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18 Apr 2012, 16:12 (Ref:3061556) | #51 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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Actually a lot of the touring car boys now multi point the cage to the strut tops etc. So you can see the point. Also what if the rear stays are fixed to a bulkhead but the straight line distance is 100mm or less from a suspension mount?
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24 Apr 2012, 14:04 (Ref:3064903) | #52 | ||
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Quote:
Suggest that everyone looks closely at the new requirements within Appendix K as published January 2012, and take action now. In fact the actual wording in 5.13.5 which I think the above quote refers to reads as follows:- "Tubes through the bulkheads or attached to the body/chassis within 10cm of suspension pickup points are not permitted unless this is a period or homologated specification" (my italics and bold) This puts a different slant on things I think. However any compliance problems which are insurmountable are covered, ultimately , in 5.13.5 para (g) which states: "cars not able to fully comply with the above requirements may be granted a special dispensation subject to approval by HMSC.Confirmation of the dispensation must be appended to the car's HTP" Anyone who gets to this stage should join the back of the queue soon..... |
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12 Nov 2012, 09:41 (Ref:3165421) | #53 | ||
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12 Nov 2012, 13:41 (Ref:3165497) | #54 | |||
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HMSC being absolutely nothing to do with my company. HONEST! |
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16 Nov 2012, 16:44 (Ref:3167132) | #55 | |
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Hi, all A mate of mine is looking to put an appendix K mustang together and already has a suitable base car. We were wandering around a recent appendix K meeeting at silverstone and noticed a mustang running adjustable top mounts on the front suspension. I didnt think this was allowed, have I misinterpreted something
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16 Nov 2012, 18:17 (Ref:3167167) | #56 | |
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Hi Tazracer.
I think the recent silverstone meeting was either the Walter Hayes or the HSCC meetings. There are classes that can run fully adjustable front suspension ie HRSR. I hope this helps. Jim. |
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17 Nov 2012, 17:06 (Ref:3167557) | #57 | |
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No tazracer you are interpreting Appendix K correctly. Adjustable top mounts are a prohibited modification. If your friend used them on his Mustang then he would not get a FIA passport and therefore would not be able race in the HSCC Touring Car Championship. Are you sure you were at an Appendix K meeting not just a practice day as all entrants are closely scutineered.
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17 Nov 2012, 19:07 (Ref:3167584) | #58 | |
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[QUOTE=Relentless;3167557]No tazracer you are interpreting Appendix K correctly. Adjustable top mounts are a prohibited modification. If your friend used them on his Mustang then he would not get a FIA passport and therefore would not be able race in the HSCC Touring Car Championship. Are you sure you were at an Appendix K meeting not just a practice day as all entrants are closely scutineered.[/QUOTE
You seem very sure relentless. Are you part of the HSCC or do you race? |
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18 Nov 2012, 06:04 (Ref:3167735) | #59 | ||
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What if they are period alterations? Same could apply to many different makes,Ford,BMW for instance.
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18 Nov 2012, 08:28 (Ref:3167766) | #60 | |||
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Quote:
FYI, Quote from HSCC regs- "It is intended that the technical regulations contained herein represent a qualified and clarified interpretation of the FIA Special Touring Cars Group 5 Definitions and Specifications, as contained in the RAC handbook for the season 1966 chapter vii, pages 251 & 252." |
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18 Nov 2012, 09:06 (Ref:3167781) | #61 | ||
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But being "fia", anything goes,doesn,t it?
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18 Nov 2012, 12:02 (Ref:3167866) | #62 | ||
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18 Nov 2012, 13:08 (Ref:3167889) | #63 | |
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I used to race but now write.
If you look at the HSCC Historic Touring Car Championship for Appendix K and HRSR Cars 2012 Regulations you will see under Technical Regulation 5(8).2 Prohibited modifications: “that suspension components must be of original design ... The original pickup points and mountings must be used. The original spring system must be retained though the spring rate itself is free. One spring may be replaced by another but not by a spring of different type. The common types are leaf, coil and torsion bar.” Further Regulation 5(2): “If a model of car is Homologated then that car may use parts that appear within its Homologation papers up to December 31st 1966, and it may then be prepared to these regulations.” |
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18 Nov 2012, 14:19 (Ref:3167911) | #64 | ||
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For the record Warrens mustang runs as app.K
Whether those parts should be there i know not. |
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18 Nov 2012, 17:08 (Ref:3167982) | #65 | ||
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I doubt very much that the parts in question should not be where they are.HSCC are possibly the most policed clubs there are.
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Living the dream,Chief instruktor and racing on the worlds best circuits-The Nordschleife and Spa.Getting to drive the worlds best cars-someone has to do it, so glad its me. |
18 Nov 2012, 22:42 (Ref:3168145) | #66 | ||
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I thought the standard Mustang mod was the 'Shelby' mod where the upper wishbone mounting point to the fletch panel is lowered by an inch, I bet every race Mustang out there runs like that as its been done on these cars for years. Would that be illegal according to FIA?
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19 Nov 2012, 10:57 (Ref:3168409) | #67 | ||
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Al, my take is that it would not be allowed. If you look at the very first post in this thread Article 6.3.1 specifically prohibits the changing of mounting points.
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19 Nov 2012, 11:45 (Ref:3168424) | #68 | ||
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But is it not permissible if it can be proven that this modification was done in period?
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19 Nov 2012, 13:05 (Ref:3168472) | #69 | |
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easiest thing to do would be modify the homologation forms . . . . I've seen a few that literally have ( for example) 'piddly SU carbs' scribbled out and 'bloody great big webers' written over the top in biro!
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19 Nov 2012, 13:53 (Ref:3168517) | #70 | ||
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On the Mustang I believe the mod was standard on the Shelby cars and may well have been homologated I don't know but if so i would have thought the mod on a Notchback was doubtful from the factory. Its the same as the Guilstrad mod on the 1st gen Camaro (not required on the 2nd gen like I race as the factory did it for you) but I bet most of the 'legal' cars have this modification. Its all about lowering the top wishbone inner mounting points and is not easy on the camaro as the frame has to be cut and shut. The object is to give more camber gain during cornering.
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19 Nov 2012, 14:15 (Ref:3168528) | #71 | ||
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19 Nov 2012, 17:37 (Ref:3168626) | #72 | |
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I agree Peter, but who can prove one way or another. buying opinions from skint reiree's was fashionable at one point . . .
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19 Nov 2012, 18:52 (Ref:3168659) | #73 | ||
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I don't think it has to be proven, Joe. The mods allowed for App K cars are either on the homologation papers or contained in the overriding App K regs as shown in post 1 of this thread. Surely it is up to the entrant of any car running to App K regs to ensure that their car complies. If they believe ABC or XYZ applied in period they must prove it. It is not enough to say that this or that person/company cheated in period and, therefore, that is OK today.
It bloody well isn't! Sorry for the language - it get's me a bit hot under the collar. Last edited by morninggents; 19 Nov 2012 at 18:55. Reason: Language! |
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19 Nov 2012, 19:02 (Ref:3168660) | #74 | ||
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19 Nov 2012, 20:06 (Ref:3168704) | #75 | ||
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