Silverstone 24hrs Your Views.

[johndpeat]

Hi all,
With the new year on the way I just wanted to find out what you all made of our little 24 hr race this year.If you have any comments or suggestions about what you liked or disliked about this year please let me know so I can then pass on your Ideas to James.Like were the shelters worth while or just a waste of time?Would you like a hot drink brought round during the small hours?Anything like that.Then hopfully you can all have a bettertime next year.
I am not sure the friday fireworks display was needed so think we will give it a miss this year. Hope to see as meny of you as possible next year.

[The Fat Clerk]

I thought it was one of the best meetings of the year. I was only there from 8am on Sunday due to 'Clerking @ Brands' & with the date change, next year I'll be @ Oulton on the Saturday, but I'll certainly be back for more.

[Mike Kelly 1]

I have already been in touch with James Tucker to pass on my thanks after the meeting. I thought that the things that James and the EERC did for the marshals were great. Alright, the shelter didn't arrive till very late on the Saturday night (but I had just about dried out after the support race downpour!). The fact that we got a cooked breakfast and an evening meal on the Saturday and Sunday meant that I didn't have to raid ASDA on the way down to Silverstone. The free T-shirt and sew on badge were also greatly appreciated. Isn't it amazing that a club like the EERC can do things like that for the marshals yet other long standing clubs and series don't give us the time of day. For instance, what would it cost one of the factory teams in the BTCC to donate a couple of team shirts / jackets / t-shirts etc to the marshals raffle? I'm sure that the teams promotional budget could absorb the extra cost.

The hot drinks during the night might be a good idea but then the people on stand down (those having a quick kip) would miss out. Perhaps if the hot drinks were in a centralised place such as the paddock and down at Stowe then this might be a better idea. It also cuts down on having to drive round to every post with the drink / soup getting colder.

However, even if the EERC did just the same as this year I will still be going back.

Well done guys and gals of the EERC.

[PapaJuliet]

I agree that we should ditch the fireworks display - it got pretty scary at Stowe standing right next to the lightning conductors aka debris fence.

My initial thought was that the hot drinks brought round to the posts would be a good idea but Mike's point about them being in a central place could also work. I "found" a supply of tea and coffee in the Jimmy Brown centre this year but perhaps not many people knew about this.

The one big thing we need to change is to get more marshals. I thoroughly enjoyed the meeting but we only had three people on our post most of the night so the idea of doing three shifts was a non-starter. I don't know how many people were put off by negative comments and the memories of the LMES meeting but hopefully we can encourage more people next year.

I for one will certainly be there unless a threatened trip to Mongolia comes to fruition.

PJ

[snetmarshal]

I thought it was a great meeting, am definately doing next years (and hopefully will have some more of the snetterton folk to go on tour). Whilst there were very limited numbers of marshals everyone seemed to be prepared to do whatever and try and fit in with each other on post. Whilst the shelters were a bit late, it was a very nice idea.

only things I would change is the friday night firework display ( i agree very nervous standing near so much lightning conductors!) and prehaps update sheets could be brought round to posts so we know what the positions are.

happy new year all

andy

[schrammy]

Originally Posted by PapaJuliet

I for one will certainly be there unless a threatened trip to Mongolia comes to fruition.

PJ

Did'nt realise they had Motor Racing in Mongolia!

[Woolley]

My comment ahead of the meeting, and I'd repeat it now is to have a central food and drink tent for the use of marshals, drivers and teams so that they can all meet up and socialise between stints/after the meeting.

My only problem with the event is that it was the wrong date last year and will be again this year. In other words, it was a week-end I can't make becasue of a clash! Ironically, I could have done the original date proposed for this year and then it got moved forward a week. Ah, well, maybe next year.

[Don Truman]

I am sure James Tucker will not mind me pointing out that the BRSCC had a lot to do with organizing food etc and that we worked hard in conjunction with James to make sure that it was an enjoyable event and that MARSHALS were treated properly even though we had some great difficulties.
I hope to see everybody there.
Don Truman

[johndpeat]

Thanks to everyone who has replied so far.The more Ideas you come up with the better.They shall be passed on to James so he can sit down at the numerous planning meeting he will have with all the clubs involved and put these ideas follward.
Don't worry Don I am not trying to steal the BRSCC thunder it is just that James is the person I have the most contact with so I will pass on all the Ideas to him.

[chezza]

Well that was nice of them, shame they didn't do the same for the LMES meeting.

The only thing I would say for next year is to have a word with the diner about the times they are serving food etc...I nearly had an arguement in there because they wouldn't serve me lunch at 3 minutes to midday, but they didn't have any breakfast left so I couldn't have that. I only had limited time on my break, I didn't really want to spend half of it being told i couldn't have my food and watching it go cold laid out in front of me. Also people trying to get food at nine pm only to be told there isn't any left because they stopped cooking a lot earlier!

This year the t-shirt, etc were a nice touch, as was James appearing in the diner at breakfast to thank everyone. It was really nice to see and here the organiser saying thank you like that.

[Piglet]

Plan in advance, arrange facilities for Marshals in advance, communicate what is being provided in good time to enable people to make decisions about whether they wish to attend, ie. will there be toilets/showers on the camp site, is there a shelter from rain/sun/heat/cold open throughout the race and will there be hot food/hot drinks/cold drinks available throughout the race etc. etc. Then ensure that what has been promised is delivered. This should help deal with marshal number's which will help with the rota issue.

[Snotty]

One of the best meetings of the year I think because numbers were so low everybody just pitched in. Improvements? well, a few more marshals but that is not in your control, some sort of rest area for those marshals who have not got caravans - I was one of the lucky ones. We had four hourly shifts but not convinced that was the ideal solution but with only 4/5 on the post we had to do 2 on 2 off. The freebies were well received and welcome, and the only other thing I could think off would be maybe a few more hot showers.

Otherwise I would say James and his team did as much as they could to make the marshals valued and ensure that most of us will return next year. Looking forward to it.

[MikeHoyer]

There was a rest area, next to the media centre.

[stroller]

Originally Posted by chezza

Well that was nice of them, shame they didn't do the same for the LMES meeting.

The only thing I would say for next year is to have a word with the diner about the times they are serving food etc...I nearly had an arguement in there because they wouldn't serve me lunch at 3 minutes to midday, but they didn't have any breakfast left so I couldn't have that. I only had limited time on my break, I didn't really want to spend half of it being told i couldn't have my food and watching it go cold laid out in front of me. Also people trying to get food at nine pm only to be told there isn't any left because they stopped cooking a lot earlier!

This year the t-shirt, etc were a nice touch, as was James appearing in the diner at breakfast to thank everyone. It was really nice to see and here the organiser saying thank you like that.

As far as the catering facilites (opening times/availablity etc) is concerned, it is something the BRSCC is aware of (not just for the 24 Hours, but for other meetings as well) and I believe representations have been made to the Circuit. Unfortunately the operation of the catering side is outside the hands of Silverstone so we will have to see what is forthcoming.

[TheFlyingHaggis]

yep THE Meeting was the Best of the year and would second most of the other comments,one i would like to ADD [as PapaJuliet said], Jimmy Brown centre.
As being one of THOSE three mad scotsmen we don,t know Silverstone that well as the only other time we make the 8hour Drive is for the GP ,and these areas well[WE] cannot get into. A little map ,Direction would help us and others find there way round
ANYWAY WILL BE BACK""""""

[Paul Newns]

My suggestion is to give the Observers/Flag marshals radios. When doing both roles it is impossible to continue to flag whilst calling incidents in to race control. I felt guilty that I couldn't support my crew adequately by covering them with waved yellows if I had to ring race control, and if I couldn't ring race control I couldn't ask for a pace car. We have enough for the GP and other FIA meetings, can we please have some for the 24 Hours.

[Nighthawk]

Well i was Observer with a Silverstone I/O,- flags not needed,- and we both had a radio.

[Gridlock]

I was under the impression that all flag Marshals and Observer (In some case the same person) had radios but were told they were only to receive messages. In general the Radio information was good. There was only one major clitch I noticed during night practice. Car exiting the pit lane in the dark without lights. The observer at Copse Exit reported it and was told to clear the radio and leave it for the IO's to report. As the first observer past the pit lane exit was at Becketts he didnt see the car (No Lights). When the car eventually stopped by the side of the track on the corner, torch signals were given to the IO across the circuit but he didnt see these either or react to the message. Suggest that any meaningful and useful information provided by those in places to report incidents should not be admonished for making a report.
As I did the practice and the whole weekend last year I just hope there are a few more marshals attend especially for the practice sessions. Perhaps like some other meetings those volunteering for the whole weekend should be given some special consideration. I am still undecidede and will be interested in the programme before I commit. Certainly the catering needs to be sorted out.

[Pavaroti]

As it was my first ever 24 hr experience, it was the best race of my marshaling time so far. All of the facilites that were present were suffice for the limited budget that they had for the meeting. As we got fed and clothed the whole meeting was better than we could of hoped for.

As the only other time spent at Silverstone has been G.P.s in the past, the way that we were treated compared to the G.P. i would rather do the 24hr any day. Now for the last of my waffling i would like to say just a big thanks to all involved, Officals, Drivers, Marshals and any others.

Prior warning We Will Be Back...

[Shelagh]

Originally Posted by Gridlock

I was under the impression that all flag Marshals and Observer (In some case the same person) had radios but were told they were only to receive messages. In general the Radio information was good. There was only one major clitch I noticed during night practice. Car exiting the pit lane in the dark without lights. The observer at Copse Exit reported it and was told to clear the radio and leave it for the IO's to report. As the first observer past the pit lane exit was at Becketts he didnt see the car (No Lights). When the car eventually stopped by the side of the track on the corner, torch signals were given to the IO across the circuit but he didnt see these either or react to the message. Suggest that any meaningful and useful information provided by those in places to report incidents should not be admonished for making a report.

I allegedly spent most of the meeting in race control, but was on post flagging on Friday (including the "laser light display") so am aware of the "radio" problem. I have remarked on this on threads at the time - it was SO annoying witnessing dangerous driving (especially considering the conditions) and NOT being able to radio a report in - especially when knowing that the IO was too involved in the snatch/recovery to witness the transgression.

I realise that Silverstone have an ES team and there are some rules about their use of the radio. However, I do not understand how an IO can radio in with a message starting "Observer report" (as they did during the race) yet a qualified observer/flag marshal is not allowed to do the same "because it is an ES radio frequency"! It is the Obs/Flags that will witness the yellow flag transgressions while the IO is busy and, let's face it, these are the potentially most dangerous situations for the guys in the gravel trap. I am not recommending general radio reports re S&Cs etc.

I have (unintentionally) upset a few people in the past with my comments about "them and us", when all I was trying to do was to point out that we are all in this together. Come on Silverstone and stop being so "precious" about your blooming ES team and your blooming radio traffic/frequency. Are we not all about "safety" for both drivers and marshals and shouldn't we all be working together?

I will be back at Silverstone in 2006 - but only if I don't feel like a second class citizen. I thought those days were over......

[chezza]

So what if the driver in the car they ES team are attending takes a sudden turn for the worst? The IO cannot get through to call for a med car because the observer/flaggy is giving a non-urgent report over the ES system. Observers all have the use of phones to report dangerous driving/flag trangressions. At the 24 hour there were many IO's acting as observers as well...so are they going to take off thier headset so they can phone in a report and then put it all back on again, and probably have to deal with an incident in the middle of all that?!

The attitude at silverstone is no different to that of other circuits I have marshalled at. Wherever you get a group of people who see each other regularly you will get cliques and the such like. We try not to have a "them and us" attitute and many people that come to the circuit love it (What colour wigs you gonna have this year you crazy Scots peeps?) but there are a small minority of those from outside silverstone who refuse to let this subject drop.

[Gridlock]

Are you trying to stir the them and us thing up again Chezza. Lets have a Happy New Year there are enough problems without starting a them and us war?
Suggest we terminate the Thread hear and start as we mean to carry on in 2006.
Happy New Year Everyone whoever you are and whatever circuit you attend.

[chezza]

Hey I wasn't the one that started this...I am mearly stating some facts.

I have no problem with anyother marshal who comes to silverstone, This is only the start of my third season and therefore I wasn't around when this first kicked off. I do not think I am better than anyone else just because of the colour of my overalls, yes I am proud to wear black, but we are not an exclusive club, anyone can join and wear black overalls.

I have to say I have experienced hostility and been treated as an outsider at other circuits I have been too...this isn't just an issue at silverstone.

[Asp]

Originally Posted by chezza

Observers all have the use of phones to report dangerous driving/flag trangressions.

The big problem is that in a large number (if no the majority) of cases the flag point was no-where near a telephone. At Club I was lucky, so everything as an observers report was done over the phone, frequently not by myself too as I still had to abandon the flags to wander to the phone (someone else in the crew than manned the flags).
If I didn't have such easy access to the phone things would have been more difficult for reporting things, especially when the IO didn't see them. Problem is there's a difficult balance - you don't want to use the ES frequency too much for observers reports as it is an emergency frequency; but some things are important enough to need reporting: where is this balance drawn?

So what if the driver in the car they ES team are attending takes a sudden turn for the worst? The IO cannot get through to call for a med car because the observer/flaggy is giving a non-urgent report over the ES system

Of course, this can always happen anyway - one IO radioing through information on a break down when unbeknown to them on the other end of the circuit a major incident has just happened. It's just with more radio users on the same channel, the more likely it is to happen.

Maybe putting flobservers on a second frequency would be the best solution - but this would require the same amount of info to be broadcast on bother channels (eg. Safety Cars, running orders etc) to ensure everyone is informed. But somehow allowing 2-way traffic between flobservers and control is definitely needed, as others have stated in this post (unless of course we manage to have an observer by every telephone as well as every flag point manned!! ) Telephones can still be used if it's long and complicated to avoid tying up the second channel, but even S&Cs can be radioed in if a second channel is utilised.


Overall comments though - really good. the refreshments in the Jimmy Brown centre were well appreciated; as were the food vouchers; personally out on post I was really happy; and I will be returning this (we can say that now!!) year!

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by chezza

So what if the driver in the car they ES team are attending takes a sudden turn for the worst? The IO cannot get through to call for a med car because the observer/flaggy is giving a non-urgent report over the ES system.

Bike racing, & everything at Anglesey, uses radio as the sole means of communication. There's no problem if everybody keeps to the established protocols - in the hypothetical situation you postulate (oops, looks like 2006 is going to be a 'big word' year!) the IO would have to break in with an 'urgent' call. Of course, anywhere else it would be flobserver (nice word, Asp!) who was making the call for the medics, as IOs at other circuits don't have radios, so there's no problem for most of us.