Could this happen to V8s?

[StuiE]

with the boredom of V8s at the moment, do u think that the V8 Supercar series could have a BTCC-style drop in numbers, and need for new rules to get the series back up again.

like cost cutting, less races, less mods, Future tourer sorta thing


anyone think this is going to happen?




* would luv to se the GT-R back, and it could get the car into Oz but that wasnt what i was getting at...

[Morris 1100]

I can see a lot of sponsors leaving because they are not getting the results, they may be getting airtime but not results.
Like K.Mart. Why sponsor a team that will never win except if the other cars of the HRT fail.

[upstart]

Airtime is results for them. But they would get more if they were winning.

[DNQ]

I have been waiting for the V8 Bubble to burst for a long time...

[touringlegend]

NOO!!!!! I'm just beginning to learn about the tracks/drivers/teams from the hour long coverage we get in the UK.

I wouldn't go into a panic just yet TOURINGLEGEND. V8 Supercars will be around for quite a while yet.

Adelaide crowd figures were up on last year as too Eastern Creek which had its biggest spectator rollup since the Triple Challenges of the early 90s. Phillip Island had some fantastic racing.

All categories go through a period where there is a dominating factor. At one stage it was Peter Brock, another the Shell Sierras, then the Nissan GTR.

Nobody complained when Skaife and the Winfield Commodore dominated in the early days of V8 Supercars nor when Glen Seton's PJ Falcons were winning, often getting a two cars on the podium.

Back then there was the PJ Dash which was designed to effectively get the fastest qualifiers off the front row. Without that, the domination would have been even more evident.

Certainly today's racing is far better than any in the past with 20 or more capable of front row qualifying times. Next year when the teams make up the leeway to the dominate HRT, this will become evident. In the past in Group C and Group A only half a dozen or less were competitive at the pointy end of the field.

[Amaroo Park]

It will happen and it will happen very quickly. There has to be a limit. I think the peak was reached last year and we are starting on the down hill run. The question is who is capabile of putting the brakes on

[Crash Test]

The thing is, that the last time a team won 7 straight races, the internet wasnt around for everyone to vent their spleen...

[racer69]

Originally posted by White Knight
Nobody complained when Skaife and the Winfield Commodore dominated in the early days of V8 Supercars nor when Glen Seton's PJ Falcons were winning, often getting a two cars on the podium.

If i remember rightly (probably not) alot of people did complain. Winfield was accused of using traction control in 1994, and in 1993 when Setons PJ cars plus other Falcon's were dominating, Holden jumped up and down and got the rules changed for Bathurst, hence at Bathurst the first 4 or so were Holden's.

I'm not sure that the crowd has much of a bearing, the BTCC crowds didn't drop that much, and it still went into decline.

I think a number of the lower teams will start to drop away, how many of them will see the point of the expense if they haven't really got a chance to win.

No Ford team has got it's act together at the moment, and apart from Castrol and GRM, there aren't any other factory supported Holden's.

I believe we are starting to see the start of the downhill slide, how long before the next major problem arises in the managemant area after what we went through with pre-qualifying.

Time to either cut costs dramatically, cut aero aids to improve the racing, allow other manufacturers (not just Toyota & Mitsubishi), or my favoured option, start with a clean sheet of paper with roughly two years notice before they take effect.

[Mr Squiggle]

The quality of racing must be improved or the crowds will simply start to dwindle.

Air time and brand recognition surveys are how major sponsors judge results, not necessarily track position. Sure it helps but the guy who DNF's in a spectacular way can be just as effective as the guy who wins!!

I think we are starting to see the decline of Cochrane's civilization.

See the other Mr Squiggle post for the remainder of my views.

[Josh]

HRT are just too good.

That is my answer for everything......

HRT Sponsors are getting good value for THEIR money.

[calais]

but the others arent.
thats the point!!!

[mac]

I can't see the popularity of V8s waning anytime soon. As far as I can see, there are so many Holden fans, and they don't seem to care if HRT win everything. I just can't see what you guys seem to be able to see. The only way I see your premonitions happening is through SEVERE mismanagement.

[racer69]

Which we have seen happening this year.

[M Power]

the quicker we get another top series THE BETTER .
hopefully with more MAKES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[D.R.T.]

Adelaide crowd figures were up on last year as too Eastern Creek which had its biggest spectator rollup since the Triple Challenges of the early 90s. Phillip Island had some fantastic racing.

Who told you about the crowd figures. If it was anyone somehow related to AVesco or 10, I wouldn't take em serioulsy.

[f1manoz]

V8 Supercars is growing in popularity, despite the boring racing resulting from HRT dominating.

However, the biggest problem in Australia is lack of money and sponsorship dollars. It appears that Australian companies are not always willing to sponsor successful categories of sport, whether it's motor-racing or football (any code).

And with HRT dominating at the moment, sponsors might walk, particularly from smaller teams, as sponsors DO prefer to see their cars winning. Airtime, granted, is good, but sponsors want to be linked with a winning team = a winning product.

[AdrianG]

Originally posted by White Knight
Adelaide crowd figures were up on last year as too Eastern Creek which had its biggest spectator rollup since the Triple Challenges of the early 90s. Phillip Island had some fantastic racing.

So in other words Avesco have done a better job of fiddling the crowd figures than in previous years!!

[Jack racer]

change is only good. Look at the V8 in Nz they where a declining in a big way then they change the class format and there is exspected to be over 30 cars on the grid this year

[andylynn]

I too fear the mismanagement of the sport. Lets face it,when they went away from the factory set ups,ie monaro,GTR XU1,GT falcons, At that stage it was easy to see what would happen. It is not now make/model against make/model it is bucks versus bucks.If you don't have the bucks you don't compete. I think we have all heard the phrase horsepower =dollars. the more you want the more it costs.I do agree the there has been different times when different teams/makes have dominated, but I still think that the current set up is better.We have all seen the tragedy that slower cars on the track cause.I think that the Holden versus Ford set up that we have now is probably the best set up ever.
I think that the current domination by Holden and in particular by HRT just reflects the money that the team has invested in it and enables them to have the best data info and the ability to lead with new idea's (the new wheel change set up,etc)
All it would take is a Ford team to get out there and get good sponsers to get the money needed to be able to take on Holden and HRT.Untill that happens I think the current situation will prevail.
I am a fan of HRT but I will admit that the current situation is becoming boring to watch.I don't mean to take anything away from skaif or bright because they are brilliant drivers and their team is a very well organised group.Lets hope the ford teams can come up with something before the v8 seiries becomes the commodore v8 supercars.

[racer69]

My only problem is the lack of passing and proper racing. HRT winning all the time doesn't bother me, they are doing the best job, just like Ferrari, Bayliss, Rossi and Da Matta (on the road courses)

That is the trouble with armchair critics, you do see more passing if you go to meetings. Having been to four rounds of the V8 Supercars this year, I have seen a lot of passing.

Anyway it appears that a few want to change the best show in town rather than find an alternative like going to a Procar or Power Tour event.

[andylynn]

Not trying to change anything ,just want Ford to be able to compete, they obviously need help!! It is obvious that some people are becoming disalousioned with the current HRT dominance.I am very happy about it being a HRT fan.As to going to races, I live in Albany Western Australia. The only chance I have to watch it live is to go to Barbagello when they are here,Once a year my friend, and that is a six hour drive from where I live.Don't know what those other events are,I have been following the v8's since peter brock was racing Holden powered cars.

[Dazz]

I think people are all too willing to simply say HRT has more money and no Ford team does so they will never win. There is more to it than simply money money money.

None of the Ford teams appear to have their priorities in order to the same extent as HRT.

00 Motorsport has the trouble of running 3 cars, one of which should not be there at all as it chews up major time and money for no result.

Dicks team just plain seem to have lost their way a little bit lately. I don't think it is money related to any great extent, simply not getting the car on the money quick enough early on in the weekend.

Glenn Seton's team have been fighting a losing battle for what seems like years now with more the management side rather than anything else.

Stone Brothers have just about got their act together, but Marcus has been very much alone in getting the results. David is doing better of late and the results are showing, but it has been a long process.

Imagine a Ford Team with the combined driving talent of Lowndes and Ambrose coupled with the engineering talent of the Stone Brothers. both drivers able to test and actually improve the car rather than just driving it around and around.

I think the fact that none of the Ford teams have had a pair of exceptional drivers and stability in both management and engineering staff like HRT has for the past few years is really showing.

I'm not saying that HRT doesn't have a good budget, but I really do think that all of this talk of money is clouding the real issues.

[andylynn]

I concur.I do believe though that the TWR teams which encompass HRT , KMART Racing and some of the others all share the same info pool.That has helped keep them in front to a degree with ready access to a huge data base of info for setting up of cars etc. As far as the Ford teams,oo was mentioned with Craig,many forget that he was with the winning team (HRT) and is no slouch when it comes to driving.
Using him as an example, it is quite evident that it is the Holden that is the superior car at this time.00 motorsport is a big budget team and Craig has had some near wins but when he performs badly,(which he didn't with HRT) he usually crashes or has some sort of failure,which also seems to be common in a lot of the Ford teams.
Dickie's team has similar problems with reliability as has Stone brothers ETC. Most of the Holden teams at whatever budget have also worked out reliability problems.I can not see why Ford can't do the same thing.