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18 Feb 2016, 12:00 (Ref:3615713) | #176 | ||
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18 Feb 2016, 16:27 (Ref:3615761) | #177 | ||
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They were always a bone of contention from when first granted papers.The car was not available until sixty seven/sixty eight so how could they ever have been 'in period'.?
I understand that it was only after the constant badgering by one of the original specialist builders that papers were granted. At least Alan and Chris took the championship over here for two years running beforehand,in a squeaky clean car (as checked by the German scrutineers. |
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18 Feb 2016, 17:04 (Ref:3615775) | #178 | ||
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Wikipedia (I know!) has the 1800gt introduced in 1964.
Nevertheless this thread may help explain some things! http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=76394 |
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18 Feb 2016, 17:33 (Ref:3615779) | #179 | ||
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Just to put the cat amongst the pigeons, I do fully understand the need for cars to be homologated and for certain events to only allow in cars that were homologated in period but I do wonder whether there is a case for an alternative system to allow cars that were not homologated in period!
Of course, there would have to be some sort of criteria that set the specs to basically just safety items rather than performance items so as not to disadvantage cars that were homologated in period! Bear with me as I use an example - the Porsche 944 was never homologated for competition in period (with exception of the 220 turbo in to Group B) but it's disappointing that it can't be used now except in club events. The MSA has introduced a historic Tarmac rally championship for this year with age group classes for pre 1986 and pre 1990 cars. A 944 would be a great car for this series but.....isn't eligible! Tough, the purists will say, and I respect that but if there was a class that allowed cars like this to compete, but not for awards, then it could be a great way to introduce new people to the sport? As I suggest, cars would have to be specced with production brakes, dampers, power train etc and just stripped out to a defined weight and fitted with safety gear only. And probably run in their own class. Can of worms or a new growth category that allows in popular cars to compete that manufacturers saw fit not to homologated in the day? I'll get my coat! |
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19 Feb 2016, 05:16 (Ref:3615896) | #180 | |||
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Hmmm,anyone EVER seen a B registered one.? |
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19 Feb 2016, 06:55 (Ref:3615904) | #181 | ||
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I doubt the FIA would take anything on that site as gospel! Mind you, if they did, we could probably re-write history......
Sounds like UK Rallying is ploughing it's own furrow as usual. Stick to racing, sprints and hill climbs, where am sure a lot of non-homologated cars are welcome! |
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19 Feb 2016, 08:02 (Ref:3615913) | #182 | ||
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Most race series . . .generally referred to as club racing!
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19 Feb 2016, 08:53 (Ref:3615919) | #183 | ||
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The Marcos 1800 was announced at the Racing Car Show in January 1964. By the end of the year they were producing 2 per week. So the age is not the issue, but its lack of international history is. Wonder if this is a new trend for "tightening up" on past exceptions, so what's next? Maybe Richardson heads on Formula Juniors |
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19 Feb 2016, 09:01 (Ref:3615924) | #184 | |||
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Steady on with your suggestion for next big thing- their championship is FIA sanctioned! |
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19 Feb 2016, 10:16 (Ref:3615941) | #185 | ||
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Yes, of course, but I was thinking in terms of continental racing, for older cars such as the aforementioned Marcos, the Marcos 3000 and later, the Porsche 944, where they could race against cars of a similar ilk.
Plenty of people seem to want to race in Europe, but not many opportunities to do that regularly seem to exist for older cars unless they are homologated. |
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19 Feb 2016, 10:34 (Ref:3615945) | #186 | |||
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In many respects rallying is far more open and very libre when it comes to most events with often just 4 -5 simple engine capacity related classes and anything goes within each class, hence 2 litre Vauxhall engined sequential gearbox equipped escort mk2s competing against Darrians and Honda civics! However in the "historic" series the. Homologation counts just as much as anywhere. What rallying doesn't have is series for cars in age related classes like CTCRC Pre 1993 etc etc where sensible mods are allowed and similar (ish) cars can compete against each other on a fairly level playing field. In rallying it's either "open" or its "historic". |
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19 Feb 2016, 13:16 (Ref:3615985) | #187 | |||
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20 Feb 2016, 14:50 (Ref:3616267) | #188 | |||
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There are quite a lot of events in France which appear to operate on the American principle of if you bring a car we will find somewhere for you to use it. There's a single seater club here in Belgium that doesn't require FIA cars and I think there's a similar club for saloon cars. And there are various events in Germany for non-homologated cars, like youngtimers etc. The problem seems to occur when someone wants to hold a championship, that is when the FIA appear to be able to step in and force their regulations upon them. I've no idea how the licencing works when a 'foreigner' wants to join in. |
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20 Feb 2016, 18:24 (Ref:3616301) | #189 | ||
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back when I had the 924 I spoke to a few of the drivers doing the YoungTimer at the 'Ring and they all had FIA papers (and interior trim etc, they were more standard than my car).
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20 Feb 2016, 18:31 (Ref:3616305) | #190 | ||
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I'm sure there are club races/ series for mon homologated classic cars, Mike, but I think Peter may have hit the nail on the head below.
Interestingly, I was watching the "Legend Boucles de Bastonge (what used to be the Boucles de Spa)" classic rally live on Motors TV today and there were several non homologated cars competing, including Porsche 944 and 924S! |
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20 Feb 2016, 22:33 (Ref:3616358) | #191 | ||
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perhaps we should go rallying then Andy!
Relevant that next month I'm doing my first ever rally as a nav down at Bovington... |
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20 Feb 2016, 23:06 (Ref:3616369) | #192 | ||
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David, I've already sold my E36 M3 and bought a ubiquitous Mk2 Escort Tarmac rally car, albeit one with a 1600 8v Vauxhall engine!
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21 Feb 2016, 06:23 (Ref:3616416) | #193 | ||
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24 Feb 2016, 09:57 (Ref:3617295) | #194 | |
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I thought all Escorts had a 2.5 duratorq engines and 7 speed sequentials ?
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24 Feb 2016, 23:05 (Ref:3617515) | #195 | ||
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Most Escorts do seem to have Warrior, Vauxhall Red Top or Duratec 2 litre to 2.5 litre engines and 6 speed sequential gear boxes, but the really trick ones have 2.5 litre Millingtons, and all seemed to be described as "Group 4", even though that is a long way far from the truth!
Indeed the Escort folks get very irritated when someone points out that they are Not actually Group 4, and are modern technology facsimiles! As I said earlier, in rallying the rules are basically "open" in all but WRC , ERC or historic type categories. |
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25 Feb 2016, 06:31 (Ref:3617584) | #196 | |||
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25 Feb 2016, 14:53 (Ref:3617702) | #197 | |||
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Funny is that here in France there was what everyone called "the hidden warrior" Mk1 Escort RS2000, with HTP and everything. For years, people had been complaining that the engine wasn't right, that the pinto was over bored, head was not a holbay one and so on... Then came the checks in June 2015 after an organiser decided to have a look at it. It was all legal ! But people still complained. The real parameter was and still is the thing between the wheel and the seat.. |
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26 Feb 2016, 06:53 (Ref:3617884) | #198 | ||
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26 Feb 2016, 06:57 (Ref:3617887) | #199 | |||
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"Dont develope the car so its faster than you"When the car starts to feel not as quick,then develope it a bit further. |
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Living the dream,Chief instruktor and racing on the worlds best circuits-The Nordschleife and Spa.Getting to drive the worlds best cars-someone has to do it, so glad its me. |
26 Feb 2016, 08:05 (Ref:3617896) | #200 | ||
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