Which way should rallycross go?

chris cake · 3 Mar 2007, 21:13 (Ref:1857385)

Hi guys :

Iam asking which way you think our sport should go in the near future?

Cryos · 3 Mar 2007, 22:37 (Ref:1857438)

Go euro regs, be the same as everyone else; Attract competitors from euro reg nations and possible get back erxc in uk/ireland

RampItUp · 4 Mar 2007, 10:10 (Ref:1857796)

Well for Euro regs to happen in GB then the organization of the GB champs needs to pass to someone else

schanche · 4 Mar 2007, 10:25 (Ref:1857808)

Full European regs Any driver from any country can then compete in which rounds he chooses.Will spice up various championships great for the spectators,Two different Championships working with each other not against! None of the my Ones better than yours! Its not all about one championship

.This will give us more rounds up and down the country, more events for drivers to please there sponsers gain valuable experiance to compete with the Euro Guys and most importantly Giving something back to the fans of this exciting motorsport ie European round which we all deserve.

zac510 · 4 Mar 2007, 10:43 (Ref:1857828)

clockwise, definitely clockwise.

Big · 4 Mar 2007, 10:57 (Ref:1857839)

For Rallycross in the UK to move FORWARD we need a single unified national championship

running to Policed FIA/Euro Regs.

How many of our ERC Round hosting European partner nations have competing championships/series running to different Regs ?

PhergAthor · 4 Mar 2007, 11:12 (Ref:1857851)

Euro-regs, defo. But don't throw away the mods or stockhaches, every national championship has a few unique classes. And one championship!

KA · 4 Mar 2007, 11:19 (Ref:1857855)

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhergAthor

Euro-regs, defo. But don't throw away the mods or stockhaches, every national championship has a few unique classes. And one championship!

Spot on- all a move to 100% Euro regs and nothing else will achieve is to drive more competitors out of the sport because they've invested in machinery that will no longer be eligible

If British rallycross is to have any international future, both in terms of UK drivers competing in the ERC and an ERC round in Britain, then we have to move to Euro regs, but in doing so, we can't lose sight of the drivers who have no aspiration to compete at ERC level

RXfan · 4 Mar 2007, 11:45 (Ref:1857864)

If we went Euro Regs just like that we can say goodbye to rallycross in this country.90% of our cars would become obsolete and I am sorry but past attempts at euro regs have seen little interest.Lets go back to the boom period of the late 80s early 90s, did we have Euro regs then?No yet we still had a ERC round and produced 2 European champions,and remember even then we only had 2 or 3 cars elegible for the old div 1.

Is our British championship struggling? No infact its stronger than its been for years and actually stronger than many other European championships.
If eventually we do go Euro regs would we need someone else to organise it?I do not see why.

Next have you all seen the 2 smaller classes at the ERC? They really are not that exciting and in some countries not well supported, actually look at last years championship and particually div2 and see how many drivers there were from outside Eastern Europe.

There is no reason for not introducing Euro classes into our championship and see what interest there is but we must not kill off other classes, the French have their own classes which are still well supported and of course the Scandanavians have the awesome Super Nationals a much stronger class than any of the Euro Reg divisions.So when we says lets go Euro regs we would be quite different to other European countries still!

To conclude yes to have Euro regs would be good if the Euro classes were much more interesting,maybe a breakaway euro championship would be a better idea!But as it stands there is little wrong with our championship at the moment but introducing div 1A and div2 classes wouldnt do any harm but I doubt would be popular with drivers or spectators.Remember there are plenty of other divisons of motorsport that drivers could go and do.

This is my opinion and I am just a mere spectator but I do visit events whoever is organising them and in Europe too, so I have no bias.

**Peter Mallett** · 4 Mar 2007, 12:36 (Ref:1857888)

Quote:

Originally Posted by RampItUp

Well for Euro regs to happen in GB then the organization of the GB champs needs to pass to someone else

Surely if the regs changed then the organisers would er organise the events to those regs.

**silver bullet** · 4 Mar 2007, 12:38 (Ref:1857894)

I have to say I fully agree with RXfan.
The only class that need to be fully compliant with European regs is Supercar/Div.1. Because realistically they are the only guys who would compete regularly in Europe.

If any driver from the other classes would like to try an event in another country, I'm sure there would be a class somewhere where he could be fit in. Likewise, If anybody from any other country wanted to race here, I'm sure we would find a place for him.

**Peter Mallett** · 4 Mar 2007, 12:40 (Ref:1857897)

Agreed, there is even an offer to Irish and British racers to enter an event in Germany at very reasonable prices.

banzooki · 4 Mar 2007, 17:11 (Ref:1858032)

Quote:

Originally Posted by RXfan

If we went Euro Regs just like that we can say goodbye to rallycross in this country.90% of our cars would become obsolete and I am sorry but past attempts at euro regs have seen little interest.Lets go back to the boom period of the late 80s early 90s, did we have Euro regs then?No yet we still had a ERC round and produced 2 European champions,and remember even then we only had 2 or 3 cars elegible for the old div 1.

Is our British championship struggling? No infact its stronger than its been for years and actually stronger than many other European championships.
If eventually we do go Euro regs would we need someone else to organise it?I do not see why.

Next have you all seen the 2 smaller classes at the ERC? They really are not that exciting and in some countries not well supported, actually look at last years championship and particually div2 and see how many drivers there were from outside Eastern Europe.

There is no reason for not introducing Euro classes into our championship and see what interest there is but we must not kill off other classes, the French have their own classes which are still well supported and of course the Scandanavians have the awesome Super Nationals a much stronger class than any of the Euro Reg divisions.So when we says lets go Euro regs we would be quite different to other European countries still!

To conclude yes to have Euro regs would be good if the Euro classes were much more interesting,maybe a breakaway euro championship would be a better idea!But as it stands there is little wrong with our championship at the moment but introducing div 1A and div2 classes wouldnt do any harm but I doubt would be popular with drivers or spectators.Remember there are plenty of other divisons of motorsport that drivers could go and do.

This is my opinion and I am just a mere spectator but I do visit events whoever is organising them and in Europe too, so I have no bias.

Ok i have been away from my pc for a little bit only to read what i think is total head in the sand iam allright jack rubbish!

This post only goes to show what some people within our sport really want it to become !80/90S !

Like most things in the uk we dont follow the euros and we only regret it later !

Div 1a is really good ok might be costly but isnt supermods at 80 k ?
Div2 well the new class looks and will be very exciting being 2 wd and rear at that .

As for BRC being strong well!

Buggies racing !

The only reason they are there is because it means extra £ in the bank to keep the whole thing from making a very big loss!

So lets not Keep talking this BS its all about £s

So do YOU the normal competitor really want YOUR track made into a rutted mess only to have your car beet up so you can say you was there ?

Whats next a fleet of autograss cars?

If buggies come in then perhaps i should build a Caterham!
Its an open wheeler but has mud guards as a Rage!

**Peter Mallett** · 4 Mar 2007, 18:08 (Ref:1858064)

Apart from using an entire quote to support your rant, perhaps you'd like to tell us whether its good to have ERC racers at Lydden?

Barrie · 4 Mar 2007, 18:14 (Ref:1858070)

Euro regs 100%, Div 2 is a bit tame agreed,but is soon to be replaced by RWD Rallycross Cup, I'm sure some of the Modified guys would be interested in this new class. As for Div 1A being boring, leave it out. Keep the Supermodifieds(Supernationals) as a support event with Championship status, and the Juniors.

banzooki · 4 Mar 2007, 19:07 (Ref:1858103)

Sorry if you think i had a rant but its only my point of view and fact!

Yes would be great to see Euros at Lydden .

The STIG · 4 Mar 2007, 19:18 (Ref:1858109)

Um... sorry, I'm a bit new to Rallycross. how does BRC compare to it's European counterparts.

Apart from the obvious "one of them is in Europe and the other is only in the UK" kind of answer.

chris cake · 4 Mar 2007, 20:01 (Ref:1858185)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The STIG

Um... sorry, I'm a bit new to Rallycross. how does BRC compare to it's European counterparts.

Apart from the obvious "one of them is in Europe and the other is only in the UK" kind of answer.

Hi Stig shouldnt you be on BBC2 about now! LOL

The BRC have regs which dont match with the ERC which is a good or bad thing all depends on who you talk to.
Perhaps some one else can say more ..

PhergAthor · 4 Mar 2007, 20:09 (Ref:1858196)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The STIG

Um... sorry, I'm a bit new to Rallycross. how does BRC compare to it's European counterparts.

Apart from the obvious "one of them is in Europe and the other is only in the UK" kind of answer.

Well, first of all, GBR hasn't got div 1a (Super1600). For the ones who think this is tame, well BS... then you haven't seen it. It is important to have this class as it thrives on the D1/supercars regs, making it an ideal step-up for D1.

D2 is dying in Europe, so I do not see the point in introducing it. It is to be replaced by the RX cup. RWD 2 liter cars. It's fun, and thus it's RX in definition.

Third, and maybe the biggest struggle for GBR, UK-regs still allow spaceframed machinery, group B cars and non-homolagated d1 cars. They are strongly outnumbered by the newer machinery but are still there. I think it should be discouraged, by giving them weight penalties that would make them not competitive. All in all UK and Irish driveres are moving towards euro regs already, but some seem to have little patience...

Moving to euro-regs shouldn't mean that mods / supermods should be abbolished. Like mentioned before, every euro-competition has his own unique classes.

Brittish RX is moving forward, but to say it's strong, sorry, Can't agree with that. To be strong, it should have stockhatch and clubmans RX on saterday and full grids of mods - supermods - RX cup - D1a and supercars on sunday. Without tricks like superfinals with mixed grids at the end to keep the action going long enough.

RXfan · 4 Mar 2007, 20:49 (Ref:1858247)

Take a look at www.rallycross.com/standings. This will give you some idea about the classes other European countries run and as you will see none have just Euro regs, they all have at least 1 class of their own.
While your their check out the entry for the first round of the Belgium series, hardly brimming full with entries.
Yes div1A is more exciting than div2 but in my opinion not as exciting as our modifieds but i agree it is getting stronger. The new div2 sounds promising and can only be better than the old div2.

Cryos · 4 Mar 2007, 20:51 (Ref:1858250)

I have to agree with phreg on all of his points.

I would also like to point out a few things also; Anyone who knows anything about how rules and regulations are brought into effect in championships knows that this is not something that happens overnight.

For small chances such as Implementation of Forced Rainlight Rule, this can be done overnight.

However a radical structure change to align to the ERC standards will take a while; you need to have a phased period in which you alow drivers to change cars in time. 5 years for example.

RXfan · 4 Mar 2007, 21:18 (Ref:1858308)

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhergAthor

...

Without tricks like superfinals with mixed grids at the end to keep the action going long enough.

Never really agreed with the superfinal thing myself but mixed grids at the end im not sure quite what your talking about and as far as keeping the action going long enough, many times recently things have got near curfew time.
I looked at the entry for the first round of the Belgium championship, seem you are struggling for entries in your 2 euro reg classes any reason?

**silver bullet** · 5 Mar 2007, 07:45 (Ref:1858667)

While I fully agree that the top division should be fully Euro legal, trying to bring in div1.a and div.2 would never work. It has been tried before and the take up has been very low. Group 'A', Group 'N', Euro 2000, how many cars were built?
In the last 20 years we have only had two drivers compete regularly in the second division of the ERC, Trevor Reeves and Richard Hutton.

If the ERC rules were brought in and the stockhatches were relegated how many cars would there be at at British meeting?
I would suggest, at best, say Lydden, 20 div.1, 4 div.1a, 6 2wd rwd, and maybe 6 or 8 Supernationals. At worst say Knockhill about half of those.
That's only a guess but I can't honestly see any more than that.

While rxie has a point about phasing in the classes over a 5 year period, how many of the second and third division ERC classes have lasted more than five years without being dropped, or the regs completely changed beyond recognition.

The two biggest succeses in British Rallycross over the last 20 years have been the Vauxhall Nova Challenge and the Stockhatches. Neither of which have had any relation to any European classes.

PhergAthor · 5 Mar 2007, 08:39 (Ref:1858705)

Quote:

Originally Posted by RXfan

Never really agreed with the superfinal thing myself but mixed grids at the end im not sure quite what your talking about and as far as keeping the action going long enough, many times recently things have got near curfew time.
I looked at the entry for the first round of the Belgium championship, seem you are struggling for entries in your 2 euro reg classes any reason?

Any reason? In Belgium, only the Flemish side does RX, we have only one track and we are smaller then Wales. Do not try to compare a small country as Belgium with the UK. The UK should be on the same page with France.

And with mixed grids I mean that a 1600cc raced a group B car last weekend in Ireland.

Chessmsport · 5 Mar 2007, 09:00 (Ref:1858728)

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhergAthor

Brittish RX is moving forward, but to say it's strong, sorry, Can't agree with that. To be strong, it should have stockhatch and clubmans RX on saterday and full grids of mods - supermods - RX cup - D1a and supercars on sunday. Without tricks like superfinals with mixed grids at the end to keep the action going long enough.

How many Div1 cars do you get in Belguim then??? Thats what most people want to see.

View Poll Results: Which way should Rallycross go?
bring in more classes.	2	3.85%
stay unchanged.	20	38.46%
go euro regs.	26	50.00%
Do something different .	4	7.69%
Voters: 52. You may not vote on this poll