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26 Feb 2004, 09:40 (Ref:886001)
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Racer
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 233
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Toyota, Coulthard and Schumacher
I read recently that Ralf and David will be fighting for a seat next to christiano da matta at toyota in 2005. Has anyone else heard about this and is it possible to happen?
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Fortune Favours the Brave 
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26 Feb 2004, 10:35 (Ref:886055)
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#2 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,370
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Hmm, a queue forms for those who want to get whipped by Cristiano.
Last edited by Mattracer; 26 Feb 2004 at 10:36. |
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__________________
Holden- How One Legendary Driver Earned Nine Permanent circuits- the life blood of motorsport
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26 Feb 2004, 11:08 (Ref:886095)
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#3 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 639
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Hmm old news
The Grumpy1 |
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26 Feb 2004, 11:11 (Ref:886100)
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#4 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 729
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Please not Coulthard, PLEASE. Ralf's better in my opinion, and I don't rate him much.
Stick with Chris and shoe in Briscoe or Dixon. That'd be dynamite. |
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Gawky supermodels may look stunning in the right clothes, on the right catwalk, in the right city, but in an M&S jumper, on a crowded street, on a wet Wednesday afternoon, only classic good looks will catch the eye. - Ian Eveleigh.
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26 Feb 2004, 11:23 (Ref:886116)
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#5 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,707
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i'd prefer to see someone new alongside Da Matta, but if it means another seat is freed at Williams for Button then Ralf can go, and i'd think we'd truly see how good he is.
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"If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now" Douglas Adams. 1952-2001
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26 Feb 2004, 11:40 (Ref:886127)
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#6 | ||
 Race OfficialVeteran
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 15,722
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My money's on Dixon.....if he wins Indy 500 and/or IRL again.
Or, they'll sign some current F1 driver who is either: a/ overrated or b/ a has been Hmmmmmm, i reckon there's at least two candidates there? 
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"Double Kidney Guv'nah?" "No thanks George they're still wavin a white flag!"
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26 Feb 2004, 11:48 (Ref:886134)
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#7 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 13,000
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Why all the negativity surrounding these two. Both have proven experience of developing good cars, and know how to gel a team to move up the gri. Their salaries will be no object to Toyota either. Unless da Matta shws signs of beign able to lead the team, pairing him up with a rookie would be disasterous. Dixon is best kept in the IRL, even in CART his best displays were on ovals. New Zealand isn't even a huge market, so commercial factors don't make him a wise choice.
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26 Feb 2004, 12:21 (Ref:886171)
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Race Official Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 15,722
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I wasn't singling anyone out in particular but i take your point about experience of development.
However, the donkey work has been pretty much done now. What Toyota will need and i suspect be wanting a couple of drivers who will give it their all and be quick consistently. It would be better to offer the 2nd car to a newer driver with potential, rather than take on an experienced guy who the management may know won't exactly set the world alight. Giving one of the more senior members of their 'academy' a chance would be good. Unless Da Matta flops this year he will remain and if he does well, which he is showing signs that he may well do, then he may well become the 'no 1'. In fairness, Toyota are not far away now and i think they'd be better off signing either a real ace ( not another seasoned pro) or a coming man who is recognized. They wouldn't pick Dixon on his nationality, they'd pick him cos he's on their books and is pretty well known in the States, which is where their big market is. |
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"Double Kidney Guv'nah?" "No thanks George they're still wavin a white flag!"
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26 Feb 2004, 12:32 (Ref:886182)
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#9 | ||
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Subscriber
Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 4,304
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Surely the issue for Toyota is to get the car on the pace before they need to look too much at driver line up's.
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'I've seen it, but still don't believe it.....'
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26 Feb 2004, 12:35 (Ref:886188)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,294
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Quote:
 DC would seem like a good choice. Years of work at McLaren would make him a good choice as a veteran team-mate, much like Panis. But Toyota may want to plump for youth over experience with their next driver change. I hear Briscoe's name being called.... As for Ralf, ugh... |
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Sunderland Til I Die!
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26 Feb 2004, 12:56 (Ref:886226)
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#11 | ||
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Race Official Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 15,722
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Um, no point having another seasoned campaigner in the team. The car is probably near enough to pace as it is but needs someone really quick to pedal it and start probing that limit.
Da Matta might be able to do that. DC has had his chance and he isn't consistently quick. Toyota have done the groundwork, they don't need another experienced guy. only reason they could possibly want RS or DC is for a little bit of profile, eg McLaren always had to have 'name' drivers in their team wherever possible, but aren't so fussed about that anymore. Briscoe is in frame i guess but from what i've seen Toyota had to re-establish him in F3 before he started to show some form and pound for pound i don't think he's as good as Dixon. Scott reminds me of Greg Moore for his pace, and Prost for his cool head (Kanaan shunt aside!) PS See the newspaper quote on the Antipodean drivers thread. If Scott isn't signed up to race an F1 car next year it won't be because he hasn't got the talent or potential, but we'll see |
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"Double Kidney Guv'nah?" "No thanks George they're still wavin a white flag!"
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26 Feb 2004, 15:09 (Ref:886353)
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#12 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 2,986
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Toyota needs a good car more than they need great drivers. I think everyone is going to be shocked how much off the pace they will be this year. In testing they have been very poor, even with the "best motor in F1". I would go with DC. He has his moments but he has years of experience and is a better racer than RS.
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Eventually we learn
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26 Feb 2004, 15:18 (Ref:886360)
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#13 | ||
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Racer
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 161
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If Toyota start to show the promise early this season that I was expecting from them last year, they might find themselves a Japanese driver to give their home fans something to cheer about.
As a part timer I have been away, now having read through a lot of the forum it seems that Panis has been well and truly written off according to peoples opinions, but he is still the one with the experience. |
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26 Feb 2004, 22:55 (Ref:886808)
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#14 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 531
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They need a driver who has experience of developing and setting up a championship winning car, they need coultard. But they will probably get shue lite 'cause hes German
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27 Feb 2004, 06:53 (Ref:887003)
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#15 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 4,744
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Ralf vs. DC? Let's have a poll to see if anyone thinks that qualifies as a fight.
 I think the question has to be asked, why not Panis? Everyone would agree that he's done quiet well at Toyota. He might be old, but he really seems to want to continue to drive and he's not slowing down. F1 drivers don't seem to get "too old" now adays, they quit before then.PS. If one more person posts about Dixon I'll.... |
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No Rotor, No Motor.
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27 Feb 2004, 09:31 (Ref:887108)
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#16 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 2,147
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You think they might get Jos Verstappen?
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27 Feb 2004, 11:53 (Ref:887235)
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#17 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 13,000
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Jos? Not if they have any sense. DC, Ralf and Panis are all better in virtually every respect, and money is no object for Toyota.
Neil, they certainly haven't made any major impact in testing, but then neither have Jaguar or the non-works teams. It could be that the top 5 teams are very much clear of the rest this year. |
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27 Feb 2004, 11:59 (Ref:887240)
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#18 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,196
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Lets see...
da Matta for about $2-3m and rapidly improving Briscoe or Courtney for about $1m maybe and ?? Jos for $0 and 0 performance DC for $8.5m and mediocre RS for $15m and mediocre ...is this decision easy or what? |
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"You can get lucky and win one championship but not two ..." Jamie Whincup. I wonder which person with the initials RK he was referring to.
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27 Feb 2004, 13:22 (Ref:887319)
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#19 | |
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Registered User
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,661
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Please save us from the Briscoe and Courtney crowd again!
If Panis leaves, and I don't think he necessarily will, you're far more likely to see an experienced driver in the car. |
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27 Feb 2004, 13:46 (Ref:887342)
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14th
1% Club
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 42,474
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Quote:
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__________________
Seriously not taking motorsport too seriously.
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27 Feb 2004, 14:08 (Ref:887364)
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#21 | ||
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Race Official 20KPINAL
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 21,606
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Right on Adam. DC or Ralf is a fundamental achievement for Toyota. Months ago, I would say RB was the favourite for that seat...
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__________________
Show me a man who won't give it to his woman An' I'll show you somebody who will
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27 Feb 2004, 14:42 (Ref:887386)
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#22 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 13,000
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Purely rating Ralf or DC's significance to Toyota on the basis of percieved pace strikes me as narrow-minded. Their knowledge in gelling the team, car development, and race strategy (which was Toyota's worst area last season), will be worth its weight in gold.
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27 Feb 2004, 16:36 (Ref:887470)
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#23 | ||
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Racer
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 319
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Panis seams to think he is staying at toyota next season
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27 Feb 2004, 16:54 (Ref:887491)
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#24 | |
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Registered User
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,661
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Exactly. It's the old story - whoever is among the oldest drivers in F1 always faces the "must be retiring soon" claims.
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27 Feb 2004, 17:17 (Ref:887517)
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Race Official 20KPINAL
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 21,606
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Quote:
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Show me a man who won't give it to his woman An' I'll show you somebody who will
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