Dyson to Switch to LMP2 with Porsches???

[chernaudi]

And remember, the R8 in its resticted forms even, had no trouble cleanin' house-just look at Houston and Lime Rock. So what did everyone think that the R10 would do. The way I see it, if you couldn't beat the R8, what did you expect? Just take your butt whoopin' like a man, just like you did with the R8.

[chewymonster]

The diesel will always be more fuel efficient thatn the gasoline counterpart. Even with the smaller fuel tank, Audi will probably take a lap to the gasoline P1s at Le Mans, but there the diesel Peugeot will be the competition. In ALMS, there are only a few races in which fuel economy comes into play significantly at all.

[KA]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

And remember, the R8 in its resticted forms even, had no trouble cleanin' house-just look at Houston and Lime Rock. So what did everyone think that the R10 would do. The way I see it, if you couldn't beat the R8, what did you expect? Just take your butt whoopin' like a man, just like you did with the R8.

maybe the difference is that with the R8 you knew you were up against a better car run by a better-resourced team. With the R10, the suggestion seems to be that you're still up against that better car and better-resourced team, AND the rules appear to favour the damn thing as well....

Interesting thought, that we'll probably never know the answer to- how would the R8 have done against the R10...?

[chernaudi]

Well maybe one day some rich nut will buy one of each, and have someone race them against one another. Put the R8 back into 2002 spec., and let'em rip! I've asked this on a Audi forum, and the opinion is that the R10 will be somewhat better( improved fuel economy, and having a 3-4 years more development). I feel(and hope) that Champion Racing may race their R8 against the R10 next year( my chances of dating Cher are better than this happening, but weirder things have happened). However, that would be a sight to see.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by eddsc

"When the ACO published the regulations for diesel engines three years ago, I called them and asked if they knew what they were doing. I am not an expert, but just looking at the regulations I could see that, with the air inlet restrictors that were specified, you could have so much air going into the engine that you could have at least 800 bhp. And don't even talk about the torque!"
So who said that?

Well, I'm interested anyway..........

Sounds like Henri to me, but it could be Rob Dyson.

Can't say I'm too excited about this move by Dyson, although I fully respect and support their reasons for doing so. I regard this as a nett loss for the ALMS, and I lay the blame squarely at the door of the ACO.

[class4v]

My personal thought on eddsc's article with Pesca:

Interesting, the article with Pescarolo. But :

1. Les bleus is not what Pesca's team is called it's 'les verts'

2. What about the teams/manufacturers as Lola, Creation, Dome even Epsilon that have launched designs on closed cars? For sure it's easier to stay with a concept from people who designed something new(Reynard, Lola,...)that is copied with some minor development.

3. Technology is moving on... today the diesel, tomorrow the bio ethanol (some teams have anounced their 2008 projects) and very soon the hybrid technologies (some big manufacturers have had some meetings with the ACO about it). This all will cost money and teams wanting to fight will have to find the partnerships to compete and some did that just a few weeks ago (i.e. Creation)

4. Manufacturing and building technology is also evolving, we have to keep up with that and even initiate new developments.

I believe that challenges and new projects are the elements that move people, companies and organizations. I also believe (Creation showed the way) that all good teams have the ability to find partnerships that will help them in building packages that will do great. Yes, manufacturers are difficult to beat, but wasn't that always the case? And even if you can't beat them, why not joining them or working for them? The more manufacturers will be present the better it will be for everybody.
And what about 2005 when 'les verts' had their biggest chance to win as the ruling was completely against the R8 (LMP9000 version with private teams) but they failed?

[chewymonster]

Originally Posted by class4v

My personal thought on eddsc's article with Pesca:

And what about 2005 when 'les verts' had their biggest chance to win as the ruling was completely against the R8 (LMP9000 version with private teams) but they failed?

Yes, wasn't the Audi like 5 seconds slower per lap.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by class4v

My personal thought on eddsc's article with Pesca:

Interesting, the article with Pescarolo. But :

1. Les bleus is not what Pesca's team is called it's 'les verts'

2. What about the teams/manufacturers as Lola, Creation, Dome even Epsilon that have launched designs on closed cars? For sure it's easier to stay with a concept from people who designed something new(Reynard, Lola,...)that is copied with some minor development.

3. Technology is moving on... today the diesel, tomorrow the bio ethanol (some teams have anounced their 2008 projects) and very soon the hybrid technologies (some big manufacturers have had some meetings with the ACO about it). This all will cost money and teams wanting to fight will have to find the partnerships to compete and some did that just a few weeks ago (i.e. Creation)

4. Manufacturing and building technology is also evolving, we have to keep up with that and even initiate new developments.

I believe that challenges and new projects are the elements that move people, companies and organizations. I also believe (Creation showed the way) that all good teams have the ability to find partnerships that will help them in building packages that will do great. Yes, manufacturers are difficult to beat, but wasn't that always the case? And even if you can't beat them, why not joining them or working for them? The more manufacturers will be present the better it will be for everybody.
And what about 2005 when 'les verts' had their biggest chance to win as the ruling was completely against the R8 (LMP9000 version with private teams) but they failed?

Yes I would have to agree, this is supposed to be the LeMans "Prototype" class of sports car.

Now back to Dyson. Here is a blue and white liveried Dyson/Porsche from 1988.
http://www.racingsportscars.com/phot...-14-photo.html

L.P.

[eddsc]

I think everyone knew what was meant by "les bleus".
The words were from Norbert Singer, in Michael Cotton's excellent 24:16 book.
In 2005, Pescarolo certainly did have a speed advantage, but as he pointed out, he was let down by his gearbox supplier - something that can always happen to a privateer.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by eddsc

I think everyone knew what was meant by "les bleus".
The words were from Norbert Singer, in Michael Cotton's excellent 24:16 book.
In 2005, Pescarolo certainly did have a speed advantage, but as he pointed out, he was let down by his gearbox supplier - something that can always happen to a privateer.

Yep, any French Team are 'les bleus', even 'les verts'!

Thanks for the Norbert Singer quote, Malcolm. It gives perspective to so many of the diesel/petrol discussions on here.

[class4v]

I find it funny how "to be let down by..." is used nowadays by people who call themselves pro's.

[SALEEN S7R]

Well like it or not that is the case. When you are a privateer not everything can be done "in house" and you do have to rely on outside sources for things such as gearboxes and engines. Pescarolo is one of the most professional teams out there but at the end of the day they are still just a well funded Privateer team and ocassionally suppliers do make mistakes.

If you are a works/factory team if something goes wrong then you have nobody else to blame but yourself or the department that manufacturers the faulty equipment.

[eddsc]

I find it funny how "to be let down by..." is used nowadays by people who call themselves pro's.

That's a very odd remark.

Henri actually said this (to me), in July 2005
“I was annoyed because we told (the gearbox manufacturer) that there was a problem (in testing). The system was perfect on the other car though – and it was perfect on the #16 after we changed it. They came to the factory last week, and they think that they have found the problem."

So he spotted a problem, asked the supplier to fix it, was initially let down, then they did fix it, once and for all - but to late for Le Mans 2005. So he was let down. In what way was he unprofessional?

[chernaudi]

As far as the gearboxes go, VAG doesn't build their entire gearboxes in house. The Audi R8's gearbox internals were built by Ricardo. The Bentley Speed 8 and Audi R10's internals were by X Trac-who builds Pescarolo's trannies. And I think that the stock X trac casings for some reason are a problem, as the Pescas used their own gearbox casings in '06( but the same internals, and modified paddle shift system) that would've allowed them to do an R8 type rearend quick change if it were still legal.

And the Lola and Courage transmissions are horribly unreliable(especally the Courage gearboxes). Even Porsche have had some reliablity issues with their in house gearboxes. So, maybe teams building their own trannies themselves isn't such a good idea-in other words, build your own casing, and used someone else's internals. Seems to work for Audi and Bentley.