple of Rhodesian Spitfires here: No link to Kyalami though.

https://classiccarsinrhodesia.co.za/MR_Peter_Cox.html

https://classiccarsinrhodesia.co.za/...Kennerley.html

There are also some photos somewhere in that site that suggest the driver Codron was still racing in full race sport cars in the early '70s.

[Gerard C]

Fantastic, great links, thanks a lot! Have some home work for now but if you find any other info, please…

[Mike Harte]

Having gorged myself with the racing over this long weekend, I am still curious why a green flag is waved around the circuit when the cars are on their warm up lap prior to the start of the race, and especially so when they are required to follow the safety car to the grid. To me. it seems counter-intuitive.

My logical thought is that it should be a waved yellow, as in a safety car period.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Having gorged myself with the racing over this long weekend, I am still curious why a green flag is waved around the circuit when the cars are on their warm up lap prior to the start of the race, and especially so when they are required to follow the safety car to the grid. To me. it seems counter-intuitive.

My logical thought is that it should be a waved yellow, as in a safety car period.

I think the explanation is that the green flag indicates to the driver that the track is clear.

During a race, that means the end of yellow flag restrictions. On the 'green flag lap', it means there are no hazards ahead.

[Peter Mallett]

Anybody know why the latest covid variant is called Delta?

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

I think the explanation is that the green flag indicates to the driver that the track is clear.

During a race, that means the end of yellow flag restrictions. On the 'green flag lap', it means there are no hazards ahead.

In a standing start you have a green flag lap after forming on the grid, at the end of that lap you get 30secs, 10 secs and five secs boards, then the red lights go out. The rolling start is simply the green flag lap and as long as they are waving, you know the race will start.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

Fantastic, great links, thanks a lot! Have some home work for now but if you find any other info, please…

Gerard,

On the Rhodesia site with the list if photos from various sources, one of the photo sources is named as Gary Critcher.

Presumably this is the same Gary Critcher who is known about these parts and is an occasional poster. It appears he has links to Rhodesia back in the 1960s.

It's a long shot but he may have some relevant information or, possibly, know someone else with relevant information.

A search of Tenths for "Gary Critcher" turns up a number of interesting references. I have no idea which might be the most productive to read in terms of your requirements.

Iain R and Alan Morgan may be able to add more useful comments.

[Tel 911S]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Anybody know why the latest covid variant is called Delta?

It is possible that they are having a go at someone around here ,
but I also heard that it is non PC & WAYCISST to name it after an area it comes from , so they are using the Greek Alphabet for the different variations .

[Peter Mallett]

Yes of course Kent is a Greek character.

[dwh43scale]

Originally Posted by grantp

Gerard,

On the Rhodesia site with the list if photos from various sources, one of the photo sources is named as Gary Critcher.

Presumably this is the same Gary Critcher who is known about these parts and is an occasional poster. It appears he has links to Rhodesia back in the 1960s.

It's a long shot but he may have some relevant information or, possibly, know someone else with relevant information.

A search of Tenths for "Gary Critcher" turns up a number of interesting references. I have no idea which might be the most productive to read in terms of your requirements.

Iain R and Alan Morgan may be able to add more useful comments.

I suspect the same Gary Critcher can be found on Twitter as @tyrrell005 and on the web at shutterandspeed.com