Saloon Cars

[Crash Test]

Who here has seen a Saloon Car race? What did you think of it? Decent racing??

[Buckshot]

I attended both Rounds 1 and 2 of the Konica V8s Series and the Saloon Cars were supporting both events' (That's the early 90s V6 cars right ?)

The racing at Wakefield Park for this category became fairly spread out after a couple of laps but the races at Oran Park were much tighter. I'd put it down to maybe they all knew Oran Park and could give it a better go whereas many of them may not have been to Wakefield before.

The races weren't as close and competitive as say a Commodore Cup race but they were ok none the less.

Maybe the competitors are still sorting their cars out...Dunno.

[elephino]

Yeah, I've seen a few saloon car races (I know you've read me reports, crash).

They have potential. At the moment they can spread out a little too much but I think next year they will be as good with racing as Commodore Cup was.

[Crash Test]

Queensland is regarded as the home of the fastest Saloon Cars, and the last state championship race meeting was awesome. Big field, lots of overtaking, lots of action, and a bit of carnage thrown in on the side.

They are kind of like low powered Supercars without the aerodynamics. There still are some problems with the cars such as gearboxes, but they will be fixed in time. In such a short time it has attracted drivers from everywhere- karts, dirt track, all other circuit classes, especially HQs, the class it replaces.

These things will be huge in the future, trust me I was once very sceptical of the class its cost, but in the end, it provides a great product, that the mass of competitors love.

[marcus]

I saw them for the first time at Winton during the Konica meeting last weekend.

I had read about them in various magazines but didnt have a clue as to what they were ...and then i saw them ...the modern HQ's perhaps?

cars looked good ..my wife actually got into them fairly well as there was a few VN Commodores out there and thats what car she has..and they sounded pretty good as well.

racing was Ok and given time i think it could be a decent class of racing..

reminded me of the old production series ..when Mal Rose was right up the front of it with Kevin Burton i believe ?...sure we have GTP but people want to see road cars (Ford and Holden battling) the V8's are the ultimate but the saloon cars are more road based and lurch around and carry on and thats what people enjoy i liked them but would have to see more of them before saying yah or nay

[Mark Webber]

I'm trying to get some info about this class I wondered if anyhere compete or know about it .
I've noticed WA has a big local series but does NSW? or do you have to go in the National one

like
1. do they have a state series like a NSW one and does it have a site (not the NATIONAL one )
2. what are the running costs?
3. entry fees ?
4. other than MS what other media coverage
5. what are the est HP that the EA/VN chew out ?
6. rough build up cost


It looks like a cracker series but can anyone help me out

[Ross Cadell]

MW,

I have hust gone through the process of a budget and plan for this for a client and the best answers and idea I could come up with are

1. Yes NSW races about 6 races combined with other classes but should have around 20 cars in there own right.
2. The est budget for prep, tyres travel etc (total) comes to 32,000 for a big go at every round including two nationals so say $4000 per round.
3. Around 185-200 per round
4. Dont know much, gotta make your own
5. EA seems to poke a little more but will get back to you on numbers
6. CAn buy decent cars between 15 and 20K be careful as the rules have apparently not been strictly applied in regards scrutineering up til next year and some "quick" cars may find it difficult to continue. Have a new guy coming who seems to be on the ball.

I think for any young guy who wants to go V8ing in the future a big LH gearchange car at this price is not a bad option.

cheers

Ross

[Mark Webber]

thanks Ross . How do I find out more on the NSW series?

[Onlooker]

I saw them at PI and Calder and thought it was pretty good racing,at PI they had a field of thousands and raced pretty well,it is probally the next step up from HQ's if you don't go the Commodore Cup option,my only problem is it is yet another class of racing and dilutes the money that others would invest else where.Maybe if they raced them instead of CC or had a version that could race alongside the CC's it would make more sense.

[Mattracer]

Commodore Cup is to update models from the early VB/C/H/K models to the VS series and is keeping the 4.2L V8. Commodore Cup has had some really great racing- the cars move around a lot are quick and they look like diet-Group C cars without the flares. Still have the big bootlid rear wings. A great series.

[DAVID PATERSON]

I was sceptical when it was first announced, I thought, "Oh no, not another new class." I was also concerned at the build costs being quoted of $25 to $30K. Too high in my opinion, but now you can buy race ready cars for half that. Also, a positive outconme of Saloon Cars is that HQ racing has now gone back to what was in the first place and always should have been. All the cost no object/do whatever it takes heroes have moved on HQ racing is now cheap fun racing for genuine clubbies.

[HDTVKSS]

im in mourining over the loss of the early series cars in CCup. I fear that this change willdrive the class into the now defunct future tourers arena. And besides, those early commies looked gr8!

[Crash Test]

But what are the reasons for the Commodore Cup falling A over T?

[GTV27]

I've seen a couple of saloon car races at QR. They're worth watching. Look like they'd be a bit of fun to drive too.

[Saloon56]

I've seen them race and I think they are great..Cheap to buy $15000.00 to $20000.00 and fairly cheap to run.

[Crash Test]

Hey, good luck this weekend Gav

[Elwood]

Originally posted by Crash Test
But what are the reasons for the Commodore Cup falling A over T?

Crash

What makes you think Commodore Cup falling A over T? Those of us involved would say it's in the best shape it's been for several years.

The 2003 season attracted 20 plus cars every round and put on the category's trade-mark close racing - with the series winner not decided until the final race of the year.

The class is certainly not 'heading the way of Future Tourers' - the upgrade to VR-VS models is a necessary change to ensure the long-term survival of the category. HQ's and Formula Vee's were the subject of CAMS' beyond 2000 paper whereby they were told that no more new log books could be isssued, races to be restricetd to State level etc - due to the age of the cars.

Commodore Cup has been running for 10 years now using 1978-84 bodyshells, and now it is time to update the body by 10 years or so to 1993-1996 models - which will most likely be carried forward for the next 10 years.

Mechanically the cars are unchanged other than new front top-hats and compulsory power-steering (which was optional in the VH). All the major components simply swap over - engine, gearbox, tailshaft (lengthened 60mm), radiator, diff, fuel tank, front legs, shocks, springs etc.

There are 15 or so competitors currently upgrading to the new shape for 2004, and the Association has received plenty of enquiries for new competitors since the VS announcement - and why wouldn't it?

The car retains all of the VH's inbuilt reliability, performance and ease of maintenance, and looks sensational:





The 2004 series for both VR-VS and VH models will again be conducted at AVESCO events - with VH's still eleigible to compete for a separate trophy until their numbers no longer warrant it.

So not falling-over, more like taking-off we'd say. For more info have a browse at the Commodore Cup Website.

David Gittus
President
Commodore Racing Association of Australia Inc.

[Crash Test]

Ahhh, apologies for that. I think my head is still on top of the mountain somewhere, it's the FTs and STs that are being scrubbed from the CAMS rule book for next year... right?

[Mark Webber]

why did you guys go for that rear spoiler ? 91 VP supercar spoiler would have been a hit I think

[Saloon56]

Thanks Mark...I think a position in the top 5 or 6 should tie up the state championship for me.We have 18 cars entered so it should be fun.

[Elwood]

Originally posted by Mark Webber
why did you guys go for that rear spoiler ? 91 VP supercar spoiler would have been a hit I think

MW

The rear spoiler has been a pretty hot topic within the category (obviously everyone has their own opinion), but the biggest issue was that we had to come up with something that both Holden and AVESCO were happy with so that we didn't appear to be copying the Supercar look.

They have both signed off on this one - so that's where it will stay.

[Mattracer]

There were no problems with the front splitters? They look fairly similar to the V* Supercar splitters of the VS model.

I love the look of the car- it's sensational.

[Elwood]

Mattracer

No probs with the front - I think there had been some issues in the past with T-Bar type wings (F.T. & Brutes) so that was their only concern.

[Mark Webber]

its good to see you guy have put though into it but I think the VP twin side plate rear spoiler would have give your
cars a better look plus it works as the choosen one looks like a cosmedic one from the pics
Supercabs (holden ) haven't use side plate one for years so the link is a dead one

have you guys tested (on track ) different spoilers ?

its only a opinon

[Saloon56]

Congrats to myself for winning the 2003 Qld State Saloon Car Championship