[WTCC] Race 1 & 2 - Curitiba (BRA), 1/2 March 2008 - Page 2

Fechna · 1 Mar 2008, 19:19 (Ref:2141705)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bramzel

I think Neve got training from Puig actually

They do courses together in 'Whine to talk us past BMW instead of working on the cars like they do'

I can´t stand the talking about "the pathetic frontwheelers"? Why are you guys so sure about, that BMW has got the best cars out there? They also tricked on the homologation of the engine, and really, the old weight difference between front- and rearwheel drive was IIRC 50 kilos in the supertouring era. O.K., the new engines have less power so they are more sensitive on weight, but no one can be so sure, that the regulations now are adequate.

We just don´t know how fast the cars would be, if they had the same configuration. And no one knows, if the regulations are really fair, because fairness is a quite subjective issue!

OJB · 1 Mar 2008, 19:32 (Ref:2141709)

Wasn't Menu's crash two years ago? I remembered O'Brien in a BMW doing a similar thing, so wouldn't be last year

OJB · 1 Mar 2008, 19:35 (Ref:2141710)

We have 3 SEATs, 1 BMW and 1 Chevrolet in the top five and the whole field (excl the Indy's) pretty close, so it seems like the equalisation rules seem relatively fair - at the moment anyway.

Anyway, Farfus will win R1 if Muller and Rydell's comments after quali are anyting to go by!

E46 · 1 Mar 2008, 19:58 (Ref:2141721)

I have to recognize my mistake about SEAT pure speed, at least in qualifying. Perhaps the tyres will be tha main contender they will have to struggle in both races.

Stefvh · 1 Mar 2008, 20:07 (Ref:2141726)

No, Yvan will win the first race.

stedevil · 1 Mar 2008, 20:39 (Ref:2141742)

Quote:

Originally Posted by E46

I have to recognize my mistake about SEAT pure speed, at least in qualifying. Perhaps the tyres will be tha main contender they will have to struggle in both races.

Well, those TDIs might really have problems with keeping the rubber lasting through the race in hot conditions. However, if it's a wet race my money is on Rydell. Then the TDI will even help keep the tires warm enough for good traction and Rydell is probably THE best driver in WTCC in wet conditions.

TIMELORD · 1 Mar 2008, 21:25 (Ref:2141777)

Theoretical best laps for each driver, taken from totalling their best sector times from all sessions so far this weekend:

Pos	Driver	Car	Sector 1	Sector 2	Sector 3	TOTAL
1	Farfus	BMW	27.814	29.328	27.096	1:24.238
2	Y. Muller	SEAT	27.881	29.306	27.144	1:24.261
3	Larini	Chevrolet	27.915	29.363	27.051	1:24.329
4	Tarquini	SEAT	27.922	29.269	27.196	1:24.387
5	Rydell	SEAT	27.909	29.369	27.118	1:24.396
6	J. Muller	BMW	27.803	29.323	27.285	1:24.411
7	Gene	SEAT	27.888	29.426	27.153	1:24.467
8	Huff	Chevrolet	27.961	29.389	27.138	1:24.488
9	Menu	Chevrolet	28.100	29.301	27.206	1:24.607
10	Monteiro	SEAT	27.867	29.494	27.255	1:24.616
11	Priaulx	BMW	28.035	29.378	27.316	1:24.729
12	Coronel	SEAT	28.187	29.503	27.093	1:24.783
13	Porteiro	BMW	28.094	29.615	27.314	1:25.023
14	Zanardi	BMW	27.990	29.572	27.471	1:25.033
15	Corthals	SEAT	28.231	29.743	27.389	1:25.363
16	Hernandez	BMW	28.321	29.667	27.579	1:25.567
17	D'Aste	BMW	28.366	29.904	27.465	1:25.735
18	Tielemans	BMW	28.357	29.879	27.691	1:25.927
19	Engstler	BMW	28.442	29.956	27.626	1:26.024
20	Romanov	BMW	28.849	30.307	28.178	1:27.334
21	Okyay	BMW	29.001	30.503	28.414	1:27.918

tux · 1 Mar 2008, 22:11 (Ref:2141793)

Menu has been admitted to hospital for precautionary checks, Will undergo more scans in the morning before being cleared to race.
All checks came back as showing nothing wrong with Alain.

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/wtcc...ter_crash.html

Hazard · 1 Mar 2008, 22:28 (Ref:2141814)

Well, grid for the first race...

Pos	Driver	Nat	No	Team	Car	Class	Time	Interval
1	Yvan Muller	FRA	12	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:24.295	0.000
2	Rickard Rydell	SWE	10	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:24.404	0.109
3	Augusto Farfus	BRZ	3	BMW Team Germany	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:24.482	0.187
4	Gabriele Tarquini	ITA	11	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:24.527	0.232
5	Nicola Larini	ITA	6	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	1:24.579	0.284
6	Jörg Müller	GER	2	BMW Team Germany	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:24.659	0.364
7	Tiago Monteiro	POR	18	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:24.730	0.435
8	Rob Huff	GBR	7	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	1:24.738	0.443
9	Jordi Gené	SPN	9	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:24.785	0.490
10	Tom Coronel	NED	20	SUNRED	SEAT Léon TFSI	S2000	1:24.987	0.692
11	Alain Menu	SWI	8	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	1:24.993	0.698
12	Andy Priaulx	GBR	1	BMW Team Great Britain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.046	0.751
13	Félix Porteiro	SPN	5	BMW Team Italy-Spain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.166	0.871
14	Alessandro Zanardi	ITA	4	BMW Team Italy-Spain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.175	0.880
15	Pierre-Yves Corthals (I)	BEL	23	Exagon Engineering	SEAT Léon TFSI	S2000	1:25.363	1.068
16	Sergio Hernández (I)	SPN	31	Proteam Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.721	1.426
17	Stefano D'Aste (I)	ITA	26	Proteam Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.806	1.511
18	Olivier Tielemans (I)	NED	16	Wiechers-Sport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:26.003	1.708
19	Franz Engstler (I)	GER	42	Liqui Moly Team Engstler	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:26.437	2.142
20	Andrey Romanov (I)	RUS	43	Liqui Moly Team Engstler	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:27.813	3.518
21	Ibrahim Okyay (I)	TUR	13	Borusan Otomotiv Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:28.412	4.117

Knowlesy, zip it about the diesels, you could always play a tape of loud noise in the background to make up the difference!

Jimmy Magnusson · 2 Mar 2008, 01:31 (Ref:2141908)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefvh

No, Yvan will win the first race.

Yes, and Priaulx the second, because he will finish 8th and start on pole. I also predict a crash in the first corner taking out a couple of cars starting at row 6 and backwards.

Bramzel · 2 Mar 2008, 01:38 (Ref:2141913)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

I hope Chevrolet and also Priaulx do the business this year.

I hope SEAT are banned for running an engine damaging to motorsport and its spectacle.

Rather diesel cars fighting than petrol cars driving paradelaps. Sound is so overrated...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fechna

I can´t stand the talking about "the pathetic frontwheelers"? Why are you guys so sure about, that BMW has got the best cars out there? They also tricked on the homologation of the engine, and really, the old weight difference between front- and rearwheel drive was IIRC 50 kilos in the supertouring era. O.K., the new engines have less power so they are more sensitive on weight, but no one can be so sure, that the regulations now are adequate.

We just don´t know how fast the cars would be, if they had the same configuration. And no one knows, if the regulations are really fair, because fairness is a quite subjective issue!

Don't put words in my mouth I never said. I'm not complaining about FWD cars at all. I just wanted to point out that Neve wasn't the only whiner out there.

Photek · 2 Mar 2008, 11:19 (Ref:2142085)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

I have done so.

If I want silent cars I'll play Scalextric.

Anyhow, back to the racing... Menu has shunted.

Funny, last year when the diesel car was running (sometimes) in the BTCC I thought it was one of the more interesting spectacles. Something very different about the turbo whistleing past at high speed and I didn't think it detracted from the spectacle at all.

OJB · 2 Mar 2008, 12:01 (Ref:2142113)

I think use of diesels is logical. They are such a big money spinner for manufacturers now that it was always bound to happen. It gives them a good racy image and they aren't half quick at the same time- SEAT would be silly not to.

Maybe they should put a little megaphone on the exhaust to see if it can extract a bit more noise, because I agree it does seem to lose something of a spectacle.

OJB · 2 Mar 2008, 12:12 (Ref:2142132)

Just watching warm-up times and Menu isn't setting any times - don't know if that suggests he isn't racing or the car isn't ready yet.

E46 · 2 Mar 2008, 12:15 (Ref:2142139)

Quote:

Originally Posted by OJB

Just watching warm-up times and Menu is setting any times - don't know if that suggests he isn't racing or the car isn't ready yet.

Warm-up is stopped, I hope it doesn´t mean other big shunt with other car severely damaged.

**FIRE** · 2 Mar 2008, 12:18 (Ref:2142142)

D'Aste has crashed. I think it was the same place as Menu.

Knowlesy · 2 Mar 2008, 12:19 (Ref:2142146)

Different place isn't it?

Blimey, you don't have small shunts at Curitiba!

OJB · 2 Mar 2008, 12:21 (Ref:2142148)

Heavy crash?

E46 · 2 Mar 2008, 12:21 (Ref:2142149)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

Different place isn't it?

Blimey, you don't have small shunts at Curitiba!

Really it´s true.

E46 · 2 Mar 2008, 12:30 (Ref:2142164)

D´Aste´s car hit the tyre barrier, car is damaged but it looks better that Menu´s one.

Hazard · 2 Mar 2008, 13:23 (Ref:2142213)

Warm Up Results

Pos	Driver	Nat	No	Team	Car	Class	Time	Interval
1	Augusto Farfus	BRZ	3	BMW Team Germany	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:24.237	0.000
2	Jörg Müller	GER	2	BMW Team Germany	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:24.341	0.104
3	Andy Priaulx	GBR	1	BMW Team Great Britain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:24.577	0.340
4	Rickard Rydell	SWE	10	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:24.713	0.476
5	Rob Huff	GBR	7	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	1:24.947	0.710
6	Nicola Larini	ITA	6	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	1:25.043	0.806
7	Tiago Monteiro	POR	18	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:25.046	0.809
8	Jordi Gené	SPN	9	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:25.082	0.845
9	Félix Porteiro	SPN	5	BMW Team Italy-Spain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.200	0.963
10	Yvan Muller	FRA	12	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:25.289	1.052
11	Gabriele Tarquini	ITA	11	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	1:25.311	1.074
12	Sergio Hernández (I)	SPN	31	Proteam Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.489	1.252
13	Tom Coronel	NED	20	SUNRED	SEAT Léon TFSI	S2000	1:25.510	1.273
14	Alessandro Zanardi	ITA	4	BMW Team Italy-Spain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.514	1.277
15	Franz Engstler (I)	GER	42	Liqui Moly Team Engstler	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.538	1.301
16	Pierre-Yves Corthals (I)	BEL	23	Exagon Engineering	SEAT Léon TFSI	S2000	1:25.683	1.446
17	Stefano D'Aste (I)	ITA	26	Proteam Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:25.698	1.461
18	Olivier Tielemans (I)	NED	16	Wiechers-Sport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:26.280	2.043
19	Andrey Romanov (I)	RUS	43	Liqui Moly Team Engstler	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:27.825	3.588
20	Ibrahim Okyay (I)	TUR	13	Borusan Otomotiv Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1:28.642	4.405
21	Alain Menu	SWI	8	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	No Time

OJB · 2 Mar 2008, 13:55 (Ref:2142242)

Menu didn't set a time because his car had steering problems - he should be out for the races though.

Knowlesy · 2 Mar 2008, 16:48 (Ref:2142339)

Epic fail for Chevrolet.

Hazard · 2 Mar 2008, 16:49 (Ref:2142340)

Pretty racy start. TDI's won over the BMW's, but they showed they can fight well.

Chevrolet's wiped out, Larini taking out Huff - not a great start.

Race One Result

Pos	Driver	Nat	No	Team	Car	Class	Interval
1	Yvan Muller	FRA	12	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	16 Laps
2	Rickard Rydell	SWE	10	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	0.763
3	Augusto Farfus	BRZ	3	BMW Team Germany	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1.234
4	Jörg Müller	GER	2	BMW Team Germany	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1.512
5	Andy Priaulx	GBR	1	BMW Team Great Britain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	6.747
6	Gabriele Tarquini	ITA	11	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	8.247
7	Jordi Gené	SPN	9	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	8.710
8	Félix Porteiro	SPN	5	BMW Team Italy-Spain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	15.564
9	Tom Coronel	NED	20	SUNRED	SEAT Léon TFSI	S2000	16.334
10	Pierre-Yves Corthals (I)	BEL	23	Exagon Engineering	SEAT Léon TFSI	S2000	18.035
11	Olivier Tielemans (I)	NED	16	Wiechers-Sport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	22.871
12	Stefano D'Aste (I)	ITA	26	Proteam Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	25.886
13	Franz Engstler (I)	GER	42	Liqui Moly Team Engstler	BMW 320si E90	S2000	30.859
14	Andrey Romanov (I)	RUS	43	Liqui Moly Team Engstler	BMW 320si E90	S2000	46.658
15	Sergio Hernández (I)	SPN	31	Proteam Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1 Lap
16	Alessandro Zanardi	ITA	4	BMW Team Italy-Spain	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1 Lap
17	Ibrahim Okyay (I)	TUR	13	Borusan Otomotiv Motorsport	BMW 320si E90	S2000	1 Lap
18	Tiago Monteiro	POR	18	SEAT Sport	SEAT Léon TDI	S2000D	3 Laps
19	Rob Huff	GBR	7	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	9 Laps
20	Alain Menu	SWI	8	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	14 Laps
21	Nicola Larini	ITA	6	Chevrolet	Chevrolet Lacetti	S2000	14 Laps

Knowlesy · 2 Mar 2008, 16:51 (Ref:2142342)

BMW seem to have done a good job with the new car, although it is a RWD type track which is helpful.

Heaven forbid they put a diesel in their car. Silent races, plus BMW running away.

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